MK 11: Passive Meter Analysis

[grandabx]

I found this very interesting and highly worth looking further into.

I asked for people's opinion on the very same thing on another game site not to long ago.

After watching, feel free to give your thoughts.

 

[Jbog]

Its totally the problem this game has the regen meters! If u had to build bar risk reward would be way greater. Walk back crouch block or just crouch is the greatest strategy of this game period.

 

[Jbog]

Passive meter regen is the cancer of this game. Makes action stale.

 

[Marinjuana]

Its totally the problem this game has the regen meters! If u had to build bar risk reward would be way greater. Walk back crouch block or just crouch is the greatest strategy of this game period.

Compared to walk back and spam projectile

 

[Arqwart]

Passive meter regen is the cancer of this game. Makes action stale.

And sitting there entirely meterless as a Kabal mashes IAGB at full screen building the meter to flash parry anything you decide to risk attacking with when you get close or as a Tanya mixup chips you to death while building insane meter in the process sure wasn't stale.

 

[Kiss the Missile]

And sitting there entirely meterless as a Kabal mashes IAGB at full screen building the meter to flash parry anything you decide to risk attacking with when you get close or as a Tanya mixup chips you to death while building insane meter in the process sure wasn't stale.

View attachment 17941

Call it whatever you like but at least it required actual effort. I hate that you start a match with full meter in this game. I don't get the idea behind that at all. First launch of the match almost always goes flat with a breakaway.

 

[Jbog]

Endless resources for playing super passive makes for boring try to get in matches

 

[Jbog]

Compared to walk back and spam projectile
[/QUOTE]
Thats what happens now! Just build meter faster

 

[Arqwart]

Call it whatever you like but at least it required actual effort. I hate that you start a match with full meter in this game. I don't get the idea behind that at all. First launch of the match almost always goes flat with a breakaway.

This is an entirely different issue though. I'm 100% down for not starting with full meter and I don't understand why First Hit Bonus was discarded in this game. However, regenerating meter makes for a much a better baseline system of balancing in my opinion.

 

[Trustful_Whale]

I don't understand why First Hit Bonus was discarded in this game.

What should it even do?

 

[Kiss the Missile]

. However, regenerating meter makes for a much a better baseline system of balancing in my opinion.

I disagree completely. I hate that a complete lack of engagement still gives you meter. There's no thought in it, where MK's meter management used to be one of its biggest focuses. Compare it to something like 3rd Strike where you can whiff normals to gain meter. You could sit at the end of the screen mashing to get bar, and your opponent might do the same, but at any point they can push forward causing you to lose ground and you have to be mindful of it. I love the risk and reward of it all. Another issue is how Defense and Offense are separate.

 

[Trustful_Whale]

So I just started watching the video and the first thing Tom says about the meter system is that everyone regenerates at the same rate, but this is false.
16Bit has stated in the past that each amped move has its own regen rate particular to the move that was used, so unless Tom timed it for every move in the game this is a clarification that I consider significant.

This is also easily noticeable with Kung Lao's orbiting hat moves.

 

[Error404]

I get what NRS was going for , but it doesn't work. It ends up being exactly the same as regular meter , except you get spammed by ex projectiles AND your opponent has a breaker for when you get in.

 

[Jbog]

Agree 100 percent its worst mechanic of the game

 

[Marlow]

I actually like the passive meter regen. I think it's an interesting way to try and balance meter gain. Seems like a pretty common complaint in MKX and Injustice 2 was certain characters were able to build tons of meter all game, giving them a resource advantage for things like breakaway, combos, and everything else.

I wouldn't be opposed to changing things up for MK12 or trying something new, but I'm fine with how MK11 does it.

 

[Marinjuana]

Imagine if Sonya got meter for throwing out cheerios

 

[Marlow]

I wonder if they could keep the separate meter idea, but incorporate that into the meter build system. Blocking/taking damage could build your defensive meter, while using special moves or dealing chip damage could build offensive bar.

Overall though the hard thing is however you decide to implement meter into a game it's going to create balance issues and gameplay issues.

 

[pure.Wasted]

I disagree completely. I hate that a complete lack of engagement still gives you meter. There's no thought in it, where MK's meter management used to be one of its biggest focuses. Compare it to something like 3rd Strike where you can whiff normals to gain meter. You could sit at the end of the screen mashing to get bar, and your opponent might do the same, but at any point they can push forward causing you to lose ground and you have to be mindful of it. I love the risk and reward of it all. Another issue is how Defense and Offense are separate.

I don't have a lot of experience with MKX so I could be wrong, but it feels to me like free meter is designed to create lots of comeback potential. Instead of the rich getting richer with hits rewarding meter, you have lots of situations where the game returns to a 50/50 state where anything can happen. So you can still dislike it, but it's not thoughtlessly designed.

edit: I just realized that maybe you meant it's thoughtless to play, not that it was thoughtlessly designed. I guess in a way. But in another way it gives the losing player more options, and options allows more thought.

 

[Trini_Bwoi]

Watching this now and it already seems wrong? The offensive bar refills at different rates depending on the special move.

I still think meter regens too quickly, and I wish they had a few more ways to control it (ex. regen stops if knocked down) but there's no way MK11 would be more balanced if it had MK9's meter system.

 

[Gaxkang]

Watching this now and it already seems wrong? The offensive bar refills at different rates depending on the special move.

I still think meter regens too quickly, and I wish they had a few more ways to control it (ex. regen stops if knocked down) but there's no way MK11 would be more balanced if it had MK9's meter system.

I think most of the time it's simply not noticed because meter seems plentiful. The stages are big, things take time...and most of the time when someone gets knocked down they will have meter to use.

 

[Trustful_Whale]

Simply saying regening meters is the problem and the game would be solved with a traditional meter system is an impossible call to make. This game was designed at its core with the current meter system in mind, which permeates throughout the entire game.

If you thought opening customs fucks the game up, watch what happens after overhauling the meter system in a vacuum.

 

[Kiss the Missile]

Simply saying regening meters is the problem and the game would be solved with a traditional meter system is an impossible call to make. This game was designed at its core with the current meter system in mind, which permeates throughout the entire game.

If you thought opening customs fucks the game up, watch what happens after overhauling the meter system in a vacuum.

Seems like an afterthought considering the game is meant to be slow paced and neutral focused. You have single use launching Krushing Blows, but the opponent almost always has the meter to break out of it.

 

[spidey300]

It's all in the venture of achieving the fabled perfect balance, holding hands, and helping skill levels. Nrs definitely had better ways to balance the crazy meter building but they just took some easy out route like they did with a lot of mk11 concepts

 

[Gaxkang]

Simply saying regening meters is the problem and the game would be solved with a traditional meter system is an impossible call to make. This game was designed at its core with the current meter system in mind, which permeates throughout the entire game.

If you thought opening customs fucks the game up, watch what happens after overhauling the meter system in a vacuum.

I suppose folks are exploring what could have been.

But sure the design philosophy seems linked with meter regen...the rarity of meterless launchers and dependence on meter for launch or other bigger combos for instance. Scorpion needs meter to erase a chunk of life off a projectile.

Sonya's fat ring krushing blow needs an amplify, and Sub's fat slide krushing blow needs meter to do. Etc

If Sub had more trouble getting meter, would his slide krushing blow be a regular fixture of fights anymore?

 

[CrimsonShadow]

Its totally the problem this game has the regen meters!

Yup, that’s the one — that’d fix everything

It was never an issue when Aquaman or Alien or Kabal builds meter while attacking you while you struggle to build bar to break..