Match-up Discussion sektor problems

[smokey]

you guys seem to missing the point...

An agressive, up close Sektor is no problem for Smoke. One that turtles and keeps you at outside sweep range with b1 and flamethrower while walking you into the corner is a big problem.

You're actually right yeah i was missing the point!T his is hard to get through, and the best way for sektor to face smoke, so naturally this will be harder to play, but the same principles apply, except you need to think on your feet alot more, and not allow sektors spacing to get the better of you. Zipping around with smokes movement specials means that spacing goes out the window, but yeah i get what you mean now. I wouldnt call this "turtling" i would just call it "playing a bit more annoyingly to not get blown up by smoke"

 

[xenogorgeous]

you guys seem to missing the point...

An agressive, up close Sektor is no problem for Smoke. Up close they're about even.

A Sektor that turtles and keeps you at outside sweep range with b1 and flamethrower while walking you into the corner is a big problem.

yep, a defensive Sektor is a pain in the ass ........ even more if he does TU only in a while during the fight, making you trying to guess if he gonna spam it or not ......... so a "patient" Sektor might stickle a simple fight.

Another point : is true that Sektor and CSZ have the fastest dash in the game ?

 

[smokey]

Sektor i cant vouch for but i have heard on numerous occasions that the fastest dash in the game belongs to cyber sub!

 

[Faded Dreams V]

Isn't Ketchup pretty much one of the best Sektor players? lol.

Anyways, I do agree that a defensive Sektor can be a pain the ass. Far away, Sektor may not be able throw a missile without getting severely punished, but Smoke has absolutely no options. Smoke bombing to build meter or using Smoke Away too much will only get him tele-smacked into a full combo. Getting in is, of course, the hardest part of this sort of match. That said, if you do manage to get in, attack, and get the health lead, the Sektor player will undoubtedly start approaching faster and becoming impatient, which will lead to slip ups.

Personally, I consider it a 5-5 matchup.

 

[PND_Ketchup]

Shake isn't what makes Sektor's projectiles useless, it's teleport punch. Sektor has more than enough tools against Smoke without missles.

"waiting to punish a teleport" isn't a viable tactic against anyone with a brain.

If you think Smoke is one of Sektor's worst match ups you're playing him wrong, straight up. Just because you can't full screen zone him or use up missle pressure doesn't make it bad for Sektor.

if you'd have bothered to read the whole thread i said about a tele happy sektor because he stated it's the tele that's giving him trouble.

So to beat smoke all i have to do is B1 and flamethrower? perhaps it's you who isn't playing the match correctly.

You guys haven't thought about what sektors supposed to do if smoke turtles with the life lead? I'm not saying it's horrific for sektor, i'm just saying he cant use any projectiles or teleport on reaction to projectiles. So that leaves him with little options. If the smoke player knows how to D1 out of pressure it's extremely difficult.

 

[Big Pampering]

Isn't Ketchup pretty much one of the best Sektor players? lol.

Anyways, I do agree that a defensive Sektor can be a pain the ass. Far away, Sektor may not be able throw a missile without getting severely punished, but Smoke has absolutely no options. Smoke bombing to build meter or using Smoke Away too much will only get him tele-smacked into a full combo. Getting in is, of course, the hardest part of this sort of match. That said, if you do manage to get in, attack, and get the health lead, the Sektor player will undoubtedly start approaching faster and becoming impatient, which will lead to slip ups.

Personally, I consider it a 5-5 matchup.

severely punished lol, s shake or a teleport is low damage

 

[PND_Ketchup]

severely punished lol, s shake or a teleport is low damage

more often than not teleporting on reaction to smoke bombs will catch him anyway, it's one of the dumbest projectiles to do that to and isnt worth it going wrong for. teleport gives him pressure straight away, it doesn't matter if it's low damage.

 

[G4S KT]

if you'd have bothered to read the whole thread i said about a tele happy sektor because he stated it's the tele that's giving him trouble.

So to beat smoke all i have to do is B1 and flamethrower? perhaps it's you who isn't playing the match correctly.

You guys haven't thought about what sektors supposed to do if smoke turtles with the life lead? I'm not saying it's horrific for sektor, i'm just saying he cant use any projectiles or teleport on reaction to projectiles. So that leaves him with little options. If the smoke player knows how to D1 out of pressure it's extremely difficult.

About how often do you play the Smoke match up?

 

[PND_Ketchup]

About how often do you play the Smoke match up?

often enough, smoke is also my secondary.

 

[Faded Dreams V]

severely punished lol, s shake or a teleport is low damage

That was actually a typo. I initially typed "or teleport" after "missile."

But he MAY be severely punished with a teleport if he doesn't know any better, you teleport a 2nd time--after the first hit--behind him, and 3 D1 2. Hell, "punished" doesn't have to mean punished by damage output, but rather, by the pressure Smoke can give from such a mistake on Sektor's part.

 

[Crathen]

Punishing means guaranteed damage , what are you trying to say is closing his options and hope in a wrong guess , don't confuse yourself.

Also a turtling sektor doesn't scare Smoke at all , if he tries to b1 or ft Smoke can always whiff punish him with smokebomb or get in with b2 / d4 / smoke torwards , the thing i don't see Smoke players understand about their character is that he is one if not the best whiff punisher in the game , also in a game where AA normals are beaten by jumpkicks , Smoke can jk airthrow wich gives him wakeup pressure.

5-5

 

[G4S KT]

theory kombat 9 up in this piece.

[MENTION=3803]Ketchup[/MENTION], next time you play a Smoke, instead of trying to lay down pressure play keep away with b1/flamethrower/punishing whatever smoke does to try and get in while walking him to the corner and see how that goes.

EDIT: please note that just because it's one of Smoke's hardest fights doesn't mean it's extremely difficult. None of Smoke's bad match ups are all that bad.

Also, lol @ me not understanding what Smoke's strengths and weaknesses are.

 

[sumkindofdemon]

lol wow didnt mean to start shit about the smoke/ sektor match up i read the whole thread though took
all the tips thrown out and will remember them wanna thank kysmith and ketchup for the input maybe i was just having a bad night LIKE A REALLY BAD NIGHT :salty: DX just gotta go back to the practice room

 

[G4S KT]

My point is that Sektor can stone-wall Smoke at just aroud jump distance and Smoke's only choices are to 1. run away and bait/punish something or 2. capitalize on a mistake.

Patience is a virtue.

 

[Crathen]

My point is that Sektor can stone-wall Smoke at just aroud jump distance and Smoke's only choices are to 1. run away and bait/punish something or 2. capitalize on a mistake.

Patience is a virtue.

Patience is a virtue with Sektor too , especially against Smoke.

The fact i can "stonewall" with Sektor is a good point for sure but think about it , b1 doesn't catch jumpins on reaction, flamethrower does but on block Smoke gets a free b2 and i have to block it , so i have to watch out / bait a jumpin in order to punish it with flamethrower , also standing 1 as AA is beaten by jumpkick+airthrow so against a smart Smoke player i wouldn't even try it if he does make me respect that.

That along with nullified fullscreen zoning and good lowpokes upclose makes this MU clearly a 5-5 and note that i'm not basing this on theory fighting but on serious offline games with a good opponent so don't start with that kind of talk.

( Note i'm not trying to be a know-it-all or i'm-better-than-you , if ya wanna discuss about it you are free to do so but be specific instead of saying b1 / flamethrower without listing proper counters and risk reward for it )

 

[Robotic]

Food for thought: Both the Smoke and Sektor forums have had threads started in the past about how to deal with each other because players have "trouble" with them. I initially had major issues against Smoke players because I didn't understand the matchup and thought he shut me down completely. After much exposure, the more you know about Smoke - and the more he knows about Sektor - the more this turns into a doppelganger of the Sektor vs Sub Zero match: a super tense, I'm-scared-of-what-you-can-do-to-me 5-5 matchup.

As for the OP, based on what you have said in this thread, I can only give tidbits of advice against your Sektor opponent and the way he is playing against you:

1. Block more. Go into training mode and find out what combos you can do reliably when you block something you can clearly punish.

2. Sektor really can't willy-nilly TU against a Smoke Bomb happy Smoke as it will catch him on the way down off the screen. Utilize the move, but don't get crazy with it. True, you won't catch many high level Sektors with this as they don't TU forthefuckofit, but it doesn't seem like you're playing a high level Sektor...

3. ??

4. Profit.

 

[G4S KT]

flamethrower does but on block Smoke gets a free b2 and i have to block it

lol. Just... lol

EDIT: just so everyone knows, unless flamethrower is blocked at literally point blank range, b2 whiffs.

 

[Crathen]

lol. Just... lol

EDIT: just so everyone knows, unless flamethrower is blocked at literally point blank range, b2 whiffs.

Uh , dash into b2?

Unless you are at the tip of the flamethrower you can force him to block a b2 , also from jump distance a decent timed jik airthrow will hit Sektor out of the flamethrower vertical hitbox ( and jump kick also beats AA standing 1 ) but that's if you wanna guess in case you read a Ft.

And from the tip of the Ft it takes just a backdash to whiff punish a preemptive flamethrower.

So what are you laughing about?

And don't start with theory kombat once again please.

 

[PND_Ketchup]

theory kombat 9 up in this piece.

[MENTION=3803]Ketchup[/MENTION], next time you play a Smoke, instead of trying to lay down pressure play keep away with b1/flamethrower/punishing whatever smoke does to try and get in while walking him to the corner and see how that goes.

EDIT: please note that just because it's one of Smoke's hardest fights doesn't mean it's extremely difficult. None of Smoke's bad match ups are all that bad.

Also, lol @ me not understanding what Smoke's strengths and weaknesses are.

Please tell me at what point i actually said "you don't know what smokes strengths and weaknesses are" i'd love to know. If not don't put words in my mouth.

Theory fighter gets thrown around too freely these days, I know that a decent smoke player wont just let me B1 and flamethrower them dude, it doesn't work throughout the whole game because anyone with a brain becomes wise to it. It's not "theory fighter" just because this is my personal matchup experience lmao.

If you let a sektor player beat you with 2 attacks you're doing something wrong, no offence.

 

[PND_Ketchup]

Uh , dash into b2?

Unless you are at the tip of the flamethrower you can force him to block a b2 , also from jump distance a decent timed jik airthrow will hit Sektor out of the flamethrower vertical hitbox ( and jump kick also beats AA standing 1 ) but that's if you wanna guess in case you read a Ft.

And from the tip of the Ft it takes just a backdash to whiff punish a preemptive flamethrower.

So what are you laughing about?

And don't start with theory kombat once again please.

he probably doesn't know at close sweep distance a blocked flame burner is a free block string for him. I hope he doesn't stay being pointlessly hostile.

 

[smokey]

My point is that Sektor can stone-wall Smoke at just aroud jump distance and Smoke's only choices are to 1. run away and bait/punish something or 2. capitalize on a mistake.

Patience is a virtue.

Sorry to carry this on, im finding all these opinions and inputs useful though, disregarding any low level hostility going down, both sides here (Smoke and sektor) seem to have different tactics, and both seem content that they are better than the others so its all good information.

With regards to your post though KT. Option 1 : Run away and bait/punish something, and 2. Capitalize on a mistake. This pretty much somes up the tactic i stated i use in this match, which you have then gone on to argue against. So i dont know whats happened here because we are both playing the same character in the same match doing the same things, and somehow this got heated? Are we mis-understanding each other or something, i dont see how this could all loop back around to the first tactic which was the point of debate anyway...

 

[G4S KT]

Pointlessly hostile?

the thing i don't see Smoke players understand about their character is that he is one if not the best whiff punisher in the game

[MENTION=3803]Ketchup[/MENTION], your first post was right after mine talking about iaTU and began with "you're probably just bad at blocking TU", so you can imagine how I saw it as directed at me.

And when people are condescending I'm going to take offense.

Uh , dash into b2?

Unless you are at the tip of the flamethrower you can force him to block a b2 , also from jump distance a decent timed jik airthrow will hit Sektor out of the flamethrower vertical hitbox ( and jump kick also beats AA standing 1 ) but that's if you wanna guess in case you read a Ft.

And from the tip of the Ft it takes just a backdash to whiff punish a preemptive flamethrower.

If you're close enough to jump and safely clear FT Sektor has already failed in the keep away game and Smoke is exactly where he needs to be. You also seem to be underestimating how massive the pushback on it is. In order for Sektor to not have time to retaliate against even a dashed in b2, you have to be well inside it's range, at which point the keep away is over

he probably doesn't know at close sweep distance a blocked flame burner is a free block string for him. I hope he doesn't stay being pointlessly hostile.

lol, it's not that I don't know it's that I don't even consider it because it should never happen. A lot of characters can straight up punish FT from inside sweep distance. why would you throw a flamethrower when your opponent is that close to you?

Theory fighter gets thrown around too freely these days, I know that a decent smoke player wont just let me B1 and flamethrower them dude, it doesn't work throughout the whole game because anyone with a brain becomes wise to it. It's not "theory fighter" just because this is my personal matchup experience lmao.

If you let a sektor player beat you with 2 attacks you're doing something wrong, no offence.

You don't get killed by getting hit with b1 ten times. Why is it so hard to realize that those two attacks combined with proper spacing forces Smoke to at some point attempt a risky and highly punishable approach (namely, going into the air)? Like, it's so simple and it works. Forcing Smoke to make risky approaches is the worst possible thing you can do to him. I haven't spent nearly every day since game launch playing my room mate's (@stream_worthy) Sektor to not know what I'm talking about.

If Sektor gets a life lead Smoke needs some good ass fortune in order to win the round.

 

[G4S KT]

KT. Option 1 : Run away and bait/punish something, and 2. Capitalize on a mistake. This pretty much somes up the tactic i stated i use in this match, which you have then gone on to argue against.

I did?

where?

that's basically my entire case lol

And I'm annoyed because Ketchup and Crathen came into the thread and were condescending as hell

 

[PND_Ketchup]

Pointlessly hostile?



[MENTION=3803]Ketchup[/MENTION], your first post was right after mine talking about iaTU and began with "you're probably just bad at blocking TU", so you can imagine how I saw it as directed at me.

And when people are condescending I'm going to take offense.



If you're close enough to jump and safely clear FT Sektor has already failed in the keep away game and Smoke is exactly where he needs to be. You also seem to be underestimating how massive the pushback on it is. In order for Sektor to not have time to retaliate against even a dashed in b2, you have to be well inside it's range, at which point the keep away is over



lol, it's not that I don't know it's that I don't even consider it because it should never happen. A lot of characters can straight up punish FT from inside sweep distance. why would you throw a flamethrower when your opponent is that close to you?



You don't get killed by getting hit with b1 ten times. Why is it so hard to realize that those two attacks combined with proper spacing forces Smoke to at some point attempt a risky and highly punishable approach (namely, going into the air)? Like, it's so simple and it works. Forcing Smoke to make risky approaches is the worst possible thing you can do to him. I haven't spent nearly every day since game launch playing my room mate's (@stream_worthy) Sektor to not know what I'm talking about.

If Sektor gets a life lead Smoke needs some good ass fortune in order to win the round.

he specifically said the person he fights does loads of teleports, i guess that means he's.... good at blocking them?

take the logic and flip it on it's head. What's sektor supposed to do to a smoke that has the life lead? This is why other players have stated it's a 5-5 and i completely understand why. It's difficult for both players but in no way shape or form is it harder for smoke.

 

[FrothyOmen]