Question - Liu Kang Liu Kang's Bad Matchups?

[KHTC Takgillo]

Full screen is fine, but a SZ who uses the ex Iceball is very dangerous at that range. The most frustrating thing with SZ and some other characters is the safety of the jump ins (especially the jump in kick) and GM especially is the 50/50 corner game, his d4 is very good as well. It does not feel as bad I remember it to be but I think there are still some issues for LK.

I still think It s in Kang s favor he beat him full screen and his fireball have enough recovery for him to be able to block the ice ball unless you ve been using them recklessly and then it s your fault you can backdash maybe even walk to avoid the jump in and punish and fist windmill is a great armor move you can use it in the corner to avoid his 50/50 and even get past the clone if he cancel into it

 

[Parasurama]

I still think It s in Kang s favor he beat him full screen and his fireball have enough recovery for him to be able to block the ice ball unless you ve been using them recklessly and then it s your fault you can backdash maybe even walk to avoid the jump in and punish and fist windmill is a great armor move you can use it in the corner to avoid his 50/50 and even get past the clone if he cancel into it

Ex Iceball is the ranged game changer, just needs to 'trade'.Trip guard does not always work jump ins if you are waking up or at frame disadvantage, but I hear you.

 

[Kickbykick]

Dualist Vs Gm Sub. horrible

 

[KHTC Takgillo]

Ex Iceball is the ranged game changer, just needs to 'trade'.Trip guard does not always work jump ins if you are waking up or at frame disadvantage, but I hear you.

Still thing it s pretty much in liu kang advantage unless you brainlessly throw fire balls I can throw a fire ball of a block one and still bock the ex ice ball you can backdash jump ins and punish

 

[I GOT HANDS]

Sub LK is a 5-5

If that's your worst matchup, you guys are doing alright.

 

[Mr_Swizzer]

Any char that has slow normal's or slow armor options is considered a bad matchup.

 

[RyuKazuya]

shinnok can be ahuge pain in the ass. Also sonya since she doesnt have to be afraid of blocked dive kicks since liu can have a hard time punishing them. If she hits your legs with her dive kick and you block the only thing you could try is his oh b2. Other than that every other attempt would take a run to her. Which gives her enough time to recover. Damn i hate this matchup. Better pick johnny against her and f3 her all day

 

[SneakyTortoise]

I really don't understand why so many people think gm sub is a bad MU. I'm yet to see a convincing argument as to why it's worse than 5-5

 

[Kaneki]

I really don't understand why so many people think by gm sub is a bad MU. I'm yet to see a convincing argument as to why it's worse than 5-5

The clone does make it harder to move and minimize careless mistakes. Liu can pretty much take care of sub by zoning full screen but if sub gets liu in the corner I guess it can get dangerous for liu I guess. I do believe Liu has the tools to deal with gm sub but its also a matter of adapting and changing you playstyle when facing grand master.

 

[SneakyTortoise]

The clone does make it harder to move and minimize careless mistakes. Liu can pretty much take care of sub by zoning full screen but if sub gets liu in the corner I guess it can get dangerous for liu I guess. I do believe Liu has the tools to deal with gm sub but its also a matter of adapting and changing you playstyle when facing grand master.

But that doesn't sound worse that 5-5 at all

 

[rubmytaco]

def not takeda

but i would probably say sub zero GM and cassie, shinnok maybe as well?

GM gets zoned out by LK free as long as he doesn't make any mistakes (get caught by a jump in)

 

[rubmytaco]

But that doesn't sound worse that 5-5 at all

It isn't. Sub's only saving grace in the mu (not counting the corner game) is ex clone to get out of pressure after ex flying kick.

 

[SneakyTortoise]

It isn't. Sub's only saving grace in the mu (not counting the corner game) is ex clone to get out of pressure after ex flying kick.

Exactly my point. Almost every lk main says it's a losing mu, but I don't see why

 

[IrishMantis]

I don't think he has a bad MU

Atleast nothing concrete

 

[EMPR_MURK]

So far these are the losing mus i have for liu and of course im up for discussing them.

Dragons fire:
Kitana
Tanya
Jax
Kano
Ermac
Shinnok
Sonya

Flame fist:
Predator
Ermac
Kano
Quan chi
Shinnok
Tremor

 

[The Celebrity]

I really don't understand why so many people think gm sub is a bad MU. I'm yet to see a convincing argument as to why it's worse than 5-5

The reason I find it an annoying matchup (not bad, but annoying), is because clone blows up your pressure as a better option than what about every other character has. For example, after fly kick MB, subzero can EX clone and suddenly be ahead in neutral. It covers every liu kang option. Similarily, cancels like F44 that don't actually jail people normally have to respect, but subzero gets a free clone during that moment so that if LK tries to read armor, he gets frozen, if he tries to pressure, he gets froze. It covers several liu kang options with a single input, thats the value.

The other thing is I find it very hard as LK to deal with his Subzero when you are in the corner. When Liu Kang is knocked down and SZ sets up a clone, all Liu has as wakeups are highs. Meaning Sub can just D1 outside the range so that only if you armor will it hit. That makes all your wakeups miss by either flying over him, or get hit by a D1. A lot of characters can combat Subzero corner pressure using Neutral Jumps, but Liu Kang's is god awful, so that option is basically removed.

As Liu Kang, you need to make more reads on the Subzero player, than he has to make on you. Thats why this matchup is annoying... It also makes you play a different game than normal since in this matchup you have to play full screen and zone, not pressure. With that said, its nothing worse than a 4-6, and I think I'd still consider it a 5-5. I'm not xarakamaka though, so what I say doesn't hold much ground.

 

[EMPR_MURK]

The reason I find it an annoying matchup (not bad, but annoying), is because clone blows up your pressure as a better option than what about every other character has. For example, after fly kick MB, subzero can EX clone and suddenly be ahead in neutral. It covers every liu kang option. Similarily, cancels like F44 that don't actually jail people normally have to respect, but subzero gets a free clone during that moment so that if LK tries to read armor, he gets frozen, if he tries to pressure, he gets froze. It covers several liu kang options with a single input, thats the value.

The other thing is I find it very hard as LK to deal with his Subzero when you are in the corner. When Liu Kang is knocked down and SZ sets up a clone, all Liu has as wakeups are highs. Meaning Sub can just D1 outside the range so that only if you armor will it hit. That makes all your wakeups miss by either flying over him, or get hit by a D1. A lot of characters can combat Subzero corner pressure using Neutral Jumps, but Liu Kang's is god awful, so that option is basically removed.

As Liu Kang, you need to make more reads on the Subzero player, than he has to make on you. Thats why this matchup is annoying... With that said, its nothing worse than a 4-6, and I think I'd still consider it a 5-5. I'm not xarakamaka though, so what I say doesn't hold much ground.

In response to your comments about liu pressuring sub, there are strings that can break the clone and the slide. Imo subs best option out of liu's pressure (excluding the the mb flying bicycle kick) is his backdash.

The mu is arguably 5-5.

 

[Tweedy]

So far these are the losing mus i have for liu and of course im up for discussing them.

Dragons fire:
Kitana
Tanya
Jax
Kano
Ermac
Shinnok
Sonya

Flame fist:
Predator
Ermac
Kano
Quan chi
Shinnok
Tremor

What do you think about Buzzsaw Lao vs Flamefist? Before I picked up Tanya I would use Buzzsaw vs him instead of Tempest. EX spin in buzz and hat trick blows up windmill punches for free.

 

[ForeverKing]

Dragon's Fire Liu Kang at this present moment in time has 0 losing matchups, in my opinion.

He has some of the best pressure in the game with all these run cancels that guarantee more strings on block into run cancels. And after all the guaranteed chip is done & your stamina is depleted he can still end his pressure with EX bicycle kick to be plus on block. He's ridiculous.

Armor breaks really easy, actually has pretty great zoning and anti-zoning, and can close the gap on his opponent easily from full screen with EX bicycle kick. It's almost like he can get in and be plus whenever he wants. Great D2. While he's pressuring you, you never know if he's gonna keep going for the guaranteed chip or just randomly toss in an overhead B2 or a throw.

I can't really see him losing to anyone

 

[EMPR_MURK]

What do you think about Buzzsaw Lao vs Flamefist? Before I picked up Tanya I would use Buzzsaw vs him instead of Tempest. EX spin in buzz and hat trick blows up windmill punches for free.

I was actually going to put him so yea add lao to that for flame fist.

 

[EMPR_MURK]

Dragon's Fire Liu Kang at this present moment in time has 0 losing matchups, in my opinion.

He has some of the best pressure in the game with all these run cancels that guarantee more strings on block into run cancels. And after all the guaranteed chip is done & your stamina is depleted he can still end his pressure with EX bicycle kick to be plus on block. He's ridiculous.

Armor breaks really easy, actually has pretty great zoning and anti-zoning, and can close the gap on his opponent easily from full screen with EX bicycle kick. It's almost like he can get on and be plus whenever he wants. Great D2. While he's pressuring you, you never know if he's gonna keep going for the guaranteed chip or just randomly toss in an overhead B2 or a throw.

I can't really see him losing to anyone

I can tell u now that kano doesn't give a crap about that lol. Yes dragons fire has great offense but ppl seem to miss the actual meta of liu and that is space control and that is something kano excels in against liu.

Kano can punish anything liu does from a certain distance that is punishable such as b2, b4, and any fireball. Kano could potentially be liu's worst mu for any variation of liu.

 

[ragnar0kz28]

Lao and Cassie for sure.

 

[EMPR_MURK]

Lao and Cassie for sure.

Lao for flame fist yes but dragons fire could be 5-5.

Cassie potentially loses to flame fist and probably goes even with dragons fire.

 

[Danger317]

When I play Liu Kang, my biggest problems start when I play vs Tanya, Shinnok, Cassie Cage and Sonya Blade. The last two mostly because of 50/50 and I'm no wizard to predict when I need to block high or low.

literally the reason i picked up Tanya

 

[The Highlander]

So far these are the losing mus i have for liu and of course im up for discussing them.

Dragons fire:
Kitana
Tanya
Jax
Kano
Ermac
Shinnok
Sonya

Flame fist:
Predator
Ermac
Kano
Quan chi
Shinnok
Tremor

Why do you think he loses to Tremor? Every Tremor I've seen has said that's a terrible match-up, albeit they were probably referring to dragons fire.