Reacting to throws

[QueenOmega]

Hello everyone, lately I've been trying to level up my game, trying to be more patient and blocking more and playing more neutral (unfortunatly, got to reach Elder god for the Cetrion gear...). This open a whole new problem: as son as people see i'm blocking more, game becomes a grab fest.
Now I've heard pros saying you can react to throws and shit, but sincerely i'm not able to do it, at least yet. How can you train to "react"? Can you guys do it?
Even if you can actually react to it, isn't it still a 50/50 for the tech?
I don't know, feel like i'm missing a piece of the puzle here.

 

[Tony at Home]

I can react only if I'm specifically looking for it and put all my focus on it. Like when I say to myself "I'm going to hold down plus block and smash 2 if I see them lurch over for a grab".

I can't tech on reaction and still fuzzy overheads, watch out for staggers, or reversal throw d1s etc.

I think that's the key though. There's no "out of the blue" reacting to something like throws so fast. You need to trade a large portion of your limited focus. (Another important element is I decide what my tech direction will be in advance. After every opponent throw and significant change in position relative to the corner, I pick my button)


I got this from KI where I could only break medium auto doubles on reaction with a similar methodology. I'd have to predecide on mediums AND whether it was kicks or punches so I specifically looked for something rather than react on the fly. It meant I'd break less but also lock out less because of bad timing or a wrong guess, which was a very good trade off because lockouts are baaaaaaaaad.

 

[GLoRToR]

Hello everyone, lately I've been trying to level up my game, trying to be more patient and blocking more and playing more neutral (unfortunatly, got to reach Elder god for the Cetrion gear...). This open a whole new problem: as son as people see i'm blocking more, game becomes a grab fest.
Now I've heard pros saying you can react to throws and shit, but sincerely i'm not able to do it, at least yet. How can you train to "react"? Can you guys do it?
Even if you can actually react to it, isn't it still a 50/50 for the tech?
I don't know, feel like i'm missing a piece of the puzle here.

You and everyone else that's intermediate or lower.
It's no easy feat to be "unthrowable" but here's the recipe.

1. You can OS throws by plinking in 2,1 at the right moment. The right moment is when the arms wrap around you. Practicing it in training mode helps but don't expect to react even armed with that knowledge, because.
2. Throws are 10f. The fastest a human can react is around 16f, realistically around 20f and comfortably above 30f. This means that throws happen in one third of the time and you have to let go of Block to be able to tech throws to begin with. So OSing throws is useful but you aren't going to do it that easily.
3. You have to anticipate or "read" throws more than react to them. This is the hard part, but typically people will want to throw you towards the corner so there is that in case you don't manage to OS.
4. Remember that getting hit by a few d1s is a lot less damage than a single throw with the added risk of a krushing blow also loaded for the next attempt so adhere accordingly. Let them d1 spam you. d2 the throw when it's coming.

Good luck.

 

[QueenOmega]

You and everyone else that's intermediate or lower.
It's no easy feat to be "unthrowable" but here's the recipe.

1. You can OS throws by plinking in 2,1 at the right moment. The right moment is when the arms wrap around you. Practicing it in training mode helps but don't expect to react even armed with that knowledge, because.
2. Throws are 10f. The fastest a human can react is around 16f, realistically around 20f and comfortably above 30f. This means that throws happen in one third of the time and you have to let go of Block to be able to tech throws to begin with. So OSing throws is useful but you aren't going to do it that easily.
3. You have to anticipate or "read" throws more than react to them. This is the hard part, but typically people will want to throw you towards the corner so there is that in case you don't manage to OS.
4. Remember that getting hit by a few d1s is a lot less damage than a single throw with the added risk of a krushing blow also loaded for the next attempt so adhere accordingly. Let them d1 spam you. d2 the throw when it's coming.

Good luck.

Thanks for the aswer, gonna lab the plinking thing, and specially letting go off from block, cause i must do it late all the times.

 

[YoungTeezy 305]

You and everyone else that's intermediate or lower.
It's no easy feat to be "unthrowable" but here's the recipe.

1. You can OS throws by plinking in 2,1 at the right moment. The right moment is when the arms wrap around you. Practicing it in training mode helps but don't expect to react even armed with that knowledge, because.
2. Throws are 10f. The fastest a human can react is around 16f, realistically around 20f and comfortably above 30f. This means that throws happen in one third of the time and you have to let go of Block to be able to tech throws to begin with. So OSing throws is useful but you aren't going to do it that easily.
3. You have to anticipate or "read" throws more than react to them. This is the hard part, but typically people will want to throw you towards the corner so there is that in case you don't manage to OS.
4. Remember that getting hit by a few d1s is a lot less damage than a single throw with the added risk of a krushing blow also loaded for the next attempt so adhere accordingly. Let them d1 spam you. d2 the throw when it's coming.

Good luck.

The window to tech throws is more than 10 frames.

 

[YoungTeezy 305]

Hello everyone, lately I've been trying to level up my game, trying to be more patient and blocking more and playing more neutral (unfortunatly, got to reach Elder god for the Cetrion gear...). This open a whole new problem: as son as people see i'm blocking more, game becomes a grab fest.
Now I've heard pros saying you can react to throws and shit, but sincerely i'm not able to do it, at least yet. How can you train to "react"? Can you guys do it?
Even if you can actually react to it, isn't it still a 50/50 for the tech?
I don't know, feel like i'm missing a piece of the puzle here.

I try to learn the grab animation for each character for each side. The ones I play more often are easier to tech than characters I dont usually play against because of this. It's worth labbing though.

Teching is mostly based on the corner positioning and it is now second nature for me to tech in the right direction. The opponent might pick up on this late in the game so they will try to throw the opposite direction. It's a mind game at that point.

 

[Tanno]

Every fighter has the same animation that implies the throw. You just need to recognize the animation itself, and then bam for the reaction. It'd be easy for that in MKX, but now it's MK11, which means that you gotta "read" your opponent's mind and strategize accordingly.

 

[GLoRToR]

The window to tech throws is more than 10 frames.

Where did I say otherwise?

 

[YoungTeezy 305]

Every fighter has the same animation that implies the throw. You just need to recognize the animation itself, and then bam for the reaction. It'd be easy for that in MKX, but now it's MK11, which means that you gotta "read" your opponent's mind and strategize accordingly.

This is inaccurate. For example, Nightwolf reaches out with both hands quickly while Jax reaches out with one hand and arches a bit.

 

[YoungTeezy 305]

Where did I say otherwise?

You said, "Throws are 10f. The fastest a human can react is around 16f, realistically around 20f and comfortably above 30f. This means that throws happen in one third of the time and you have to let go of Block to be able to tech throws to begin with."

 

[YoungTeezy 305]

@QueenOmega a low ms monitor also helps

 

[GLoRToR]

You said, "Throws are 10f. The fastest a human can react is around 16f, realistically around 20f and comfortably above 30f. This means that throws happen in one third of the time and you have to let go of Block to be able to tech throws to begin with."

Yes. I never specified the window because it's irrelevant. Throws come out in 10f and you have a few frames to tech them. That's to let go of block and guess, or plink in 21 if you know the timing for it.
The thread is about REACTING to throws and the point is that in this game they are fairly faster than what you can react to, which is because they connect on the 11th frame and you don't have within the comfortable range of frames to react to them, only a little bit longer.

The point is that throws are strong right now and reacting to them is difficult, often just not possible.
Reading them is how we usually go about it.
I hope this clears up the confusion.

 

[Groove Heaven]

People say grabs are reactable in this game but I'm either too old or slow to agree. The movement and normals (ticks) that set up throwing isn't nearly as obvious as it is in Street Fighter, so I just have to identify patterns in the opponent that I'm currently playing and see when they like to throw.

 

[MerlinsBeard]

I almost always tech forward throw. Most people are walking forward while throwing so they get forward throw by default, I'm guilty of this too. As far as reacting goes, if they mix it in with stagger strings it can feel impossible but if they keep doing it after the same string or just down 1 or 3 you can just neutral duck it because it's no longer a reaction but a read.

 

[YoungTeezy 305]

Yes. I never specified the window because it's irrelevant. Throws come out in 10f and you have a few frames to tech them. That's to let go of block and guess, or plink in 21 if you know the timing for it.
The thread is about REACTING to throws and the point is that in this game they are fairly faster than what you can react to, which is because they connect on the 11th frame and you don't have within the comfortable range of frames to react to them, only a little bit longer.

The point is that throws are strong right now and reacting to them is difficult, often just not possible.
Reading them is how we usually go about it.
I hope this clears up the confusion.

You're right, online it can be difficult to tech throws on reaction. Offline is a different story. I feel like it's very reactable if you know the animation.

 

[Tony at Home]

Yes. I never specified the window because it's irrelevant. Throws come out in 10f and you have a few frames to tech them.

I believe it's a 10 frame tech window. So 10 frame startup + 10 frame window to tech totals 20 frames.

Throws in Tekken often are 12 frames on startup, only 2 frames slower than MK but because the tech window is extremely long they're very often teched on reaction.

Tech window is everything.

 

[LawAbidingCitizen]

Hello everyone, lately I've been trying to level up my game, trying to be more patient and blocking more and playing more neutral (unfortunatly, got to reach Elder god for the Cetrion gear...). This open a whole new problem: as son as people see i'm blocking more, game becomes a grab fest.
Now I've heard pros saying you can react to throws and shit, but sincerely i'm not able to do it, at least yet. How can you train to "react"? Can you guys do it?
Even if you can actually react to it, isn't it still a 50/50 for the tech?
I don't know, feel like i'm missing a piece of the puzle here.

Yes you can react to throws. But you do have to be scouting them and maybe two other things.
Practice in lab with record AI set to do 4 different things including a throw off a stagger and after a while you will start reacting.

A good exercise is Liu Kang doing:
F43xxThrow
F43xxParry
F43xxAmpLowFB
F4 Throw

Keep doing that exercise until You react to all 4. You can still get caught by 5+ things but I generally tech every throw(Timing write) even if I guess wrong I get Failed Escape.

 

[GLoRToR]

I believe it's a 10 frame tech window. So 10 frame startup + 10 frame window to tech totals 20 frames.

Throws in Tekken often are 12 frames on startup, only 2 frames slower than MK but because the tech window is extremely long they're very often teched on reaction.

Tech window is everything.

You're right, I was going off of the point that it's difficult to react to them dismissing the importance of the tech window.
I'm not sure you have 10f to tech, though. Might just be because I play online, but it seems much less.

 

[QueenOmega]

@QueenOmega a low ms monitor also helps

Well I must asume my monitor has Little lag, because I remember back then playing on the Xbox i felt i couldn't react to anything at all, and when i switched platforms my game improved a lot. Not sure how I can look it up anyway.

 

[QueenOmega]

I believe it's a 10 frame tech window. So 10 frame startup + 10 frame window to tech totals 20 frames.

Throws in Tekken often are 12 frames on startup, only 2 frames slower than MK but because the tech window is extremely long they're very often teched on reaction.

Tech window is everything.

yeah, i actually teched a lot of them when 'playing Tekken 7. It was ineed way easier in that game

 

[CO-KANO]

I am not a teching God, in fact I avoid throws at all costs and neutral crouch and neutral up jumps are your greatest friend when one is going for a throw. takes some getting used to but scorpion, shang, and liu scrubs will get the message..whiffing throws is embarrassing, just watch this guy get blown up into another server

 

[ABACABB]

For me reactin to throws is not hard . Hard part is reacting to throws while being ready to block oh/low mix up . I recorded sub zero doing walk up throw / his lowstarted / oh starter . I can crouch and block all lows and tech throw but always get hit by oh . If i start blocking oh i get thrown or hit by low . Its hard depsite ppl saying this oh is slow.

Other thing which is FRUSTRATING is guessing f or b throw. And eating kb if u guess wrong . this is ridiculous. I wish they made teching harder but remove f/b guessing game .