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Tech Smoke away and Ex smoke toward tips /Capitalizing on Invisibility

kandehbar

The Gryphon
Alright First off what if NRS made it to were if smoke used ex smoke away in the corner you appear on the other side of the screen. I know this would be really good but i mean it takes meter and smoke bomb does not chip so its all good lol.

Anyways. Whenever I play smoke players off-line or on-line never see any of them use ex smoke away to get out of the pressure. Please correct me if im wrong but every time that I use it on wake up I go through everything and have never EVER been hit out of it.
Im gonna go on and say the its invincible on wake up and its COMPLETELY safe if you your holding block during it. - please correct me if im wrong

--->Regular smoke away is an excellent block string tool because you can catch block committed opponents with B2-3 into right after (wich is safe on block and leaves you with advantage)-Correct me if I'm wrong please
* B2 is his best normal and probably the best overhead in the game( its probably the fastest as well) the range on it for its speed is just unholy.

--->Ex smoke toward is good in block strings as well because yet again you can get a max ranged B2-3 out of it. I didnt mention normal because it doesn't go far enough and most times i get hit out of it.( you can get hit out of normal away but most people dont. You can also get hit at the end with a projectile but you can shake right when your out since its a zero frame move)

Now for Ex invisibility.
--> the only difference between ex and regular invisibility is obviously: one cloaks you and the other makes your really invisible.
The best time to use this(ex version) is after a knock down (preferrably after a B2-3 or an air throw). But you can also use this durring a projectile if you want to mix this up with shake. The reason why I believe this is so dangerous is because your oppenant is fighting a character with one of the fastest projectiles, the fastest sweep, the fastest teleport, the fastest overhead and a way to completly shutdown projectiles and now hes completly invisable? WTF!!!!!!!

These are the most likely options your going to force out of you oppenent
At close range: armored special or sacred stiff blocking
Mid range: If you conditioned them to the range of you B2 they will block high 6/4 time, But smart players will use a projectile since your reaction time for it is shortend do to the range
Long range: (If you conditioned them to projectile pinishing) teleport or wait for you to get close enough so you cant RESPOND to a projectile

What you want to do with the invisibility is make them commit to blocking low. Since your sweep is so fast and now its invisible the mind games full affect will begin right after you land a second sweep. once youve done this you can either continue to sweep or go right into blowing them up with 3-D1-2. I say that combo because the first hit will be block most likely causing them to think your low poking, the second hit is an over head..... GG
(dash back after the sweeps if your going to use B2 to get max range)

Bating an enhanced move.
Breaker is the invisibility bane because invisibility is all about jump starting or boosting your momentum. But you need to be smart to use this If your playing a reactive player the best option for them is burning the meter because most people have an armored ex special if they dont. Dont go invisable with they have close to. 2 meter The best way to bait this again is after 2 consecutive non comboed hit. ( casue i mean if you comboed youve done your job right). If you bated it correctly then most times you can punish with B2 ( Were talking at mid to close range) it not at those ranges punish with teleport and begin your pressure.


*** D4 can also be used instead of sweeps
*******THE SAFEST TIME TO USE Ex INVISIBILITY IS WHEN YOU HAVE 3 BARS OR CLOSE TO IS BECAUSE BREAKER IS YOUR CUSHION

*******PLEASE CORRECT ME FOR ANY MISINFORMATION I HAVE GIVEN.

Thank you and i hope we see more smokes maximizing the capibility with all of his tools
*I would post videos but i dont know how to make them with the good quality
 

arydious

Noob
Great post with invisibility. I don't use invisibility to much but i can see the potential in mind games. Generally if you go invis the people seem to have a freak out moment and rush in right away or they just block.
 

kandehbar

The Gryphon
thank you I use invis all the time and i saw that noone else was mindsexing with it so i was like you know what lets make smoke top tier
 
I'm not so sure that B2,3 is safe on block, much less positive on block. I'm sure someone who knows more about the frame data can clarify that better than I can, though.

Anyways, EX Smoke away is definitely great for getting out of pressure, and EX Invisibility is a good mindgame. The thing is, Smoke builds meter slowly, so most people save it for breaker or EX Smokebomb OTGs. Really, a lot of Smoke's EX moves have good properties, but there isn't enough meter to go around.

You also make good points about sweep/B2,3 mixups. Personally though, I would recommend experimenting with D4 instead of sweep. On hit it puts them in a stagger state without knocking them down (therefore avoiding wakeups), and the stagger gives you enough advantage that B2,3 or another D4 are uninterruptable. So on an opponent that likes to block high vs Smoke, you can hit them with D4 a couple times, and then come in with B2,3 when they decide that it's time to block the next potential D4.
 

kandehbar

The Gryphon
I forgot to mension adding smokebomb makes it safe and even makes it a frame trap ive edited the post with kt smiths video dispayling it.

Smoke meter gain is incredible if you play runnaway smoke - Smoke away/smoke bomb zoning or meditation smoke- dash cancling shake for mix ups

also- even though this is a bad idea 5 blocked teleports give you one bar of meter

See fleshmaster's meter building thread WHICH SHOULD BE STICKIED BTW
http://testyourmight.com/forum/showthread.php?9399-Building-Meter-with-Smoke
 
Though that was the original theory back when KT Smith NYC was experimenting with it, it turns out that not only can you jump out of the combo between 3 and Smokebomb, but a blocked Smokebomb is actually negative on block.

I want to say that i remember KT Smith NYC recently recanting his beliefs on the Smokebomb frametrap, after being punished for it several times online. He went on to say that it's better to hit confirm B2,3 into smokebomb, or cancel it into smoke away on block.
 

kandehbar

The Gryphon
alright i will re re edit the post ty. But i think B2-3 is pretty safe for the most part though ill check it out soon but i dont recal being pinished before
 
It's definitely a great string, and like i said, I'm not totally sure on the frame data (since data on frame advantage/disadvantage on block is scant). I think i heard that smokebomb is around -7 on block, which makes it technically punishable, but pretty much safe in practice. It's just that if you try to follow up the smokebomb with pressure, you'll probably get stuffed by the faster characters.

Overall though, I agree that invisibility is a mind game that is overlooked, and EX smoke drift is his best option for escaping pressure (since EX shake seems to fail against the most random specials, as well as low pokes). I feel like Smoke might have so much potential, but he's difficult to master because he doesn't have an easily definable mode of play. I'm hoping to see someone take him to the next level soon, like Aris did at Evo.
 

JHCRANE 14

GO VOLS!!!
Yes, Smoke's EX smoke forward and away are totally invincible during their active frames. It's one of the best moves in the game. PERIOD!!!!!
 

MKF30

Fujin and Ermac for MK 11
As a smoke player myself, I must admit aftera Knock down definitely USE and take advantage of the real invisibility, the Predator cloaked one is good too up close it's harder for them to read your highs and lows and sweeps are often good under this, it's fast and tough to predict while he's visible, so cloaked or not visible...well do the math lol

it also makes mixing up his jump ins fun hehe, always an edge to fight someone who can't see you.
 

kandehbar

The Gryphon
One thing i like to do when im invis is in a block sting i use smoke toward so they freak out and hit buttons and a throw an ex shake for the counter
 

G4S KT

Gaming4Satan Founder
Though that was the original theory back when KT Smith NYC was experimenting with it, it turns out that not only can you jump out of the combo between 3 and Smokebomb, but a blocked Smokebomb is actually negative on block.

I want to say that i remember KT Smith NYC recently recanting his beliefs on the Smokebomb frametrap, after being punished for it several times online. He went on to say that it's better to hit confirm B2,3 into smokebomb, or cancel it into smoke away on block.
QFT

Once people caught on they were straight up punishing blocked smoke bomb with attacks that were 10 frames and faster. So, I know believe that it is best to hit confirm into smoke bomb or do drift away/towards on block.

Also, KT is fine. No need to type out that whole nonsense :)
 

kandehbar

The Gryphon
But yeh i really belive that smoke can become top tier as soon as people start abusing invisibility correctly
 
But yeh i really belive that smoke can become top tier as soon as people start abusing invisibility correctly
He's already top in my opinion. It just depends on how he's used.
Smoke is technically best in the game. Quickest b4, quickest over head, quickest attacking teleport, a projectile that links into 35+ Combos and a parry. The invisibility links all this together into a complete mind f*** but with all these tools its not necessary to make him top tier.
Hes the dogs bollocks!! ;)
 

UsedForGlue

"Strength isn't everything"
Smoke is one of main characters, and I only use meter for breakers, EH Smoke bomb after my main B&B to push it to 50%, and EH invisibility. EH Invisibility is one of the key moves smoke has and is not used enough or at all by any smoke players I fight against. Good stuff man.
 
Huh? Can you prove it/anyone else offer confirmation? I'm unable to play at the moment and can't check. I thought only Reptile got damage boost on his invisibility :\
 

elamit

Noob
I'm not so sure that B2,3 is safe on block, much less positive on block. I'm sure someone who knows more about the frame data can clarify that better than I can, though.
B2,3 is safe on block (fantastic frame string).
B2,3, [smoke bomb] leaves frame advantage. Worked in the lab all weekend with him. :fight:
Smoke is f-ing brutal!