General/Other - Kitana Potential KP3 Changes

[KH StarCharger]

With the potential for a KP3 announcement at EVO, this means that a rebalance may be coming. Yeah, I know, "Not another rebalance thread". But let's face facts, our Princess is overmatched in this game whether we want to admit it or not. Yet, I think she'd be a few changes away from being able to compete in all three variations.

General:
- Fix glitch that lets people run through her on wake up if she performs a reversal.

Normals:
- D1 changed to +6 on hit (it's +3 now).
- Standing 2 changed to a mid (It's a high now)
- B2 to either start up in 14 frames and do 14% damage or be completely redesigned (25f startup and 9% damage now).
- F2 to be 15f start up (19 frame start up now)
- B3 to be 12f start up (currently 15f start up)

These changes to her normals wouldn't be overdoing it but it would give her tools in the neutral that will allow her to control space a little better and force 50/50 heavy characters to respect that.

Assassin:
- Parry to startup in 3f maximum (Currently 7f startup now) and have glitch fixed that allows some characters to not get hit with the animation if an armor move was used.
- Parry to have an option to counter lows.
- Assassins Rush to be either run cancellable or hit overhead (currently just a mid)

These changes would button up all of Assassin's shortcomings without overdoing it. Even though it's her best variation, it's still sorely lacking.

Royal Storm:
- 2,4,4 to leave Kitana in an airborne state
- Enhanced Fannado to cancel out other incoming projectiles (much like Sub's Enhanced iceball or Takeda's enhanced beam in Ronin)
- Projectile Parry to start up in 9f or 10f (Currently starts up in 17f.)

This buttons up RS to the point where it can be used as a zoning/counter zoning variation.

Mournful:
I'd need a whole other thread to address what this variation truly needs but I'll keep it simple.

- normals with the staff that replace the current normals that use the fans
- the return of the enhanced glaive block stun that was removed in KP2 that allows her to follow up with pressure.

This variation needs a ton of help in general but those are the best things to put that would help.

Xray:
To lock on all opponents when the first hit connects.

Overall the goal isn't to make her OP, but to give her what she needs to compete with the Aliens, Sonya's (Demo), Shinnoks, etc. in this game. Currently she's just lacking but KP3 could be what the doctor ordered in case a rebalance (Along with more new characters) is on the way. This is how I feel she could be helped out. Please feel free to comment below. I don't post as often as I used to but with the thought of another update for MKX possibly on the way, I felt this needed to be seen. Hopefully NRS takes note. Fans up fellas!

 

[Dankster Morgan]

I only play Royal Storm so I'll just comment on what I know.
1. D1 being more plus on hit is a must. That move is just frustrating as fuck. It's pretty bad on block, and you don't really get anything on hit, you kind of have to D3 or something after a connected D1 JUST to keep your turn.
2. F2 changes I agree.
I think her other normals are fine.

Royal Storm:
Agree on it why tf not lol.
Also mask pls.

 

[Dankster Morgan]

I only play Royal Storm so I'll just comment on what I know.
1. D1 being more plus on hit is a must. That move is just frustrating as fuck. It's pretty bad on block, and you don't really get anything on hit, you kind of have to D3 or something after a connected D1 JUST to keep your turn.
2. F2 changes I agree.
I think her other normals are fine.

Royal Storm:
Agree on it why tf not lol.
Also mask pls.

 

[xKhaoTik]

Aliens, Sonya's (Demo), Shinnoks

But she already does fine against them. She actually beats Sonya imo

And I don't see the point of assassin strike as an OH. I've seen that mentioned before and I never understood why. 24 in RS needs to be looked at. It's such a useless move. I agree ex lift change. I've been saying that since like week 1

 

[Dankster Morgan]

Yeah she does fine with both Sonya and Alien. I think Royal Storm beats Tarkatan but no clue about Acidic. I can see it being dreadful in theory though.

 

[EdenianWarrior]

100% agree with mournful

 

[KH StarCharger]

But she already does fine against them. She actually beats Sonya imo

And I don't see the point of assassin strike as an OH. I've seen that mentioned before and I never understood why. 24 in RS needs to be looked at. It's such a useless move. I agree ex lift change. I've been saying that since like week 1

No offense at all, but I'd like to see you prove that in tournament or sets against the best with those characters before I belive that. Since XL dropped, I'm convinced otherwise after having ample time to pick the game apart at the highest level. Besides, those characters were pointed out simply because winning is a lot easier for them than it is for her. other than that, I think that having Assassin strike as an OH (Or run cancellable) would give her a dimension that she doesn't have. I agree with your other points though.

 

[KH StarCharger]

Yeah she does fine with both Sonya and Alien. I think Royal Storm beats Tarkatan but no clue about Acidic. I can see it being dreadful in theory though.

Play Dragon and ForeverKing Offline then let me know your true feelings. There's plenty that you haven't seen my man.

 

[Baconlord]

- Standing 2 changed to a mid (It's a high now)

Wouldn't that be a block infinite against characters with slow pokes

 

[KH StarCharger]

it actually wouldn't. but it would force them to respect her in the counterpoking game. She's not a 50/50 character. She's a neutral, whiff punishing, fundamentally solid character that's not fundamentally solid enough to win that way against characters that have the tools to overwhelm that.

 

[Addhad]

Ur asking for way 2 much lol make her pre patch and we will be okay

 

[YoloRoll1stHit]

Agree with Addhad. You're asking for way too much
And mid s2 is stupid. I'm seriously, it's broken as hell. even 6f pokes must be frame perfect just to trade with 21 21 21 21

I main the character genius of course I am. but two things, 1) plus frames in this game don't matter because of armor and 2) every one of the characters who's options I listed above have either Plus frames or a mixup that follows. Like I said, That's not an out of place change. Judging from your name I assume you're a mileena player. That makes your dispute pretty damn funny if that's the case.

You main the character doesn't mean you know the best about what she needs. It's obvious that in this case Kitana will become broken with all the changes, especially mid s2. 1) armors don't make block infinite legal or acceptable in this game. Not everyone has safe armors and noone has infinite meter to throw out armors. It's like saying Trident rush is garbage because everyone can push block or it's punished by like 4 characters
2) Nobody has block infinite. Agree with Alien and Sonya are broken, but it doesn't mean you should ask for Kitana to be as broken as them
Yes I'm a Mileena player, but Kitana is my first main on the first day MKX came out. I created TYM account as I picked up Mileena as secondary because Kitana was terrible and I hated losing too much. And being a Mileena player doesn't mean I can't talk about Kitana.

 

[KH StarCharger]

Ur asking for way 2 much lol make her pre patch and we will be okay

Maybe, but in comparison with a lot of the cast this is pretty tame tbh. I'm not asking for them to give her 50/50's out of the wazoo. but giving her even half of this would make her competitive.

 

[KH StarCharger]

Agree with Addhad. You're asking for way too much
And mid s2 is stupid. I'm seriously, it's broken as hell. even 6f pokes must be frame perfect just to trade with 21 21 21 21

You main the character doesn't mean you know the best about what she needs. It's obvious that in this case Kitana will become broken with all the changes, especially mid s2. 1) armors don't make block infinite legal or acceptable in this game. Not everyone has safe armors and noone has infinite meter to throw out armors. It's like saying Trident rush is garbage because everyone can push block or it's punished by like 4 characters
2) Nobody has block infinite. Agree with Alien and Sonya are broken, but it doesn't mean you should ask for Kitana to be as broken as them
Yes I'm a Mileena player, but Kitana is my first main on the first day MKX came out. I created TYM account as I picked up Mileena as secondary because Kitana was terrible and I hated losing too much. And being a Mileena player doesn't mean I can't talk about Kitana.

Dude I question what sense you really have when it comes to this game and FG's in general. +2 isn't going to lead into block infinites in the slightest. you can backdash a ton of things that are plus on block in this game that are +3 or less. BTW, all Kotal has to do is mash d1 in order to get out. These changes wouldn't make her broken at all. They would round out her variations and solidify her neutral.

 

[KH StarCharger]

Quite frankly, if the D1, B3, B2, and F2 changes came to fruition, I'd be content with S2 staying as is. I'd easily take one or the other if not both.

 

[Dankster Morgan]

Play Dragon and ForeverKing Offline then let me know your true feelings. There's plenty that you haven't seen my man.

Why in your opinion does she lose to Tarkatan? And "play dragon" isn't a legit answer. It's 5-5 at worst.

 

[Laos_boy]

No reason for s2 to be mid.
But f2 and f1 should be sped up. B3 maybe idk why not. D1 change decent i cancel into SK anyways.

 

[KH StarCharger]

the fact that you think that proves my point anyways without explanation. But when it gets to business time, acidic is what gives her hell and that's what I was ultimately referring to.

And btw, royal storm doesn't beat alien (Tark). It may pull even at best (like you said) but it doesn't win outright by a long shot.

 

[KH StarCharger]

No reason for s2 to be mid.
But f2 and f1 should be sped up. B3 maybe idk why not. D1 change decent i cancel into SK anyways.

If the D1, F2, B2 (Op), and B3 changes came to be, I'd agree wholeheartedly.

 

[DDutchguy]

I disagree with Kitana being overmatched, she seems to be doing fine both online and in tournaments. Of course playing the character is different than talking about the character, so I won't pretend likenI know what Kitana is all about and whether she needs buffs/nerfs.

- Parry to have an option to counter lows.

This would open up an insanely good mind game that any character would be scared to go for anything against Kitana. She is also good enough in air-to-airs that jumping in on her is a bad idea. Combined with the suggested 3-frame parry, this is overdoing it.

 

[KH StarCharger]

I disagree with Kitana being overmatched, she seems to be doing fine both online and in tournaments. Of course playing the character is different than talking about the character, so I won't pretend likenI know what Kitana is all about and whether she needs buffs/nerfs.



This would open up an insanely good mind game that any character would be scared to go for anything against Kitana. She is also good enough in air-to-airs that jumping in on her is a bad idea. Combined with the suggested 3-frame parry, this is overdoing it.

IDK what tournaments that you're referring to...Also, don't forget that parries are still a risk no matter how quick they are.

 

[DDutchguy]

IDK what tournaments that you're referring to...Also, don't forget that parries are still a risk no matter how quick they are.

Sakron is the most notable Kitana at the moment. I do have to say that many have settled for Alien and the other top tiers in tournament for obvious reasons. This doesn't necessarily mean Kitana is in need of buffs however, she seems pretty solid to me.

Back to the parry, the difference with Kitana's parry is that she can hold it and cancel out of it whilst doing that relatively safely (in practice the recovery on parry seems quite low). The main way you'd punish a parry is with a low, but if this buff happens her parry will become an overly powerful mind game.

 

[SonicNinja3532]

IDK what tournaments that you're referring to...Also, don't forget that parries are still a risk no matter how quick they are.

Doesn't kitana's have insanely good whiff recovery anyway? Considering you can hold her parry which no other parry character can do iirc, hers is a cut above some of the others, and with the changes you suggest it becomes the best parry in the game arguably(or at least tied with kotal depending on how you wanna look at it). I'm no kitana expert by any means, but I know enough to say that these changes aren't the greatest of ideas. Either have 3 frame startup or parry lows, one or the other.

 

[KH StarCharger]

Sakron is the most notable Kitana at the moment. I do have to say that many have settled for Alien and the other top tiers in tournament for obvious reasons. This doesn't necessarily mean Kitana is in need of buffs however, she seems pretty solid to me.

Back to the parry, the difference with Kitana's parry is that she can hold it and cancel out of it whilst doing that relatively safely (in practice the recovery on parry seems quite low). The main way you'd punish a parry is with a low, but if this buff happens her parry will become an overly powerful mind game.

I haven't seen Sakron go wire to wire with her to win an offline major. Then again I'm definitely not doubting his skill. Still here in America, good luck seeing her win as is.

TO the parry, one thing I didn't mention was that if she did get a low option, that option would lose to mids, throws, jumpins etc. Really, once you see her go into parry mode, you should know how to get around her.

 

[DDutchguy]

I haven't seen Sakron go wire to wire with her to win an offline major. Then again I'm definitely not doubting his skill. Still here in America, good luck seeing her win as is.

TO the parry, one thing I didn't mention was that if she did get a low option, that option would lose to mids, throws, jumpins etc. Really, once you see her go into parry mode, you should know how to get around her.

Oh wait you mean an alternative mode that only blocks lows? That sounds far less broke than what I thought. It sounded like you wanted the regular parry to also parry lows.