Should armor option selects be in the game?

[Goat-City]

I know they help balance some characters like Kobu Tanya, Quan Chi, and supposedly Tempest Lao, but should those characters be balanced without the use of option selects? From a design standpoint it really doesn't make sense because technically as long as it's possible you should be option selecting every time you block anything since armorable gaps open up a lot of times at certain specific distances with certain strings and specials that you might not know about, and that's not exactly fun gameplay.

It also doesn't make sense that there aren't mixups where the developers intended there to be mixups because of the ability to option select armored moves. On top of that there are lower tiered characters that are hurt by it too I'm sure. It's just weird for there to be a gameplay mechanic where you have to mash buttons while you're blocking just to eliminate some offensive threats, especially since it's hard on the thumbs to do a lot and very risky if you mess it up.

 

[kabelfritz]

i dont really understand what you are talkin about but imo option selects are always bad

 

[DDutchguy]

Yes because they help immensely to balance out Kobu Tanya.

From a design standpoint, option selects are not good in fighting games anyway. I find this armor option select extremely hard to perform (especially online naturally), which makes the Kobu-Me matchup about 8-2. I'd much rather have this option select removed and your example characters balanced in some other way that doesn't require this option select.

 

[Goat-City]

i dont really understand what you are talkin about but imo option selects are always bad

I'm just trying to give some reasons why it's not a likeable feature to have in the meta. It's not a fun mechanic and it doesn't sense. It clearly wasn't intentional either, so I'm asking if it should be left in anyway.

 

[BillStickers]

I know they help balance some characters like Kobu Tanya, Quan Chi, and supposedly Tempest Lao, but should those characters be balanced without the use of option selects? From a design standpoint it really doesn't make sense because technically as long as it's possible you should be option selecting every time you block anything since armorable gaps open up a lot of times at certain specific distances with certain strings and specials that you might not know about.

It also doesn't make sense that there aren't mixups where the developers intended there to be mixups because of the ability to option select armored moves. On top of that there are lower tiered characters that are hurt by it too I'm sure. It's just weird for there to be a gameplay mechanic where you have to mash buttons while you're blocking just to eliminate some offensive threats, especially since it's hard on the thumbs to do a lot and very risky if you mess it up.

IMO it's a bug that should be removed, but it's also a symptom of the larger bug that there are still insane hitbox issues in MKX that need to be resolved. Characters with DPs or fast hitting armored launchers (Lao, Cassie, Kitana, Jax, etc.) benefit a lot from this bug whereas other characters with weak armor (Quan, D'vorah) get rekt.

 

[lm Tweakk]

Option selects are braindead. It takes the Risk vs. Reward system out.

As far as using them against tanya , you shouldn't even need to. She needs to be corrected as well.

JUST MY OPINION.

 

[Somea2V]

Without even reading any of this thread and looking only at the title, no. Resoundingly no.

Do you know why? Do you know what a read is? Do you know what risk/reward is? You do? Good. Then I'm sure you can figure out why option selects have no place in a test of skill.

 

[Scott The Scot]

I think they are fine because the armour can be baited. It's not a bug or a glitch, it's just buffering an armoured move and holding block after it so that if there's a gap the move will come out. This exists in other games too. The reversal can be baited and punished.

It's like crouch techs in SFIV - a good tool to use, but you can be blown up for it if the person knows you're trying to do it.

 

[Evil_Riu48]

we need the meter drain glitch back so pepople stop mashing armor on block and on hit. it you try to go for armor at the wrong time you should lose a bar of meter

 

[Goat-City]

Without even reading any of this thread and looking only at the title, no. Resoundingly no.

Do you know why? Do you know what a read is? Do you know what risk/reward is? You do? Good. Then I'm sure you can figure out why option selects have no place in a test of skill.

I agree, but to be fair, risk/reward is still involved like Scott just said. You can bait it, block it and punish it.

Still though, it's not something the offensive player should have to worry about in some cases. Sorcerer Quan for example, since I play him, is highly dependent on being able to rune trap his opponent; however, in order to make sure there's no gap, there's a pretty tight link to hit, especially on some characters' hit boxes. So just to use one of your variation's essential features to its balance you have to either be unrealistically on point with your execution, or risk losing all your damage with the hope that they'll try to armor through an accidental gap so you can punish them. It already requires a guaranteed damage sacrifice to get it going, but now you have to risk not only losing damage but getting hit by an armored launcher as well. Not to mention the lower tiered characters who are probably effected by it too.

 

[Big Pampering]

we need the meter drain glitch back so pepople stop mashing armor on block and on hit. it you try to go for armor at the wrong time you should lose a bar of meter

Good idea, lets bring back the meter drain glitch.

 

[Wigy]

Its fucking stupid, very useful in liu cassie matchup. If he fucks up a jail, ex cartwheel, if he jails i block, if he baits im gone. Lol

But tbh, having goro risk free punish any time i dont jail is hella stupid.

Mk9 style u should have to release block and commit to the armour.

Its useful for stupid characters like tanya, but then its a bit like solving a problem with an equally annoying problem.

Its scrubby as fuck. They need to get it to fuck, i don't mind a large reversal buffer time but you should uave to commit to either blocking or armouring.

Anyone who has played sungod kotal will know my pain on this

 

[SaSSolino]

Yes because they help immensely to balance out Kobu Tanya.

From a design standpoint, option selects are not good in fighting games anyway. I find this armor option select extremely hard to perform (especially online naturally), which makes the Kobu-Me matchup about 8-2. I'd much rather have this option select removed and your example characters balanced in some other way that doesn't require this option select.

Kobu Tanya is a mistake and I agree, but option selects shouldn't exist.

 

[Wetdoba]

Option selects are braindead. It takes the Risk vs. Reward system out.

As far as using them against tanya , you shouldn't even need to. She needs to be corrected as well.

JUST MY OPINION.

This should be the only opinion. Option selects are dumb and remove the human element of fighting games. Suggesting to keep a braindead universal mechanic as a way of balancing a single characters braindead pressure is retarded

 

[STRYKIE]

Mk9 style u should have to release block and commit to the armour.

If you knew where the blockstun ended you could do these kind of armor OS's in MK9 aswell. There just wasn't a reversal mechanic to help the dummies do it.

 

[Cameronwinss]

Kobu Tanya. Bet that made you change your mind. Mhmmm

 

[Wigy]

If you knew where the blockstun ended you could do these kind of armor OS's in MK9 aswell. There just wasn't a reversal mechanic to help the dummies do it.

At least it was hard and you couldnt just be hammering armour 24/7

Didnt see people armouring out of kabals stuff much

 

[Sage Leviathan]

I main Erron Black. You already know my say.

 

[buyacushun]

If NRS could fix all the OSes and actually balance those characters, great!

But really I wouldn't mind if they left the OS and still balanced those characters too.

It can work either way. I'd prefer the first option but the game isn't ruined if the second option happens too. (Unless you play Erron Black lol) There's too much other bullshit going on in this game for armor OSes to break the camel's back.

 

[BigMilk]

In a game with ridiculous strings it makes sense to have gaps. I think OSs take away from the fundamental value of a game, however in a game like this where such high volume of guessing is required I think it's fair to have them as is

 

[Barrogh]

I always thought that gap position mixups is one of NRS "trademarks". I don't think that OS is intended and I don't think it fits here.

 

[Invincible Salads]

im confused what u mean by armor OS, i thought the OS problem was mostly fixed with the latest patch....what exactly are we talking about here x-x.

 

[Goat-City]

im confused what u mean by armor OS, i thought the OS problem was mostly fixed with the latest patch....what exactly are we talking about here x-x.

I should've said reversal option selects, but what it is is when you're blocking you can input an armored reversal. If there's a gap in whatever string you're blocking then the reversal will come out, but if there isn't a gap then it won't. The option selects that were removed in the last patch or whatever patch it was were offensive option selects, as in if your opponent blocks your attack then your special won't come out, but if it hits then it will come out.

 

[Asodimazze]

This option select should get patched out just like the others

 

[StealthyMuffin]

Street Fighter player: "He was mashing DP, so I stopped my pressure and got a full punish."

NRS player: "He was mashing armor, so I made a thread on TYM."

There is a huge risk to mashing armor. (unless your armor is safe, which is another discussion)

Unless you're talking about something else?