What's new

"Perfect Guard" a possible mechanic to implement on future MK games

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
What do you guys think if a future MK game introduced a "perfect guard" system?

It would consist on pressing the block button 1 frame away of an impact on your character making it possible to negate: Chip, meter build and come out of blocking 1 frame earlier.

What pros and cons do you think this mechanic?
 

omooba

fear the moobs
would make it so plus frames aren't that nasty. would probably make some gapless strings have gaps. would be a very cool mechanic
 

Marinjuana

Up rock incoming, ETA 5 minutes
Would I have to timed block for every hit in a string? What about characters that are more reliant on chip in general? Couldn't this nullify chip to death situations? Also just seems like it would be kind of an annoyance to use properly.
 

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
Would I have to timed block for every hit in a string? What about characters that are more reliant on chip in general? Couldn't this nullify chip to death situations? Also just seems like it would be kind of an annoyance to use properly.
Yes a timed block for every hit on a string.
So characters reliant on chip would still be doable, considering the perfect guard would only be active on perfect frame guarding.
It would definitely be annoying but very rewarding as well if you think about it. For example:

A character that lacks a 11f punish cannot punish a -11 move, if is fastest execution frames is 12f, but if he perfect guards this same attack he gets to punish this move he couldn't punish before.
 

smokey

EX Ovi should launch
Make it like just guard from SCV. You lose like all of the blockstun from the move you just guard, so it makes a lot of strings useless when you learn timings properly. For example when Lao uses 112124 you will block the first bit and JG the 4 on the end, making it punishable etc. Im not sure if this matters much in MK because of special cancels and stuff, but its pretty cool defensive mechanic.

 

DDutchguy

Stand 4'ing airplanes out of the sky
That's actually quite a nice idea, it helps with seeing who a skilled player is and who isn't. The link would indeed have to be 1 frame however, to prevent high level play from becoming too much about perfect blocking.
 

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
Make it like just guard from SCV. You lose like all of the blockstun from the move you just guard, so it makes a lot of strings useless when you learn timings properly. For example when Lao uses 112124 you will block the first bit and JG the 4 on the end, making it punishable etc. Im not sure if this matters much in MK because of special cancels and stuff, but its pretty cool defensive mechanic.

Making most of the strings useless would originate a lot of troubles in the future, that is why i suggested just a few things to not overthrow the general rules of pressure or so.
Coming out of block one frame earlier is like a sort of reversal, negating chip and meter build its good enough of advantage over pressure character, zoning characters and meter dependent characters.
 

smokey

EX Ovi should launch
Making most of the strings useless would originate a lot of troubles in the future, that is why i suggested just a few things to not overthrow the general rules of pressure or so.
Coming out of block one frame earlier is like a sort of reversal, negating chip and meter build its good enough of advantage over pressure character, zoning characters and meter dependent characters.
Bit of a waste of time 1 frame less blockstun, chip negating and meter negating..the risk reward is really not in your favour there, especially with special moves. You go to Perfect guard a 3 hit string of cassies and she notices you doing it, does a flip instead of the last hit, gg you got launched because you wanted to avoid 0.4% chip and 1/8th of a bar of meter and be -2 on block instead of -1...
The JG mechanic in SCV at a high level is meant to cause trouble. It makes certain strings dumb to even attempt, meaning you wont take that chip and they wont gain the meter because they get straight up punished for even trying. Makes going for jump ins harder because you can negate their blockstun. Looping shit into itself is gone. It even makes mindgame after you get HIT by a poke. Your opponent wants to follow up with their mids and has to risk you getting out or punishing with that, they have to mix up their options, go for throws or slower less conventional attacks to mess with your timing.

Certain EX specials with a second hit delay would be easy to JG and negate the chip, kit fans, mileena EX sai, erron black stance lows, cage green balls, Kano EX knives, Ex nutpunch, dvorah EX stabs, dvorah f112 would be a risk to use even because you know the timing on the JG to make her +12 cancel now to make her risk something.
Anything predictable becomes a risk, and messing up the JG timing or being baited is a fair balance to that risk. At super high level the game becomes a lot more solved, you cant go yolo and you cant play on a flowchart.
 

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
Bit of a waste of time 1 frame less blockstun, chip negating and meter negating..the risk reward is really not in your favour there, especially with special moves. You go to Perfect guard a 3 hit string of cassies and she notices you doing it, does a flip instead of the last hit, gg you got launched because you wanted to avoid 0.4% chip and 1/8th of a bar of meter and be -2 on block instead of -1...
The JG mechanic in SCV at a high level is meant to cause trouble. It makes certain strings dumb to even attempt, meaning you wont take that chip and they wont gain the meter because they get straight up punished for even trying. Makes going for jump ins harder because you can negate their blockstun. Looping shit into itself is gone. It even makes mindgame after you get HIT by a poke. Your opponent wants to follow up with their mids and has to risk you getting out or punishing with that, they have to mix up their options, go for throws or slower less conventional attacks to mess with your timing.

Certain EX specials with a second hit delay would be easy to JG and negate the chip, kit fans, mileena EX sai, erron black stance lows, cage green balls, Kano EX knives, Ex nutpunch, dvorah EX stabs, dvorah f112 would be a risk to use even because you know the timing on the JG to make her +12 cancel now to make her risk something.
Anything predictable becomes a risk, and messing up the JG timing or being baited is a fair balance to that risk. At super high level the game becomes a lot more solved, you cant go yolo and you cant play on a flowchart.
I think that's a bit too much, don't want to kill all the pressure in the game honestly.
 

smokey

EX Ovi should launch
I think that's a bit too much, don't want to kill all the pressure in the game honestly.
Doing a string into a +10 special and then doing the same string again isnt pressure and would be braindead easy to beat using Just Guard. Half the mixups in the game are 50/50s so you dont really lose that aspect because you still have to low/high guard.
Your suggestion is more similar to Instant Block in the GGxrd series, you block on the frame and you get 2 frames less blockstun and negate chip and a lot of pushback. Means you can poke out of strings or punish certain specials easier. In MK you could probably IB every string and special in the game easily because you can recognise the whole strings timing from the first button they push, meaning the whole cast becomes 2 frame more punishable and chip goes out of the window. Might as well just get ed boon to universally give everyone 2 frames less blockstun and take chip out of anything that has more than 1 hit.
 

AK Stormthegates

WOOLAY!!!!
Would be hard to implement without completely erasing certain characters from competitive play in mk since NRS has a nasty habit of only making 1 or 2 strings viable pressure tools. Works in Soul Calibur because you can use alot of tools in the moveset and gear because the system direction is so massive your character has more options than one move.
 

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
Might as well just get ed boon to universally give everyone 2 frames less blockstun and take chip out of anything that has more than 1 hit.
Mk is also a game that relies on pressure characters, not sure if i'm not expressing myself correctly, doing what you suggest kills the entire concept of pressure characters and so on, is more of a mechanic that can come out good when rightfully used, not something to block and punishing anything you feel like doing so because you have an imperative mechanic that negates offense almost as useless and make some characters extremely hard to rely on their reliable tools.

If a cassie wants to cancel her string into flip that's a risk she has to take considering its still punishable if blocked.

But it would be awesome to negate, chip, meter and come out one frame faster if we timed that correctly on fired projectiles, making timed punishes 1 frame faster, and safe pokes 1 frame unsafe, create gaps on certain strings etc etc.

It may sound like just a little, but it adds alot more depth into the game, without making it imperative about anything else, these things IMO should be carefully planned to not have a future consequence we currently face with MKX and its jump ins, backdashes costing stamina, the universal breaker nerf hurting certain characters, blah blah blah etc. (End of Thinking Capacity :D)
 

Indecisive

We'll burn you all—that is your fate!
This is eh. If you have multi hitting strings it makes it harder to deal with to some extent possibly. How are you going to perfect block when you are are already in block stun. Also they could just make 11 frames move be able to punish -11 moves like in injustice or you know other fighting games
 

Name v.5.0

Iowa's Finest.
I think the mechanic in theory is good, but when there's a 3 frame window of error built into the online matches, this mechanic will be less skill based, and more luck based.
 

Wetdoba

All too easy...
Just turn the block button a universal parry button and MK might feel more like a magical kung fu fighter than the slugfest that is MKX. Oh and never restrict my ability to backdash out of stupid pressure again. I want to feel lile Ip man parrying every individual strike on defense, not just stand in one spot holding block while I eat a bunch of shit into mix ups and endless plus frames and then guess on random armor, that is not how defensve martial arts work. Theres ducking and weaving, counters, dodging, ect. Im almost imagining my perfect MK game as like a 2D version of tekken footsies but with the classic MK style special moves. Just make the game more neutral based and make defense great again.
 
Last edited:

Shade667

#StrongisthenewCute
Would I have to timed block for every hit in a string? What about characters that are more reliant on chip in general? Couldn't this nullify chip to death situations? Also just seems like it would be kind of an annoyance to use properly.
Imo no game should have chip to death.

Im all for it. Sounds super neat.

Also to add, not sure if it would fit in mkx currently, but the OP did state future game.
 

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
Damn MKX has scarred this community for life lmao. People are so afraid of chip and meter build now.

Everyone was perfectly happy with all that in MK9.
Its not that, i gets really tiresome relying mostly on armor as your defense mechanic, the backdashes are a welcoming add, but then you have long range hitting disjointed hitboxes, and advancing strings with abnormal ranges.

Even if NRS could balance their future game on those aspects, having a mechanic that doesn't kill chip and meter built in general, but still helps a solid defense for those wiling to live a bit longer and not die against characters like Takeda guaranteed chip pressure or Skarlet like pressure would still have a fighting chance and make the game more depth itself.
 

Braindead

I want Kronika to step on my face
Cough cough

Kabal and Cage

Sure it wasn't no where as bad but it was complained about
Kabal was Kabal. Everyone complained about everything about him lol.
Yeah people complained about Cage but it was just meh.

People now just freak about about chip damage and pressure.
 

HGTV Soapboxfan

"Always a Pleasure"
I say no. Either this becomes something that people just get lucky with and it adds to the chaos of the match instead of adding to the strategy, or it becomes consistently used and it adds a pointless execution barrier to the game.