My Black Manta Matchup Chart: Draft One

[Chernyy Volk]

W - 16
L - 3
E - 11
U - 2



Even:

Aquaman = 5-5
Blue Beetle = 5-5
Braniac = 5-5
Cyborg = 5-5 post-patch. Used to be 6-4.
Firestorm = 5-5
Harley Quinn = 5-5
Ivy = Hard 5-5?
Red Hood = 5-5
Supergirl = 5-5
Superman = 5-5 but it's kind of turning into a 6-4 for me.
Wonder Woman = 5-5

Winning:

Bane = 6-4
Batman = Was 5-5, now I believe it's 6-4 post patch.
Black Adam = 6-4
Black Canary = 6-4
Cheetah = 7-3
Captain Cold = 7-3
Darkseid = 6-4
Deadshot = Was 5-5, now 6-4 and might even be 7-3.
Dr Fate = 6-4
Flash = 7-3
Green Arrow = 6-4
Joker = 6-4
Robin = 6-4
Scarecrow = 6-4
Starfire = 6-4
Swamp Thing = 7-3

Losing:

Atrocitus = 4-6
Green Lantern = 4-6
Sub Zero = 3-7. Not joking.

Undecided:

Raiden - Likely Manta winning.
Hellboy - Likely Manta winning.
Grodd - Can go either way but not enough data.

Props to @EntropicByDesign for formatting this when he didn't have to.

 

[EntropicByDesign]

Alternative formatting of OP's list. if this isnt ok let me know and I'll delete. I always rearrange these lists for my own viewing purposes, I dont mean to step on any toes (if you want to copy and paste into the main thread or anything I'll delete this post once youve copied it)

*Grodd added.

W - 16
L - 3
E - 11
U - 3



Even:

Aquaman = 5-5
Blue Beetle = 5-5
Braniac = 5-5
Cyborg = 5-5 post-patch. Used to be 6-4.
Firestorm = 5-5
Harley Quinn = 5-5
Ivy = Hard 5-5?
Red Hood = 5-5
Supergirl = 5-5
Superman = 5-5 but it's kind of turning into a 6-4 for me.
Wonder Woman = 5-5

Winning:

Bane = 6-4
Batman = Was 5-5, now I believe it's 6-4 post patch.
Black Adam = 6-4
Black Canary = 6-4
Cheetah = 7-3
Captain Cold = 7-3
Darkseid = 6-4
Deadshot = Was 5-5, now 6-4 and might even be 7-3.
Dr Fate = 6-4
Flash = 7-3
Green Arrow = 6-4
Joker = 6-4
Robin = 6-4
Scarecrow = 6-4
Starfire = 6-4
Swamp Thing = 7-3

Losing:

Atrocitus = 4-6
Green Lantern = 4-6
Sub Zero = 3-7. Not joking.

Undecided:

Raiden - Likely Manta winning.
Hellboy - Likely Manta winning.
Grodd - Can go either way but not enough data.

 

[EntropicByDesign]

I cant speak to much of this personally, My Manta isnt even past infancy, but this list is pretty optimistic. I dont mean that in a rude/douchey way, but as a kind of nice change from some of the lists that pop up that claim thier character goes even with his/herself and loses the rest of the cast 8/2.

 

[The chosen puddle]

Am I blind or is grodd not on this list

 

[Chernyy Volk]

Am I blind or is grodd not on this list

Updated.

 

[Vigilante24]

Manta most definitely does not 7-3 Capt Cold. He excels vs chars who can't zone and Manta can't zone. He can't do anything about puddle with risk of getting anti aired for floating over or getting frozen for harpooning him. He can't do anything to stop him from getting lvl 2 without risking yolo teleports which are easy bait an punishes. Once he pops lvl 2 its party time. This MU is at best 5-5 (potentially due to Cold nerfs), 4-6 at worst imo.

Ive played GL vs Manta from both perspectives and it feels 5-5, not 4-6.

Go ahead and put Raiden as a winning MU. That is kinda free lol.

 

[AkioOf100]

what does gl do to manta

 

[Chernyy Volk]

Manta most definitely does not 7-3 Capt Cold. He excels vs chars who can't zone and Manta can't zone. He can't do anything about puddle with risk of getting anti aired for floating over or getting frozen for harpooning him. He can't do anything to stop him from getting lvl 2 without risking yolo teleports which are easy bait an punishes. Once he pops lvl 2 its party time. This MU is at best 5-5 (potentially due to Cold nerfs), 4-6 at worst imo.

Ive played GL vs Manta from both perspectives and it feels 5-5, not 4-6.

Go ahead and put Raiden as a winning MU. That is kinda free lol.

You're not playing the MU properly if this is what you're experiencing.

 

[Chernyy Volk]

what does gl do to manta

GL's b1 destroys Manta's neutral. His zoning, the hitboxes of his projectiles, make it difficult to get to GL, Manta can't frame trap GL because he can yolo b1 out of everything because b1 has a sway back property on it that makes normals whiff.

 

[Vigilante24]

You're not playing the MU properly if this is what you're experiencing.

Then educate me on what I should be doing.

 

[AkioOf100]

So b1 beats out everything bc hitbox issues or .. ?

 

[Chernyy Volk]

So b1 beats out everything bc hitbox issues or .. ?

Pretty much. Also GL's wakeups are superb, Manta can't make meterless laser safe because Lanterns Might.

 

[Chernyy Volk]

Then educate me on what I should be doing.

You need to get in and apply consistent flight cancel pressure and frame traps on him which IMO is easy to do, especially with puddle now only lasting 3 seconds. You can blow up the wall on meaty too so waking up for Cold is not to his advantage at all.

 

[Cashual]

Pretty much. Also GL's wakeups are superb, Manta can't make meterless laser safe because Lanterns Might.

GLs wakeups are superb??!!!!

I just died right here right now, RIP me

 

[Chernyy Volk]

GLs wakeups are superb??!!!!

I just died right here right now, RIP me

They're superb against Manta, Manta can't stuff them.

@DTruth what's your opinion on Manta versus GL? What's the MU number?

 

[Vengeance135]

To be honest, I'm going to agree that the joker/manta MU is 6-4 manta favor but it's a HARD HARD 6-4.

Mantas neutral vs joker is insane, especially that stupid forward advancing string that low profiles gun. The only way joker can deal woth that advancing string is by throwing a parry on read or using 21 to whiff punish, but both options can be baited for full combo punishes. The risk isn't worth it unless you're desperate.

Mantas mobility is insane in this MU.

Zoning with joker is hard, and at times not worth the effort since mantas flying charge shit can low profile gun or he can teleport punish gun.

Once manta corners joker it's extremely suffocating, even with the new wake up joker received.

manta outdamages joker (yes I said it) and is just an overall better character.

There is nothing in this MU that is advantageous to joker

 

[Chernyy Volk]

To be honest, I'm going to agree that the joker/manta MU is 6-4 manta favor but it's a HARD HARD 6-4.

Mantas neutral vs joker is insane, especially that stupid forward advancing string that low profiles gun. The only way joker can deal woth that advancing string is by throwing a parry on read or using 21 to whiff punish, but both options can be baited for full combo punishes. The risk isn't worth it unless you're desperate.

Mantas mobility is insane in this MU.

Zoning with joker is hard, and at times not worth the effort since mantas flying charge shit can low profile gun or he can teleport punish gun.

Once manta corners joker it's extremely suffocating, even with the new wake up joker received.

manta outdamages joker (yes I said it) and is just an overall better character.

There is nothing in this MU that is advantageous to joker

I considered maybe it's a 7-3 but I don't think it's quite THAT bad. Yet.

 

[Vigilante24]

You need to get in and apply consistent flight cancel pressure and frame traps on him which IMO is easy to do, especially with puddle now only lasting 3 seconds. You can blow up the wall on meaty too so waking up for Cold is not to his advantage at all.

Sounds like you are playing someone who doesn't know the MU if you are successfully applying consistent flight cancel pressure. The one Cold I played in ranked FT3 who actually wasn't booty cheeks, and was practically a watered down version of Sonic, d2'd me clean out of every flight cancel I attempted into airborne freeze and charged up a lvl 2 in my face. And I could tell he was reacting and not OS mashing d2 either. One slip up, got a lvl 2 in 3 seconds, match was over despite whatever life lead I had.

Frametrapping him is pretty easy though I will give you that.

Im assuming you must be using b12 ender to get a meaty j3 or using float cancel j3s after harpoon ender to blow up his wall? I am pretty sure that is the only way to stop it without MB F3.

 

[kcd117]

I don't really know about atro but definitely agree with the rest. The way I see GL can become an even matchup with time, it is just pretty hard to figure out that one. Sub is terrible, never thought I would say that in this game lol.

 

[Vengeance135]

I considered maybe it's a 7-3 but I don't think it's quite THAT bad. Yet.

I really don't like saying 7-3s unless jokers options are so limited it warrants it. Joker has to play a smart, read-based game vs manta if he's going to win. Joker has the tools, but whiffing on manta is dangerous and so is giving manta any open options to punish joker.

 

[Chernyy Volk]

Sounds like you are playing someone who doesn't know the MU if you are successfully applying consistent flight cancel pressure. The one Cold I played in ranked FT3 who actually wasn't booty cheeks, and was practically a watered down version of Sonic, d2'd me clean out of every flight cancel I attempted into airborne freeze and charged up a lvl 2 in my face. And I could tell he was reacting and not OS mashing d2 either. One slip up, got a lvl 2 in 3 seconds, match was over despite whatever life lead I had.

Frametrapping him is pretty easy though I will give you that.

Im assuming you must be using b12 ender to get a meaty j3 or using float cancel j3s after harpoon ender to blow up his wall? I am pretty sure that is the only way to stop it without MB F3.

You need to do shimmys using the flight cancels to make him whiff the d2 attempts. I've labbed this pretty thoroughly, it works. Off b2 or 12 primarily.

As for blowing up the wall, if you aren't in the corner, you can literally just laser through it. db3 as a combo ender leaves you at the right distance, so does b12, 1232, a lot of enders.

 

[Vigilante24]

They're superb against Manta, Manta can't stuff them.

Umm yes. Yes Manta can stuff GL wakeup 100%. I labbed how to beat my own character with Manta and garuntee you he has multiple was to stuff GL's wall wakeup.

 

[Vigilante24]

You need to do shimmys using the flight cancels to make him whiff the d2 attempts. I've labbed this pretty thoroughly, it works. Off b2 or 12 primarily.

As for blowing up the wall, if you aren't in the corner, you can literally just laser through it. db3 as a combo ender leaves you at the right distance, so does b12, 1232, a lot of enders.

Only works well off 2 strings? Bummer :/ Guess I need to add those to my arsenal. This still doesn't change my opinion of the MU tho. Capt Cold still only needs that one touch to get lvl 2 and from there, the match is over due to Manta's limited answers for it. You have to be 100% rushdown and play perfect to prevent that from happening where Cold does not. That doesn't feel like the mentality of a 7-3 imo.

So just raw laser actually works? Lol finally a character I can do that to and not get blown up! xD

 

[Tweedy]

Manta can stuff GL's wake up for sure. A lot of people downplay GL's wake up tho because they don't know how to delay their actual wake up attack. You actually have two timings for wake ups that don't have anything to do with the actual delay wake up mechanic. This is really helpful for characters like GL, Manta, Aquaman, Brainiac.

 

[Pygmy_Potato]

Could someone elaborate for me about the Black Adam MU? I play Adam but I'm not super familiar vs Manta, and I'm curious what Manta does to him that makes it 6-4?