Poison Ivy Tech - Kiss of Death + Bed of Thrones Combo

[Roy Arkon]

I found a Poison Ivy guide from TrueUnderDawgGaming, and in his guide he mentioned something that I'm not sure that many people are aware of. So I've decided to check it out and share it with you.

It turns out that when you grab someone with the Kiss of Death Command Grab while the Bed of Thrones Special is active, the opponent will still keep getting damage from the thrones and even after Ivy releases the opponent from the Kiss of Death until the Bed of Thrones is gone completely.

I don't have any full combos or setups with it ATM, but I thought people should know about this, maybe it can lead to some nasty corner setups.

Enjoy

 

[myri]

I mean yeah, I felt like this was kind of a given, the problem is that there aren't any good ways (so far at least) to setup into thorns. That plus the damage is pretty forgettable anyway.

 

[xKhaoTik]

How is this tech? Thorns are out and they're being kissed while standing on thorns. That's kinda common sense lol

Plus this combo is super unviable

 

[Roy Arkon]

I mean yeah, I felt like this was kind of a given, the problem is that there aren't any good ways (so far at least) to setup into thorns. That plus the damage is pretty forgettable anyway.

How is this tech? Thorns are out and they're being kissed while standing on thorns. That's kinda common sense lol

Plus this combo is super unviable

Yes I know that it doesn't look that practical or helpful at the moment, but I thought it will be good to let people know about it. And TBH I personally didn't take it as a given, and I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one.

Regardless, just wanted to share it.

 

[Lokheit]

Thorns are too slow to set up and even if they were faster, the damage is laughable, you'r not really getting a noticeable reward from adding damage equal to half a Drill that will be reduced because DOT is also affected by damage scaling if the ticks come during a combo.

 

[Roy Arkon]

Thorns are too slow to set up and even if they were faster, the damage is laughable, you'r not really getting a noticeable reward from adding damage equal to half a Drill that will be reduced because DOT is also affected by damage scaling if the ticks come during a combo.

Well at least I've just shown is there. People say it is given but it's not necessarily so, there are some characters in NRS games that it isn't there, that's why I've decided to show this. I'm fully aware that the damage from Thrones is very low.

 

[Lokheit]

Well at least I've just shown is there. People say it is given but it's not necessarily so, there are some characters in NRS games that it isn't there, that's why I've decided to show this. I'm fully aware that the damage from Thrones is very low.

This was known since MKX though, with Erron and Reptile doing the same. Thanks for sharing for those that didn't know.

 

[Roy Arkon]

This was known since MKX though, with Erron and Reptile doing the same. Thanks for sharing for those that didn't know.

Actually Reptile's Acid Puddle and Erron Black's Caltrops didn't work the same. Reptile's Acid Puddle would deal damage only if the opponent stands in the Puddle, and if Reptile would hang him in the air above the puddle with a throw or the F21+Grab String (as well as hanging him by the neck above the puddle with the Grab part of that String), the Puddle won't deal extra damage due to the hitbox and hurtbox properties of the Puddle and the opponent during such moves. On the other hand, if Erron Black would catch the opponent with his Command Grab and he would land exactly on the Caltrops, the opponent would take damage from both the Command Grab and Caltrops at the same time. That's because the hitbox and hurtbox properties of of the moves and the opponent work differently then in the case of Reptile's moves. @G4S J360 explained that in the past.

That's why i felt I should've show that it works for Poison Ivy in that way, as every DOT + Grab String/Command Grab combo works differently then one another.

 

[Lokheit]

Actually Reptile's Acid Puddle and Erron Black's Caltrops didn't work the same. Reptile's Acid Puddle would deal damage only if the opponent stands in the Puddle, and if Reptile would hang him in the air above the puddle with a throw or the F21+Grab String (as well as hanging him by the neck above the puddle with the Grab part of that String), the Puddle won't deal extra damage due to the hitbox and hurtbox properties of the Puddle and the opponent during such moves. On the other hand, if Erron Black would catch the opponent with his Command Grab and he would land exactly on the Caltrops, the opponent would take damage from both the Command Grab and Caltrops at the same time. That's because the hitbox and hurtbox properties of of the moves and the opponent work differently then in the case of Reptile's moves. @G4S J360 explained that in the past.

That's why i felt I should've show that it works for Poison Ivy in that way, as every DOT + Grab String/Command Grab combo works differently then one another.

Isn't that EXACTLY what happens in the video with Ivy? I made the comparison because it's the exact same.

Thorns, exactly like caltrops and puddle, only hit while the opponent is grounded. Ivy's regular throw won't tick because she gets them into the air, Ivy's command throw ticks because they're grounded, just like happened with Erron. Is the exact same thing: Opponent is grounded, then he takes damage like always, opponent isn't grounded, opponent doesn't take damage like always. I don't know what that technique adds really that wasn't obvious. The thorns will also tick while the opponent is being hit by a grounded string, or if he's just standing there or anything like that.

And as I said before, damage scaling affects thorns anyway (it also affected caltrops and puddle in MKX) so the already laughable damage is even worse.

 

[Roy Arkon]

Isn't that EXACTLY what happens in the video with Ivy? I made the comparison because it's the exact same.

Thorns, exactly like caltrops and puddle, only hit while the opponent is grounded. Ivy's regular throw won't tick because she gets them into the air, Ivy's command throw ticks because they're grounded, just like happened with Erron. Is the exact same thing: Opponent is grounded, then he takes damage like always, opponent isn't grounded, opponent doesn't take damage like always. I don't know what that technique adds really that wasn't obvious. The thorns will also tick while the opponent is being hit by a grounded string, or if he's just standing there or anything like that.

And as I said before, damage scaling affects thorns anyway (it also affected caltrops and puddle in MKX) so the already laughable damage is even worse.

On that part you're right, but I still felt like I should've shown that, as like I said, not every combo of that type is gonna work exactly the same (again with the Erron Black example), just in case.

 

[omooba]

cool didn't think of that. too everyone saying it's useless... that's 25% unclashable bruh
if you can get it out after ex command grab and be decently plus well then hell yeah it's useful

 

[Lokheit]

cool didn't think of that. too everyone saying it's useless... that's 25% unclashable bruh
if you can get it out after ex command grab and be decently plus well then hell yeah it's useful

You mean 2.5%, not 25% And that's assuming they stand there for the whole thing (MB Kiss into thorns is almost 0 advantage so they can move and you can't keep the combo or anything).

 

[omooba]

You mean 2.5%, not 25% And that's assuming they stand there for the whole thing (MB Kiss into thorns is almost 0 advantage so they can move and you can't keep the combo or anything).

no YOU mean 2.5% EXTRA damage i mean 25% total. and what's the hit advantage exactly cus so far all you've said is it's plus. you don't need the combo who just need a reason for them to keep standing. and if they jump read that with an anti into the grab(even if the grab is clashable at this point they still have to be ready) like bruh when we get to that point in the game where your life is really low the fact that this is doing dmg over time that makes you want to jump creates a decent amount of mind games for it to be useful. i'm definitely feeling it

 

[Lokheit]

no YOU mean 2.5% EXTRA damage i mean 25% total. and what's the hit advantage exactly cus so far all you've said is it's plus. you don't need the combo who just need a reason for them to keep standing. and if they jump read that with an anti into the grab(even if the grab is clashable at this point they still have to be ready) like bruh when we get to that point in the game where your life is really low the fact that this is doing dmg over time that makes you want to jump creates a decent amount of mind games for it to be useful. i'm definitely feeling it

Then you have me confused at that 25% unclashable because any previous combo is clashable like any combo in the game. Kiss MB into thorns won't allow you to continue a combo and for what I've seen is like +1. They don't have to stand there if they don't want.

And a single tick is like 0.5% damage of a health bar (put opponents at 1% health in practice mode, they won't die from a single tick), 2.5% total is if they stay for the whole thing so you're not getting +2.5 anyway. Thorns is useless and takes forever to cast.

 

[Roy Arkon]

I

Kiss MB into thorns won't allow you to continue a combo and for what I've seen is like +1. They don't have to stand there if they don't want.

I just wanna clear something, in the video what I did was Thrones and then the Kiss grab, not the other way around.

 

[Lokheit]

I

I just wanna clear something, in the video what I did was Thrones and then the Kiss grab, not the other way around.

That's an even less realistic setup. You get yourself open for a century so they can punish you for doing thorns without even getting advantage. The move list frame data is wrong (it says the move is 38 frames but it's almost 60).

 

[Roy Arkon]

That's an even less realistic setup. You get yourself open for a century so they can punish you for doing thorns without even getting advantage. The move list frame data is wrong (it says the move is 38 frames but it's almost 60).

Are you sure it is wrong?

 

[Lokheit]

Are you sure it is wrong?

I tested it, it's totally wrong. If it was 38 you could do Kiss MB, thorns, and keep a combo. You can trait or bark skin and keep a combo (and those are 51 frames), but thorns won't continue the combo.

 

[Reauxbot]

Jeez he was just trying to show everyone something in case others didn't know....
TYM seems pretty different than it did before.
Lol.
Good stuff anyways my dude. I sure did not know about this.

 

[Lokheit]

@omooba ok I see the confusion with you thinking it was 25% unclashable. Look at the character levels, that damage is not real (I wasn't even looking at it). Even then the whole thing is too slow to setup (thorns, then grab is around 70 frames).

 

[omooba]

@omooba ok I see the confusion with you thinking it was 25% unclashable. Look at the character levels, that damage is not real (I wasn't even looking at it). Even then the whole thing (thorns, then grab is around 70 frames).

ooooooh ok nevermind then. now that i think about it 20% command grab isn't normal. maaaan we really need to stop with these non competitive mode videos or at least a disclaimer in the thread. we could've gone back and forth for hours before noticing

 

[Roy Arkon]

@omooba ok I see the confusion with you thinking it was 25% unclashable. Look at the character levels, that damage is not real (I wasn't even looking at it). Even then the whole thing is too slow to setup (thorns, then grab is around 70 frames).

Oh shit I forgot about the character levels. I should've do this with my Catwoman rather then Gorilla Grodd, she is at level 20 just like my Poison Ivy. But I think the whole idea is still presented in general. I will just have to take it into an account from now on.

 

[Lokheit]

Oh shit I forgot about the character levels. I should've do this with my Catwoman rather then Gorilla Grodd, she is at level 20 just like my Poison Ivy. But I think the whole idea is still presented in general. I will just have to take it into an account from now on.

You can get them as lvl 20 in training mode if you press 1 (square or A) and then L1 when selecting a map. Hope it helps

 

[Roy Arkon]

You can get them as lvl 20 in training mode if you press 1 (square or A) and then L1 when selecting a map. Hope it helps

I just checked it and it works, i also repeated the kiss grab and thrones and while the damage itsels is obviously a lot smaller to what I showed in my vid, I could've still see the differences in damage with each scenario to that level. I will just have to be careful with that from now on, thanks so much dude.