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My Changes to Deadshot

so an interesting nerf i think for mb rifle would be to nerf it so it can only be meter burned on block after the first shot. It's used way to easily as a safety net, blows up most mb rolls or jumps because you'll get hit by the proceeding shots.

i think the second hit of b12 has no business being an overhead and that string should really not be staggerable. f1 should be the stagger string nothing else.

his bf1 should not really be nerfed, it's really strong, maybe meter build could be nerfed/ damage, but the pacing is essential for his niche as a zoner.

some of his zoning could nerfed as a tradeoff for amplifying his trait. it feels like the decision process for which trait to use isn't as rewarding or thought provoking as it should be. maybe red bullets should really amplify chip and blue on hit, and meter drain could be meter steal instead or stronger.
 

Invincible Salads

Seeker of knowledge
so an interesting nerf i think for mb rifle would be to nerf it so it can only be meter burned on block after the first shot. It's used way to easily as a safety net, blows up most mb rolls or jumps because you'll get hit by the proceeding shots.

i think the second hit of b12 has no business being an overhead and that string should really not be staggerable. f1 should be the stagger string nothing else.
it wouldnt be an issue if the whole string is mid tho, if thats the case i say let em stagger. dunno how i feel about your suggestion for rifle tho.
 
it wouldnt be an issue if the whole string is mid tho, if thats the case i say let em stagger. dunno how i feel about your suggestion for rifle tho.
to me having his 50/50s are okay, they are not super damaging and its kind of a risk and very positional to do f2 for him. It's the fact that b12u3 is still to easily staggerable, also a mixup, and even ridiculous to whiff punish because the up 3 portion is very fast retreats and has an anti-air hitbox. also it being cancellable on block is kind of a mixup in itself that doesn't need to be there. Deadshot can throw out singular back 1s or whiff the string to easily.

the nerf to mb rifle where it can't be meter burned if whiffed imo is good ebcause it makes it atleast outplayable on a read. it would still be very strong, have pushback and do great chip, but also would force the deadshot to play more of a guessing game with it with the opponent. In this state it's like whelp i have meter nothing they can do... chip chip chip, oh you meter burn rolled? has the shot punished you, you jumped? who gives a shit ur still eating the majority of my clip and getting pushed to the distance you want.
 

Invincible Salads

Seeker of knowledge
to me having his 50/50s are okay, they are not super damaging and its kind of a risk and very positional to do f2 for him. It's the fact that b12u3 is still to easily staggerable, also a mixup, and even ridiculous to whiff punish because the up 3 portion is very fast retreats and has an anti-air hitbox. also it being cancellable on block is kind of a mixup in itself that doesn't need to be there. Deadshot can throw out singular back 1s or whiff the string to easily.

the nerf to mb rifle where it can't be meter burned if whiffed imo is good ebcause it makes it atleast outplayable on a read. it would still be very strong, have pushback and do great chip, but also would force the deadshot to play more of a guessing game with it with the opponent. In this state it's like whelp i have meter nothing they can do... chip chip chip, oh you meter burn rolled? has the shot punished you, you jumped? who gives a shit ur still eating the majority of my clip and getting pushed to the distance you want.
id still prefer the staggerable mid string over having 50/50's, since it would give him more incentive to throw instead of trying to mix. dunno if i like that change to rifle tho.
 
id still prefer the staggerable mid string over having 50/50's, since it would give him more incentive to throw instead of trying to mix. dunno if i like that change to rifle tho.
shouldn't f1 be the staggerable string or another one of his mids? like one of the huge problems with nrs games is having too many poo poo strings without uses and one string that does everything. could have one for quick punishes, one for staggers, one for whiff punishing, a few for mixups but nah one string to rule them all.
 

Invincible Salads

Seeker of knowledge
shouldn't f1 be the staggerable string or another one of his mids? like one of the huge problems with nrs games is having too many poo poo strings without uses and one string that does everything. could have one for quick punishes, one for staggers, one for whiff punishing, a few for mixups but nah one string to rule them all.
well, f1 can be used to stagger a bit, but i see it as more of a quick punisher/counterpoking tool rather than a main stagger tool, b12 is and should stay his main stagger string, removing the stupidity that is the 50/50's makes it a lot more bearable.
 

Jelan

Aquaman is dead lel
Premium Supporter
Non-Deadshot player chiming in, I've read the suggestion here and there were some really good ones so far.

Rifle Shot not being MB-able on whiff would be fantastic to start with, allowing players to use MB rolls and jumps more successfully.

Straight shot is his bread and butter, it is quick, but that's the point, damage wise it's alright as well. What I'd like to see is it building less meter when missing. No need for less chip as he will need that damage because...

...the oh/low guessing should go. Staggerable mid string I'm fine with, but not with serious mixups from a keepaway design. I'm even hesitant to keep F2 as an overhead simply because how potent it is paired with D1. Maybe make B12 a mid-overhead? He will still have an overhead attack just not a nigh unreactable string/combo starter that could catch people off-guard and have options off of. F12 as mentioned above could be a mid-stagger string and the two of these would still make him quite potent up-close.

Make it so his wake-up can't be MB'd on block.
 

Invincible Salads

Seeker of knowledge
Non-Deadshot player chiming in, I've read the suggestion here and there were some really good ones so far.

Rifle Shot not being MB-able on whiff would be fantastic to start with, allowing players to use MB rolls and jumps more successfully.

Straight shot is his bread and butter, it is quick, but that's the point, damage wise it's alright as well. What I'd like to see is it building less meter when missing. No need for less chip as he will need that damage because...

...the oh/low guessing should go. Staggerable mid string I'm fine with, but not with serious mixups from a keepaway design. I'm even hesitant to keep F2 as an overhead simply because how potent it is paired with D1. Maybe make B12 a mid-overhead? He will still have an overhead attack just not a nigh unreactable string/combo starter that could catch people off-guard and have options off of. F12 as mentioned above could be a mid-stagger string and the two of these would still make him quite potent up-close.

Make it so his wake-up can't be MB'd on block.
he should keep his bf3 the way it is, he's already pretty free to jumpin's, no need to nerf his wakeup game on top of that. im for keeping his f2 as an overhead as well, its not that potent when the d1 option doesnt get him much. i guess the rifle one would be fine tho.
 

Shaka

Tier Whore.
Agreed, Also nerf his wake up attack. A zoner shouldn't have one of the best wake ups in the game.
 

Jelan

Aquaman is dead lel
Premium Supporter
he should keep his bf3 the way it is, he's already pretty free to jumpin's, no need to nerf his wakeup game on top of that. im for keeping his f2 as an overhead as well, its not that potent when the d1 option doesnt get him much. i guess the rifle one would be fine tho.
BF3 needs something though, it's just too good. Already top-notch wake-up without MB and that just makes it safe on top of that which you can always do thanks to his abundance of meter. Think about it this way, you work hard on getting thanks to his fantastic keepaway and when you finally score a knockdown he always gets a free get out jail card. He is too hard to pressure. But yes you are right, taking away MB on block is a bad solution as it won't be available during staggers. Maybe not being able to MB on wake-up only could be optimal.

And why do you need an overhead as good as F2 when you have ridiculous keepaway? I mean, you don't get much off D1 by itself but if you couple it with F2 it can easily be too much, that was JC's whole gameplan, bother you with low-pokes then hit you with an overhead. Why would you give that to a zoner?

I may go overboard, but I really don't think you need to be that good up close with Deadshot to be high to top-tier.
 

THTB

When's Syzoth?
My opinions on changing him:

A large problem with MB rifle, as well as everything he can use his meter to do to play his game, isn't just the move itself, but the fact that he is building meter too fast in the process of everything else he does. Nerfing straight shot's initial meter build would be a good start, but not all that would need to change to alter this. And with how meter building works, you'd have to make some dents in his non-MB stuff like his normals in order to actually make any impact on his meter building, which is lowering the damage. That said, even then, the move is really strong and I don't think NRS will actually lower his damage that much to get that kind of change, seeing as it's already pretty low. So for the move itself, I think giving MB rifle 5 frames more recovery and reducing damage a tad would go a long way in reducing its effectiveness without neutering it.

Straight shot should have the meter build reduced, as well as half the hitstun. It's +21 on hit currently. That is way too high for how fast that move is. And it makes matchups where he's against another dedicated zoner much more ridiculous than it needs to be. Reduce the hitstun, and you address that particular issue.

His mix is really good, and the point of it is to give him a way off of you. But I don't think he should have a completely unreactable high-low mixup. Keep f2 overhead, but make it a bit slower. Like 20-22f. And reduce the pushback on MB knee. It's -3, but that pushback is too much.

I think that's enough to get him in line.
 
More recovery on b1 by itself so he can't stagger it. 7 more recovery frames, 5 frames of blockstun.

That's still all I think he needs.
 

Invincible Salads

Seeker of knowledge
BF3 needs something though, it's just too good. Already top-notch wake-up without MB and that just makes it safe on top of that which you can always do thanks to his abundance of meter. Think about it this way, you work hard on getting thanks to his fantastic keepaway and when you finally score a knockdown he always gets a free get out jail card. He is too hard to pressure. But yes you are right, taking away MB on block is a bad solution as it won't be available during staggers. Maybe not being able to MB on wake-up only could be optimal.

And why do you need an overhead as good as F2 when you have ridiculous keepaway? I mean, you don't get much off D1 by itself but if you couple it with F2 it can easily be too much, that was JC's whole gameplan, bother you with low-pokes then hit you with an overhead. Why would you give that to a zoner?

I may go overboard, but I really don't think you need to be that good up close with Deadshot to be high to top-tier.
plenty of zoners in this game have good wakeups or safe specials, i don't see why its a problem that deadshot has one tbh. he should keep it. its not like its free anyways, it does require meter.

and again i don't think f2 staying is that bad, his upclose game will be nothing like johnny cage, lol. He could stagger & pressure you easily, his d4 had stupid range, he had a very good advancing mid, and would do a good chunk of damage restanding you into more pressure, not even CLOSE to deadshot, srry bruh. i'd be mad if they made his f2 a mid.
 

RNLDRGN

RONALD ROGAN
Just delete him from the game. He's got a boring, lazy ass design and probably the least interesting gameplay and personality of anyone in the cast. No one plays him b/c they legitimately like him. Then buff the current zoners or introduce a new zoner who isn't a complete void of interest.
 

DubiousShenron

Beware my power.
so an interesting nerf i think for mb rifle would be to nerf it so it can only be meter burned on block after the first shot. It's used way to easily as a safety net, blows up most mb rolls or jumps because you'll get hit by the proceeding shots.

i think the second hit of b12 has no business being an overhead and that string should really not be staggerable. f1 should be the stagger string nothing else.

his bf1 should not really be nerfed, it's really strong, maybe meter build could be nerfed/ damage, but the pacing is essential for his niche as a zoner.

some of his zoning could nerfed as a tradeoff for amplifying his trait. it feels like the decision process for which trait to use isn't as rewarding or thought provoking as it should be. maybe red bullets should really amplify chip and blue on hit, and meter drain could be meter steal instead or stronger.
I vote they make the mb rifle incapable of being meterburned on whiff and increase the whiff recovery on straight shot so he now has to use trick shots to win.

These changes will make deadshot in line with the other zoners because he will have to make reads with his zoning.

Thank you, have a good day.
 
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Invincible Salads

Seeker of knowledge
don't agree with a lot of the suggestions, espcially the one to nerf strait shot, i agree his low rifle needs some sort of change, but some of you guys want to outright kill it.