Breakthrough - TriBorg MKXL PATCH THOUGHTS

[THTB]

No its not. If you have more options like ducking, armoring, jumping, delayed wakeup its not a vortex its just a mix up and mind games. In a vortex your only options are to block high or low.

Your definition is based specifically on what you know from NRS games. The general definition is what Khaotik said.

 

[Skedar70]

What you just described is a 50-50 vortex, vprtexes dont have to be 50-50s though. There can be multiple ways out but if you get hit and it puts you back into the original situation you were in when you got hit then its a vortex. There are varying degrees of vortexes, with 50-50s being the worst

Can you give an example?

 

[xKhaoTik]

If it knocks you down and you can wake up than its not a vortex. A vortex puts you in a position where your only options are block overhead or low and if you fail your are comboed and put again in the same position. Your definition of vortex is faulty.

But I'm right

 

[Skedar70]

Your definition is based specifically on what you know from NRS games. The general definition is what Khaotik said.

Yes. What I just described is what is considered a vortex in NRS games. This is mostly an NRS games forum.

 

[SaSSolino]

why's everyone downplaying smoke? he does have a vortex, the opponent just can armor out of it on read, but smoke still has the upper hand with heavy + frames and 50/50s.

that said, I do belive he could use some buffs in damage and smoke bomb speed.

 

[Skedar70]

But I'm right

You are spreading miss information based on what might be considered a vortex on other games.

 

[xKhaoTik]

In a vortex your only options are to block high or low.

Lol no

 

[xKhaoTik]

You are spreading miss information based on what might be considered a vortex on other games.

But I'm not

 

[Israel]

They need better testers. Too much gets overlooked.

All my opinion of course.

 

[cambros22]

They need better testers. Too much gets overlooked.

All my opinion of course.

We are the testers now sadly.. unfinshed products get sold and the consumers opinions shape it; for better or worse.

 

[Kamikaze_Highlander]

He can actually do 333xxSKRC, F3xxSKRC, 11 to get more chip, or just 333 if you wanna save stamina. I dunno, it's just not really a traditional vortex, it's a restand into very strong pressure, but what you're saying is pretty much true so ill just leave it there.

If the situation loops and at the end of a loop therr is literally no other option other than blocking, that's a vortex

But it's not a troll?

MK is your first fighter huh?

It is! So clearly I have no fucking clue right? /s

I just thought it was funny you disagreed with @MadeFromMetal, and then said basically the exact same thing as him.

 

[Cossner]

You are spreading miss information based on what might be considered a vortex on other games.

You do realize you're wrong.

 

[Matix218]

Vortex is a situation where you have no other recourse but to guess and if you guess wrong you get put into that same situation again. It does not have to be overhead vs low, it could be left vs right ambiguous cross up, it could be command throw vs attack, it could be any type of situation where you are guessing (and have no other way to counter the situation but to make the guess) and if you make the wrong guess you are looped back into that same mixup again.

 

[Skedar70]

You do realize you're wrong.

Come on dude. At least try to explain why.

 

[Skedar70]

Vortex is a situation where you have no other recourse but to guess and if you guess wrong you get put into that same situation again. It does not have to be overhead vs low, it could be left vs right ambiguous cross up, it could be command throw vs attack, it could be any type of situation where you are guessing (and have no other way to counter the situation but to make the guess) and if you make the wrong guess you are looped back into that same mixup again.

Sure this definition works. Now can someone provide an example of a vortex in mkx that is not a 50/50 vortex?

 

[xKhaoTik]

Come on dude. At least try to explain why.

Ive told you, THTB told you. Matix told you. All 3 of us has said exactly what a vortex is.

 

[Kindred]

Fuck NRS.

 

[shura30]

has the upper hand with heavy + frames and 50/50s.

hell no

he's negative on everything beside few strings with a gap that really lead to nothing considering his startup frames
and his 'heavy + frames' consists of +2 and metered +4

my suggestions:

1112's gap should be removed, you can already jump out the followup after 111
1 or 11 could be +1 like the majority of the cast already has for frame traps
f4 d1 should be an overhead to not let the opponent automatically rape you after ducking f43
increase range on d3 / d1 / d4
fix b21 to not whiff on crouching opponents
fix b1 SB to universal combo not tied to matchup or MB

 

[Skedar70]

It's just a continuous loop. Doesn't need to be a restand, oh/low, etc. It's just a mixup that leads into the same mixup until it's stopped.

Like in SF4, characters like akuma, cammy and ibuki had a vortex because they had mixups after a knockdown that were hard to block because the crossups were insane.

NRS just made them stupid by adding restands and safe 50/50s into the mix.

In MKX vortexes have to be on standing opponents and I can't think off any other vortex than a 50/50 in mkx. Once the opponent is knock down there is no more vortex. If you want to refute give an example of a vortex in mkx out of a knockdown or that is not a 50/50.

 

[Israel]

We are the testers now sadly.. unfinshed products get sold and the consumers opinions shape it; for better or worse.

Well where's our paychecks.

I need them I-9's and W2's filled out. Put me on board, and we can get some real change going on.

 

[KidVanDal]

The thing with these words is that they often become watered out and starts to mean different things in different communities and scenes. It's been years since the term was coined and it's hard to know the exact original meaning, so when you use terms like vortex or trip guard there will often be diffirent interpretations depending on who you talk to.

For example, shoryuken glossary says it's on knock down, which is weird because I never learned that it was exclusive to kd.
Things like 50/50s and such will always be easier since it's in the name what it is. A 50/50 guess.

But whatever.
Carry on!

Edit: I always thought of it the way @xKhaoTik described. But it doesn't matter.

 

[xKhaoTik]

In MKX vortexes have to be on standing opponents and I can't think off any other vortex than a 50/50 in mkx. Once the opponent is knock down there is no more vortex. If you want to refute give an example of a vortex in mkx out of a knockdown or that is not a 50/50.

OK you're clearly not getting it so I'm done lol

 

[Skedar70]

OK you're clearly not getting it so I'm done lol

Not getting what? You haven't said anything that makes sense just an example of vortexes on sf4 that have nothing to do with how vortexes are in mkx. Vague statements, typical response of someone with no coherent arguments.

 

[Kamikaze_Highlander]

Sure this definition works. Now can someone provide an example of a vortex in mkx that is not a 50/50 vortex?

ai Sindel??

really they're all 33/33/(16.5/16.5) as throw gives you a third option, and then you have to guess which direction to tech.

 

[Madog32]

Not getting what? You haven't said anything that makes sense just an example of vortexes on sf4 that have nothing to do with how vortexes are in mkx. Vague statements, typical response of someone with no coherent arguments.

youve been given several articulate and accurate definitions of what a vortex truly means, yet you're still in here demanding an example of a certain setup from a certain character. What does it matter?? The definition Matix/Khaotik/THTB gave you is correct despite what game you're playing. You wanted the definition, and you got it