She's fun but is she viable...

[projectzero00]

It’s honestly not that bad. If they made the changes I suggested above, I think it’d be in the same viability.

Yes it is. As of now yes it is. It's slow, hits mid, has terrible hitbox. You just have to walk a nanometer away and you're good. It's mediocre at best for pressuring just at the corner (and that is limited to very specific strings) let alone freeze anyone. If they made the changes, then it would be in the same viability.

 

[Pan1cMode]

Yes it is. As of now yes it is. It's slow, hits mid, has terrible hitbox. You just have to walk a nanometer away and you're good. It's mediocre at best for pressuring just at the corner (and that is limited to very specific strings) let alone freeze anyone. If they made the changes, then it would be in the same viability.

That’s literally what I said.

Right now the only viable variation is her second one; but it’s not like the first one needs a whole slew of unique changes.

 

[JSF]

i dont think either variation is viable but ice machine is the best by far, she needs a lot of fixes though

 

[trufenix]

Ice Machine yes, the other one, no. Once she's fixed, Ice Machine will be a serious threat and the other one will at least be workable. As it stands, all the db2 moves serve zero competitive purpose and that ruins her full screen presence.

 

[JSF]

if they dont give her buttons and take some of her recovery away she will also be easy to hard counter with any teleport charatcter.
also for the love of god PLEASE change the input of her shield from dd1 or change b32d1 to just b321 it literally MAKES NO SENSE for this to be this way and i get shield at point blank range on accident a decent amount of the time

 

[Xzyj]

if they dont give her buttons and take some of her recovery away she will also be easy to hard counter with any teleport charatcter.
also for the love of god PLEASE change the input of her shield from dd1 or change b32d1 to just b321 it literally MAKES NO SENSE for this to be this way and i get shield at point blank range on accident a decent amount of the time

i never got a shield like that, perhaps clean your inputs or mess with control settings? Personally changing cancel delay to medium helped me a lot to negate unecessary specials and such. People downplay her way too much tbh, i like Pan1cMode points, and that's pretty much what i think about her too atm, although she can use more help than that - time will tell if that will be necessary after initial fixes and small tweaks really

 

[santanabar]

There is no reason at all ice bomb replaces her projectile. It should be an additional move, not a replacement, like you are trading an semi competent move for a shltty useless bomb.

 

[Marinjuana]

There is no reason at all ice bomb replaces her projectile. It should be an additional move, not a replacement, like you are trading an semi competent move for a shltty useless bomb.

The bomb is far from useless but it might be a little much to have bomb out and have a projectile that controls the air so well.

 

[xSkeletonSmasherx69]

This character is fine. They really need to fix some whiffing issues. They shouldn't change much she is actually pretty good.

 

[JSF]

i never got a shield like that, perhaps clean your inputs or mess with control settings? Personally changing cancel delay to medium helped me a lot to negate unecessary specials and such. People downplay her way too much tbh, i like Pan1cMode points, and that's pretty much what i think about her too atm, although she can use more help than that - time will tell if that will be necessary after initial fixes and small tweaks really

im not the only one whos had the problem ive seen others say it so its no a me thing. and when i chage special move input timings it messes other things up, also like i said IT LITERALLY MAKES NO SENSE FOR IT TO BE THIS WAY IT IS NOT NECESSARY AT ALL. So just change it. and yea pan1c has good suggestions but she needs more than that

 

[haketh]

im not the only one whos had the problem ive seen others say it so its no a me thing. and when i chage special move input timings it messes other things up, also like i said IT LITERALLY MAKES NO SENSE FOR IT TO BE THIS WAY IT IS NOT NECESSARY AT ALL. So just change it. and yea pan1c has good suggestions but she needs more than that

Please God clean up your inputs & stop double tapping

 

[JSF]

Please God clean up your inputs & stop double tapping

ive gotten button inputs for buttons i 100% have not pressed at all. like i said its not a me problem. could be my settings but its something that shouldnt exist in the first place.

 

[santanabar]

The bomb is far from useless but it might be a little much to have bomb out and have a projectile that controls the air so well.

Against who? when I see some gameplay against decent players I will believe it. And how exactly the projectile controls the air, if it hits only in one area?

 

[Vastly]

I think she is better than a lot of people give her credit and if she isn't completely tournament viable I think she is definitely a great counter-pick against a few characters. She is an incredibly hard matchup for Johnny IF the frost player knows Johnny Thoroughly. Her D4 in combination with the ice head ,her projectiles, and her great neutral range can keep him out very well especially if you know how to time everything and understand the simple way to block almost everything Johnny cage has.

 

[Marinjuana]

Against who? when I see some gameplay against decent players I will believe it. And how exactly the projectile controls the air, if it hits only in one area?

I'm not going to believe it's bad until someone shows me game play against decent players!

Because it catches you in the air.

 

[santanabar]

I'm not going to believe it's bad until someone shows me game play against decent players!

Because it catches you in the air.

sure dude... as soon as I find a frost player in a tournament i will, so far no luck, wonder why

and every single projectile in the game catches you in the air

 

[projectzero00]

sure dude... as soon as I find a frost player in a tournament i will, so far no luck, wonder why

and every single projectile in the game catches you in the air

It seems some people here are delusional. The fact he thinks she's fine overall and considers her projectile great air control pretty much sums up his knowledge of the character.

 

[Marinjuana]

sure dude... as soon as I find a frost player in a tournament i will, so far no luck, wonder why

and every single projectile in the game catches you in the air

I never said a word about her tournament viability but I'm impressed by your imagination!

And her normal DB2 is way more oppressive for catching jumps. Notice how Frost loses her anti air head special when bomb is out, and the vertical hitbox of bomb isnt't high. That's not coincidence.

It seems some people here are delusional. The fact he thinks she's fine overall and considers her projectile great air control pretty much sums up his knowledge of the character.

Imagine being this afraid of differing opinions

 

[santanabar]

I never said a word about her tournament viability but I'm impressed by your imagination!

And her normal DB2 is way more oppressive for catching jumps. Notice how Frost loses her anti air head special when bomb is out, and the vertical hitbox of bomb isnt't high. That's not coincidence.



Imagine being this afraid of differing opinions

Alright man, if not being used at all in tournaments in not enough for you, then i may ask again, that variation is far from useless against who? people who have no idea about the character? some sort or players that refuse to use the block button?

 

[Marinjuana]

Alright man, if not being used at all in tournaments in not enough for you, then i may ask again, that variation is far from useless against who? people who have no idea about the character? some sort or players that refuse to use the block button?

That's the thing man, I never said the variation was good, I don't think it's very good. I think it has some bad matchups. But the bomb itself is not bad, it's very useful.

 

[Wigy]

That's the thing man, I never said the variation was good, I don't think it's very good. I think it has some bad matchups. But the bomb itself is not bad, it's very useful.

You've been a big upplayer in the past. I want to hear the argument for this.

Wakeups in this game are silly strong. It's slow and has the tiniest hitbox and hits mid.

Also replaces her projectile which is really useful for some matchups.

Also uses TWO slots. Lol. If it used one and didn't replace db2 then I'd be okay with it.

 

[Marinjuana]

You've been a big upplayer in the past. I want to hear the argument for this.

Wakeups in this game are silly strong. It's slow and has the tiniest hitbox and hits mid.

Also replaces her projectile which is really useful for some matchups.

Also uses TWO slots. Lol. If it used one and didn't replace db2 then I'd be okay with it.

It's easy to think I'm an upplayer when you are a downplayer! Keep it to yourself brother. I'm not even saying anything controversial. I said a move was useful.

I'm talking tournament variations here. One of the variations has the move, and I'm saying the move is useful. I don't think I need to do much to show that the bomb is useful, it's pretty apparent. It helps control neutral in zoning wars in a substantial way and gives her access to setups that can pressure the opponent. It helps control space in matchups where the opponent has to approach, making her fireball game more effective. So what that it hits mid? What do we need, unblockable Cyrax bombs? Hard to blockables?

 

[Wigy]

It's easy to think I'm an upplayer when you are a downplayer! Keep it to yourself brother. I'm not even saying anything controversial. I said a move was useful.

I'm talking tournament variations here. One of the variations has the move, and I'm saying the move is useful. I don't think I need to do much to show that the bomb is useful, it's pretty apparent. It helps control neutral in zoning wars in a substantial way and gives her access to setups that can pressure the opponent. It helps control space in matchups where the opponent has to approach, making her fireball game more effective. So what that it hits mid? What do we need, unblockable Cyrax bombs? Hard to blockables?

I mean it gives up the actual useful db2 projectile. So that alone makes it a negative. It's useless for Oki with the nature of wakeups in this game and it's 1 pixel hitbox. Nobody respects it at all and why should they.

I agree it doesn't need to be a low or unblockable etc. Just that helps enforce the respect

In the midscreen it can be semi useful in some matchups but is literally entirely pointless in some matchups to the point you'd never use it. One step in either direction totally avoids it. Someone has to be really idiotically spamming to get caught by it.

Yes it has it's uses in a very select situation but very useful is really grasping at straws and upplaying.

We can agree to disagree. Though most people on here seem to agree it's ass.

Not sure what I've downplayed. But you were the one who said drunken master wasn't ass. Huge lol

 

[Pan1cMode]

It's easy to think I'm an upplayer when you are a downplayer! Keep it to yourself brother. I'm not even saying anything controversial. I said a move was useful.

I'm talking tournament variations here. One of the variations has the move, and I'm saying the move is useful. I don't think I need to do much to show that the bomb is useful, it's pretty apparent. It helps control neutral in zoning wars in a substantial way and gives her access to setups that can pressure the opponent. It helps control space in matchups where the opponent has to approach, making her fireball game more effective. So what that it hits mid? What do we need, unblockable Cyrax bombs? Hard to blockables?

It would be helpful if the hitbox wasn’t super tiny and it didn’t replace her normal db2.

Her chest bombs are super useful for controlling space and giving them up for the head bomb is a bit of a poor trade since she loses access to any of her head specials and normals AND to her main space controlling tool.

If it was super oppressive like cyrax’s bombs, I’d understand. But they’re just ok and honestly not much better than the default option.

 

[Marinjuana]

@Wigy I don't have anything to offer you man. It's a useful special move in one of the variations. I stand by most of what I said about Drunken Master, but it's extremely petty of you to keep bringing it up, to be completely honest.

@Pan1cMode I do feel that the variation as a whole is underwhelming, but I do expect hitbox buffs.