Match-up Discussion Project Skarlet vs Kabal

[Eddy Wang]

Hey everyone, i'm currently exploring this MU as much as i can, but i won't be able to do this alone, so i decided to create this thread so we can work again as one to explore this MU together.

First of all, i need all of you Skarlet Players who have fought Kabal, or who fights Kabal, online and Offline to give me an Insight of your experience in this MU only, do not post things Skarlet can possibly do, just what you have done to fight against him, or what you always do to fight him.

The reason is simple, so we can analyze each one of us and see what we all have in common as a strong point, or mistakes, and will also makes much easier to analyze Kabal according to our actions to win this MU.

Once we have what we use, we can now exploit the weakness and the strong points and add something Skarlet can possibly do.


Ninj RedRaptor10 L0rdoftheFLY AssassiN[be] Mosp FCP/EMP SCAR MITDJT Johnny2d UsedForGlue xarakamaka A F0xy Grampa Somberness

I'm Tagging Mit because he picked skarlet not so long ago, so he can share his experience as well.
If by any mean you're a Skarlet player and you're not tagged here, please advert me to, so i can have your experience against Kabal as well.


If you're not a Skarlet player feel free to join the discussion, but be warned, i will not tolerate disrespects in this thread, flamming or raging, please be respectful among each other, i will use the mod powers if i have to. And remember, this is an analysis, i'm not asking if you're correct i'm trying to get inside of your heads to see the MU and difficulty trough each one perspective.

Thanks for your understanding, so lets get going

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

So much to say. It will have to wait till I get to my laptop and can post some match footage

 

[Eddy Wang]

My Match-up Opinion​

6-4 Kabal​

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From my Personal Experience:​

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Meter Management​

- In this Matchup, Kabal is able to build meter as fast as i can build up with Skarlet, and worst for me, i have to spend 1 bar before he does, and sometimes this is a constant behavior, making Skarlet burn more meter than she builds in this Match, this is a very negative thing for me.​

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Zoning​

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+/- Kabal Zoning at the lowest point doesn't stop me to throw a dagger into D3 cancel before the next gas blast his me on the process, which helps to cool him down a bit enough for getting in a little, but sometimes when i try to get in the buzzsaw catches me.​

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- I Can't trade Daggers with Kabal, because he Buzzsaws in the trade, he gets hit by the 1st dagger, but the buzzsaw delays me by hitting me into knock away.​

+ Kabal F4 has less range than Skarlet's which can be whiff punished if he tries to start pressure or punish with it, i hardly punish because i dunno when he will use it.​

+ Sometimes i hit them out of the iaGB with a F4 even at the lowest possible level giving Skarlet a full combo starter when she is upclose.​

+ I can jump out of buzzsaws when i can't punish on reads, which leaves me a few options to prevent his zoning, by throwing an dagger nearly as skarlet lands to prevent NDC punish or iaGB mayhem, in case Kabal jumps wrong and get the dagger, i get a full upslash follow up combo.​

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Rushdown​

- b12~NDC~b12~NDC is annonyng to me, recently discovered i can mash buttons inside and punish with 114 or a 10f punish, but the timing is strange , i know i can armor out of it and punish but haven't done so.​

NDC~d3, F4 NDC, i try to full combo punish after i block a D3 right away since i'm basically at +16 frames, or wait for the F4 NDC and punish there.​

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- 114~rd is good, but i don't delay the slide anymore when Kabal has meter, he can flash parry the slide and get a full combo, so i decide, either i do a empty dash or i do a slide in the end, but never delay it.​

B114 also good to bait Ex NDC and punish after block, its been working sometimes, but recently the kabal player only uppercuts me out of the way.​

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The Best way to beat this Character, what is been working for me, is placing him in the corner, here all his options are limited ans Skarlet gets the advantage, with meter i can anticipate Flash parries or Ex NDC atempts using empty Krimson Dashes to keep him there in case he use any of his wakeup attack​

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[Mosp]

There's a lot to say about this matchup so I might make a video about it later.

 

[Johnny2d]

You can instant air dagger over ground saws... but you better not miss the input, if you get a njp instead you will be full comboed. This makes it really hard for her to get in if he wants to run away and gas blast with an occasional saw. If Skarlet misses the IAFD Kabal gets a free combo, if he misses a gas blast its not a big deal, so it makes it hard for her. I'm not good enough to do this consistently online, but I've used it with moderate success offline. Its still hard though because you have to react to gas blasts, ground saws, and potential ex dashes. You guess wrong you eat a full combo, you react correctly you get in to try to start your offense. Of course you have your armor to get you in too, but you can't rely on that alone to get in you'll need a clever approach beyond just armoring.

 

[Lulzlou]

I played CrazyDominican's Skarlet in casuals and it seemed like it was obvious kabal had the advantage.

Also B12~ndc is only +3 on block so if the kabal does another b1, it makes it 10frames. She really can only poke, armor or jump out of pressure. She isn't fast enough to interrupt kabal with a String unless kabal does F4ndc into another string. Skarlet could use 114 if Kabal uses F3ndc(+1) or b1~ndc(+2) but she has a small window to do so. You need to take advantage of blocked 50/50's as well as F4ndc to start pressure. As for poking out of pressure, she should always use d3 instead of d1. Kabal can full combo punish a blocked d1 so its really risky to do so.

Skarlet can outzone kabal if he can't get the IAGB's low enough so if that is the case, take advantage of it and force him to come in. One of the problems in this match up is kabals ability to build meter. She has really good damage but its not enough if you let the kabal build all the meter he wants.

Keeping Kabal cornered actually helps a lot in most match ups. Ex Dash/Flash parry helps kabal get out of the corner but its tough to find the opportunity. For meterless options watch out for sweeps, 50/50's, and throwing to put you in the corner. Air breakers, sweeps and saws will grant a free dash over on hit which will reverse positions.

 

[AssassiN]

6-4 Kabal

Zoning
The zoning advantage depends on the situation, Skarlet can throw out a dagger sometimes to throw off iaGB's. Easily countered with his saw.
His iaGB's can be punished by an insta-teleport but being dependent on this is stupid => Kabal blocking leads to 30-35% into pressure. His saw can be punished while he is recovering via insta-teleport, but it's tricky + strict and wouldn't depend on this either. Avoiding his saw with jumping and ending with FD before hitting the ground is something I recommend.
Getting caught in the air by a dagger from full-screen leads to Skarlet getting closer much easier. She can teleport to finish the combo, dashcancel her daggers forward into a ERD or EX RD for a full combo into a reset.
The whole zoning concept is something I need to experiment more with.
A Kabal that is zoning up-close against a Skarlet with meter is fucked.

Footsies
It's an equal battle I'd say, both have the armor on dashes to counter each other's attempts. Although Kabal can punish pokes with dash while Skarlet cannot. Her F4 and F3 are superior in spacing but Kabal has speed to his advantage.
I still have to encounter a Kabal that has a footsie game as Reo does.

Rushdown
Kabal's pressure resolves around F32, B121 and F4.
If Kabal cancels his F4 it can be punished by EX RD except for his buzzsaw.
Got a hole between B1 and 2 as well.
Skarlet only has to fear EX Nomad Dash when doing whiffed daggers or ERD's.

Wake-up
If Skarlet is grounded without meter she has to block, same goes for Kabal.
U3 catches anything that Kabal does without meter, F4 + EX RD catches everything except an immediate NDC.

Still need more experience in this MU, I think this could turn into 5-5 by discovering some more MU-specific stuff.

 

[AssassiN]

I played CrazyDominican's Skarlet in casuals and it seemed like it was obvious kabal had the advantage.

Also B12~ndc is only +3 on block so if the kabal does another b1, it makes it 10frames. She really can only poke, armor or jump out of pressure. She isn't fast enough to interrupt kabal with a String unless kabal does F4ndc into another string. Skarlet could use 114 if Kabal uses F3ndc(+1) or b1~ndc(+2) but she has a small window to do so. You need to take advantage of blocked 50/50's as well as F4ndc to start pressure. As for poking out of pressure, she should always use d3 instead of d1. Kabal can full combo punish a blocked d1 so its really risky to do so.

Skarlet can outzone kabal if he can't get the IAGB's low enough so if that is the case, take advantage of it and force him to come in. One of the problems in this match up is kabals ability to build meter. She has really good damage but its not enough if you let the kabal build all the meter he wants.

Keeping Kabal cornered actually helps a lot in most match ups. Ex Dash/Flash parry helps kabal get out of the corner but its tough to find the opportunity. For meterless options watch out for sweeps, 50/50's, and throwing to put you in the corner. Air breakers, sweeps and saws will grant a free dash over on hit which will reverse positions.

Actually, B12~NDC is +2 on block. You need to add 1 more frame for canceling.
Got his NDC-pressure broken down in this thread.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

I feel that this MU needs to be approached the way cage approaches this MU at first. he builds his meter off of blockstrings ONLY. Skarlet cant zone. LBSH, her daggers do next to zero damage and trades are not in her favor. she has to get the zoning advantage first by either kabal messing up or by knocking him down. But even then it doesnt take much for kabal to get it back.

so the old fasion way, dash d3 to get in. Once she is within footsie range she has about 1 bar of meter, and long ranged normal, and chip. She needs to push kabal to the corner slowly and make him pay once he is there, but she has to have meter to do this.

More later...

 

[Eddy Wang]

do not post things Skarlet can possibly do, just what you have done to fight against him, or what you always do to fight him.

Once we have what we use, we can now exploit the weakness and the strong points and add something Skarlet can possibly do.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

Why quote yourself?

 

[GLoRToR]

Why quote yourself?

He's looking for facts we already have, not speculations on what possibly could be done.
Eddy Wang

Personally I feel that this matchup will only ever be truly explored if a Skarlet player can sit down and train with REO for long enough to hit the level where the matchup is no longer a matter of player skill but tools.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

He's looking for facts we already have, not speculations on what possibly could be done.
Eddy Wang

Personally I feel that this matchup will only ever be truly explored if a Skarlet player can sit down and train with REO for long enough to hit the level where the matchup is no longer a matter of player skill but tools.

then I have nothing to add...only rare shitty online exp and theory

 

[Eddy Wang]

then I have nothing to add...only rare shitty online exp and theory

Pls share, anything Kabal vs Skarlet related can be helpful

 

[Eddy Wang]

L0rdoftheFLY Mosp, i know you guys have done this before, but i'm asking if is possibly for you guys to run this MU online again, and then switch Characters.
Once you do can you give us an insight on your exp about what i'm asking? Or i should invite Lulzlou to play online against any of you that have a good connection. Then anyone that plays against him could share the insight and luzlou as well.

I want to have a general idea of how each one of you fights this characters based on what you know what can possibly be executed in battle.

I think we may need to record it, if any of you can't, i shall ask GamerBlake90 to host the arena and stream a ft of 3 if he can break it down for us, it won't be as good as offline, but its something

 

[GLoRToR]

shitty online exp

That's where most people play this game, so please share what you know.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

That's where most people play this game, so please share what you know.

I really want to get NogunYesknife to play with offline. He lives about 2 hours from me but he is a VERY solid kabal. That said. I can also play Red Fox with my kabal vs his skarlet...but I dont know if he has been playing.

I can also record Matches vs K7 and Mosp...only decent connections I can recall...I could play Doc Dark but It will be ugly.

 

[Eddy Wang]

I really want to get NogunYesknife to play with offline. He lives about 2 hours from me but he is a VERY solid kabal. That said. I can also play Red Fox with my kabal vs his skarlet...but I dont know if he has been playing.

I can also record Matches vs K7 and Mosp...only decent connections I can recall...I could play Doc Dark but It will be ugly.

It would be of incredibly help buddy

 

[GLoRToR]

I really want to get NogunYesknife to play with offline. He lives about 2 hours from me but he is a VERY solid kabal. That said. I can also play Red Fox with my kabal vs his skarlet...but I dont know if he has been playing.

I can also record Matches vs K7 and Mosp...only decent connections I can recall...I could play Doc Dark but It will be ugly.

Absolutely smashing
Footage plz!

 

[ryublaze]

The only MU experience I have is online against Lulzlou and that was a while ago. Unfortunately now my Skarlet isn't on the same level as it was before. I wish I would've recorded our matches before cuz they were really good sets back then.

 

[Mosp]

If you guys want me to run some online matches I will as long as someone else can record them.

 

[AK L0rdoftheFLY]

If you guys want me to run some online matches I will as long as someone else can record them.

Lets do this...again.

 

[Mosp]

Lets do this...again.

lol alright just let me know when you can.

 

[Lulzlou]

I'm down to play with anyone that has a recording set up.
Not today though, I'm completely out of it.

 

[Laos_boy]

I've played this real solid online kabal week or two ago. I don't know if he's on here. But f4 f43 ( to knock him out of iagb) and d3 are your best friends when he's Zoning. I also like hit confirming into blood drop after a hit dagger to get in. There's always ex red dash.