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New Anti Character Guide Topic-Reptile added

dreemernj

Ambassador
New Anti-Character Guide Thread

From the original topic:
abc ur dead0 said:
When is this going to get done? Maybe we can start working on it as a whole community. Maybe once someone does one character, it'll attract attention and get other people to start working on the other characters. I personally feel this has been put off for to long. I think i'm going to start working on it myself. Anyone want to help?
Let's try this again. Stay on target.
 
I was off target? I gave anti-Kabal tips using Hanzo as an example. Running karajabs and double blocks are essential against expert Kabals.

I don't know why you felt the need to close the first topic. What's wrong with having a little fun? As long as the thread goes back on track there's no reason to lock topics. You're just killing your own forum imo. But whatever, you're the boss.

Keep us posted abc :)
 

Shock

Administrator
Premium Supporter
The problem is the only fun people seem to have on here is explaining in words why they are better, or assuming they are without having played people in person. When that happens, people get offended because this site is primarily about playing the game. For now stick to tips about beating or challenging the best tactics linked to the characters, and not the players who use them.
 

dreemernj

Ambassador
I was off target? I gave anti-Kabal tips using Hanzo as an example. Running karajabs and double blocks are essential against expert Kabals.

I don't know why you felt the need to close the first topic. What's wrong with having a little fun? As long as the thread goes back on track there's no reason to lock topics. You're just killing your own forum imo. But whatever, you're the boss.

Keep us posted abc :)
3 pages of bullshit isn't fun when it's a thread about anti-character guides. Anti-character guides would be cool, silly endless posturing is just a waste of time.
 
Wait What?

*checks old thread*

Oh :|


Been busy lately, I'll start writing tomorrow. So far I've got,

.Relaunch, who can do who

.Special moves and which character's moves are better than others

.Add a Grid area somewhere

.If one character does this, then another can get a free... X

.Which character's base moves are better against others(RH, HP, ect)


I might do one character tonight, maybe start from the bottom up. I'll start with Sheeva as an example, and have Shock or ded or Dreemer check for mistakes and make sure all of the info is correct.
 
Maybe we need a more qualified person to do them.
Your welcome to help.



Anyways







Wrote this as a first draft. What should I add to this, what should I change, and what should I leave out? Leave some input please.

Sheeva is Ranked number 23 in UMK3, dead last. Her hitboxes are very odd making her able to be relaunched by everyone except Mileena. Male Ninja's are not the best characters to be used against her because she get's a free Uppercut after a Throw, however, H Smoke, Ermac, and Scorpion can wake up and get a free Teleport before the ground stomp hits the ground. Kabal's Spin and Kano's Cannonball can do this as well. Like Shang, alot of juggles don't work as well because of her odd hitboxes. If playing as Reptile it's very difficult to juggle her off the 3 hit pop up. Max hit's you can get against Sheeva with Reptile is HPX6 Plus uppercut. Off a Forceball you can get HPX9 Plus uppercut. Sub Zero is a good counter for her. His combo's aren't affected by her hitboxes and his ice clone can stop her Teleport stomp cold, and set her up for a 50%+ Corner combo. The Jump back technique of the Ice Clone also helps. Kung Lao has some trouble Juggling her. Lui Kang and Kabal can both do an AFB infinite in the corner on Sheeva.

Kabal-10

H Smoke-7

Kung-7

Kano-9

Reptile-8

Ermac-7

Nightwolf-8

Robo Smoke-8

Sindel-8

Jax-8

Sonya-8

Kitana-7

Stryker-6

Scorpion-6

UnSub-10

Jade-7

Lui Kang-6

Sektor-7

C Sub-8

Cyrax-8

Shang-4

Mileena-4

Sheeva-5
 
Sweet.

You forgot to mention Reptile's Dash (as a +) which gives you a big speed advantage and helps you evade/counter Sheeva's Jump Kick, Jump Stomp and Ground Shake. And the ninja slides are helpfull against Sheeva's annoying HK and RH. Female ninjas are somewhat advantaged by their small collision boxes. So Sheeva's auto-combo and roundhouse often miss the target. In addition to a small collision box, Kitana has great wake up/anti-air moves at her disposal. Sonya's bicycle kick can counter HK, RH and Jump Stomp. And her quick and unusually long toe taps are almost invulnerable.
 

RoGE

Noob
I was thinking you could do a grid with each character and number 1-10 of how well that character would do against the other character.
 
You know what, fuck you guys. I tried doing something for the community and got shot down. I asked for tons of help. If it's so bad, then give me suggestions to make it better, then just suggesting that someone else do it. I asked if Shock would do this ages ago, but it was delayed and delayed. I decided to pick it up myself and try and do something, hell with enough support maybe we could of made it as a community. I got close to nothing. Just Lock this.
 

Shock

Administrator
Premium Supporter
Just start adding stuff and we can then put it in the original post as we go to keep track of the pertinent stuff. There's no reason for me to sit down and go through each character on my own and throw it up there. I didn't do that with the strategy guides. I took a chunk of Lex's stuff, talked about it with ded_ and did them that way. It is combined knowledge from many players and it's not like "Shock's guide to UMK3" as many people think. I don't specialize in every single character in UMK3 but I do often random select, and people get made if they don't see me use the character guide info to their fullest potential every time I'm in a match because they assume all the guide stuff is directly my knowledge. Some of it is just things I have been told, or have seen used consistently that work. I put the guides into words and applied some "eloquence", about 90% of the total effort. "Since this is in the wiki section, it's for everyone to contribute to. Whatever is valid will be added.
 
You know what, fuck you guys. I tried doing something for the community and got shot down. I asked for tons of help. If it's so bad, then give me suggestions to make it better, then just suggesting that someone else do it. I asked if Shock would do this ages ago, but it was delayed and delayed. I decided to pick it up myself and try and do something, hell with enough support maybe we could of made it as a community. I got close to nothing. Just Lock this.
Abc, can you explain this to me. I'm really lost by the whole + - next to everyones names. Sorry I wasn't here for the original thread.
 
LOL ABC's mad :) What do expect everyone to come running right away? Me and Dubson are fucking with you r-tard. This is gonna take awhile so just calm down. Damn, was I that impatient when I was 12?
 

ded

Elder God
good stuff abc, you can add that sheeva is the most vulnerable character for the corner inf trap even if block ducked, which is huge weakness for her, trap her in corner and you might win just by cheap damage. alot of combos work only on her but others which are standart dont (usub inf for ex). i will check this thread and can add some stuff from time to time
 
You know what, fuck you guys. I tried doing something for the community and got shot down. I asked for tons of help. If it's so bad, then give me suggestions to make it better, then just suggesting that someone else do it. I asked if Shock would do this ages ago, but it was delayed and delayed. I decided to pick it up myself and try and do something, hell with enough support maybe we could of made it as a community. I got close to nothing. Just Lock this.
This is good work. Keep up at it and don't let them discourage you. I like the potential this thread has. Someone posts a general counter guide then we can all comment on it for possible improvements or corrections.

On that note, I don't really have anything to contribute on countering Sheeva because, well, usually no one good picks her. So my experience against Sheeva is lackluster at best. I usually counter-pick her with Kitana though and have good success.
 
Sheeva's good against "slower" characters like Cyrax, Kung Lao, Jax, Sindel, Stryker and Sektor. She has longer reach than everyone else so her high kicks and roundhouse are her most dangerous weapons.

So do we do another character now or what? Who's next? Cyrax? Okay let's do Cyrax. Sonya, Mileena, Kitana, Sub-Zero and teleporters are the best counter for him. Because Cyrax relies on bomb set ups and web combos and they all can easily evade Cyrax's moves with simple wake ups and anti-air moves (like the flying punch and the teleport punch for example). Cyrax's good against Shang-Tsung, Jax, Reptile, Kano, Kung Lao and Kabal. Although Kabal's dash spin is very handy to counter/evade bomb set ups. Cyrax is also a good counter for defensive players because his bombs are unblockable. And that forces the other player to move around and lower their guard for a short period.

Now you give more details :)
 

Dreamcatcher

EFL Founder
all right ill help out i suppose.

Sheeva's good against "slower" characters like Cyrax, Kung Lao, Jax, Sindel, Stryker and Sektor. She has longer reach than everyone else so her high kicks and roundhouse are her most dangerous weapons.

So do we do another character now or what? Who's next? Cyrax? Okay let's do Cyrax. Sonya, Mileena, Kitana, Sub-Zero and teleporters are the best counter for him. Because Cyrax relies on bomb set ups and web combos and they all can easily evade Cyrax's moves with simple wake ups and anti-air moves (like the flying punch and the teleport punch for example). Cyrax's good against Shang-Tsung, Jax, Reptile, Kano, Kung Lao and Kabal. Although Kabal's dash spin is very handy to counter/evade bomb set ups. Cyrax is also a good counter for defensive players because his bombs are unblockable. And that forces the other player to move around and lower their guard for a short period.

Now you give more details :)

i agree with pretty much all of this except the flying punch part. sonya and kitana are just to slow on their punches to be considered feared full screen by cyrax. by the time they land or are about to, free uppercut, or preferably rh into bomb/net setups. if im incorrect somehow, please point out. this is my experience...id launch a net full screen and a kitana/sonya would wave punch. my recover frames would end and id have a free hit. might be only when launching an early net. also, some characters with smaller box collision(female ninjas/shang especially) require a touch more precise timing for the air throw from what i noticed. this should be a no brainer...just like shooting at a smaller target at a range. cyrax takes sindel afb spammers out of the sky with the air throw. it needs to be timed just as they leave the ground and not abused, as anyone will catch on with a countering jk instead. smaller characters are able to get multiple aaNet and aaHP with good timing. JUST trying to help. please dont mistake this information as anything but assistance. ;)
 

Dreamcatcher

EFL Founder
all right guys, lets fuckin go! we need to jump on this, it would be a great addition to the site imo. ill begin working on extensive anti jade and cyrax shit. but we gotta get goin or were gonna fall asleep on this when its a great idea and opportunity.
 

Dreamcatcher

EFL Founder
okay, here's my take on jade. it's a small intro and very deep per the first three characters against and vs jade. no ratings on usefulness or difficulty yet because im not sure about your standards. (+, -, etc.) if requested i could just upload the thing in pieces instead of putting up huge walls of text. either way, i hope you enjoy. im puttin my heart into this. :)



Jade is possibly the most generally unused and hated character online for any console/setup. For this reason alone, it makes her dangerously underestimated in the fact that many average players don't encounter a skilled Jade player enough, and thus lack some countering techniques against her that prove vital. She has at her disposal very underrated and somewhat broken specials and a decent otg combo with great run-jab potential. In the corner, she's able to do surprisingly high counter damage that is VERY difficult to setup, yet still a big plus for the competitive player.

Kitana
---
AGAINST: The first thing you need to get into your head is the PP (projectile protection special) can NOT protect against the fan lift. If you are too aggresive in rushing down countering fans, your opponent will be able to play cat and mouse with you for the duration of the match. Patience and boomerangs will provide your win. Keep your distance and allow the player to throw their midair fans, and obviously anticipate this with PP immediately followed by a returning boomerang. The only options a distant Kitana has to counter this strategy is to rush you down or play dead/keep throwing fans. In the case of them rushing down, a smart player will be able to bait the dash kick out of you. Don't let that happen, as a blocked or ducked dash kick can lead to her fan lift and quick juggle damage. If you decide to turn the tables and surprise them with PP rush downs after fans, ONLY use the four hit auto. (hp, hp, d+lp, d+hp) Follow this with a sweep, but beware the wake up fan lift instead of going into run-jabs when they get up. You can bait their wake up by running in after the auto or sweep and blocking within a step of them. 9 times out of 10, the average player will put out the lift ill advised. And when they do, punish them for it.

VS JADE: You can count on an aggresive player to PP and rush you every time you throw a fan, and be able to capitilize on sweeping their anticipated autocombos/dash kicks. You must dictate the entire match with the fan lifts psychological advantage with an aggresive player. A lot of people underestimate Kitana's wake up ability and pay in the long run with incorrect run-jab and rushing strategies. If you fall to Jade's four hit auto w/sweep, give the fan lift a shot if they run in for jabs. If done quick enough and they don't block it, free juggle. If done too slow, they'll either block it or give the jab on you first and you won't be thrown, but will be in the ugly run-jab defense you'll want to get out of immediately against Jade. Being that close is dangerous, as the dash kick in the right hands (a lot like Kabal's spin) can be unstoppable. It's basically instantaneous and near impossible to bait on purpose. In conclusion, keep your distance with Kitana, and play dead on the boomerangs. Stay far enough away so a low boomer won't hit you, throw a fan, use the fan lift any chance it's open.
===
Reptile
---
AGAINST: Rep possesses the uncanny ability to blow a scrub's mind with forceballs. Luckily, Jade's PP can blow that offensive strategy right out of the water. An average player that depends on forceballs at a distance will pay by eating Jade's rush down four hitter. A smart player, however, will almost fake the forceballs by backing up. (like a Robot Smoke spear) This technique can bait out Jade's rush down for them to popup into a juggle, so don't be so eager in the full screen. The boomerang isn't a whole lot faster than a slow forceball and definitely sluggish compared to a fast ball. Since recovering from a boomerang hit doesn't take any more than a second. Mix up the PP returning boomerang with the PP rushdown to dash kick. Confusing a Rep player on any level takes one or two mixed counters of these, then they'll fall apart trying to read you. After that, it's just a lucky popup or forceball to a juggle. Psyche. Them. Out. They attempt the auto after a ducked dash, uppercut as fast as you can. The auto won't usually have the upper hand after a failed popup from a countered dash kick. The reason for this is because they'll keep tapping hp to start the combo. So, uppercut to prevent the popup or throw.

VS JADE: Repeat after me, ONLY USE A FORCEBALL RIGHT WHEN JADE'S PP wears off. To use an open slow or forceball mid to full screen against Jade is plain idiotic. Not only can the player just jump over it into her otg, but she has a special that allows her to run through it and go insane on you. You can't predict exactly when the dash kick comes in rush down, but when it does, go into runjabs. When/if you land a throw on Jade, see if they jump towards you before deciding your next move. If they don't jump, a slow forceball is actually advised. A lot of times, a player will mess up the PP button input getting up from a throw. Then when you put out the forceball, they'll jump over it instead. Roundhouse them onto the forceball if possible to set up a aaHP, aaHP, fast forceball, into a juggle. Don't necessarily abuse the slide, but use with caution against the midscreen Jade. If you keep the aggresive player mid to full screen, they likely become impatient and throw a return boomer. Sliding with good timing helps make the player even more impatient and they'll fall into "Sleep Over" dash punches or jump into otherwise foolish forceball situations you need to capitilize on in order to win. Don't use the dash punch for anything except juggles or if you can't create an anti-air juggle setup. Fake the forceballs, force mistakes.
===
Sonya
---
AGAINST: The leg grab sucks to defend when almost abused playing with any character. Take this into account when you use the dash kick, you will probably get a leg grab on you. So be cautious with the kick, just as if you were playing a character with containment. The majority of skilled Sonya players will play dead and stand full screen shooting rings at you, waiting for you to make your mistake. PP is useful against this strategy if close enough to capitilize with an otg combo. If you're too far away, play their card and cause them to make the mistake of impatient rushdowns/leg grabs. Stay away when they shoot the rings and play with PP and return boomerangs. If they abandon the full screen going into rush down, throw a return every time. Sonya is one of the characters that are almost just two-dimensional. Other than the rings, all her damage is very close melee related. If they run through the return they'll start the auto, but be interrupted by the boomer coming back. If they jump over it, step back and sweep followed by runjabs and mixed otg/knee starters. Never, NEVER finish a knee combo that's blocked. Like many other autos when blocked, the last hit pushes the opponent too far back to return to a runjab strategy. Keep Sonya close when you can with runjabs, mix it with ducked blocks as the leg grab can break this strat very quickly. In the end, if you don't fall into any traps and rarely jump, Sonya is almost useless against Jade in competition.

VS JADE: You're essentially screwed beyond belief if you think you're going to win by playing dead. The only way Sonya is going to land an anti air hit on Jade is against poor ring counters when they should have just used PP. Don't even try to use the auto with Sonya to counter a ducked dash kick, the leg grab is the way to go. The best chance you have to win against a smart Jade player is to take the dash kick and boomerangs out of the game by fake ducking most of the time. Any idiot knows how quickly the leg grab can come while the player is ducking and they'll keep their distance. The downside to this strategy is that your offense is obviously killed outside sweep distance and Jade can throw a low boomer to catch you off guard. Block a low boomer when you spot it, rush in a bit more and fake duck if you can't get close enough to auto/leg grab. Get too close and the dash kick will often come, leg grab, run in for runjabs. If you're brave, you can try the wave punch after a sluggish boomerang at about mid screen. This way when you land, you're not too close to be uppercutted after recovery and not to far that it did you know good. Done correctly will put you at about sweep distance and leg grab capable. Abuse the grab as much as you can, it's the only special you can rely on. But don't forget that it's one of the easiest moves to punish when blocked.

EDIT: Feedback is very helpful. :)
 
Dreamcatcher: My anti Laziness.

Very nice man. Several Anti Jade techniques in there. Don't forget to add that kabal is probably the best to use on her because the Spin gets her even if she does the PP. The + and - System is pretty basic. 2 +s mean, this is basically the best character to use. A counter pick. H Smoke on Reptile for example. Reptile would be a -- against H smoke, but H Smoke would be a ++ as a counter for Reptile. So For Jade, anyone that relies on projectiles as a strategy, or as an important part of their move set would get a Minus. a +- would be used for an OK counter. For example.

For Jade

Kabal ++

Kung Lao +-

Reptile --

H Smoke +

ect.

Thanks for the help man. I PROMISE I'll do Cyrax tomorrow.