Guide Joker Parry Guide

[StevoSuprem0]

It's a shitload to memorize and this is a video game sooooo..... yeah. I think I might make a thread for relevant strings in each matchup to land a parry. Stuff like GL with the b1*parry*3 and such. There are some important ones in some key matchups that everyone should know, and then alot that don't matter as much. What's so fucking annoying by Joker's parry is we have to rely on mashing it or PERFECTLY timing it in these strings, whereas normal characters can just input theirs as a reversal and get them in much easier.

 

[Qwark28]

its all timing related, its not really that difficult when you learn when to do it.

 

[OnlineRon91]

I was thinking of making one that focuses on the combo starters rather than the string counters. A sample entry would be ...

Bane
4 lows
3 overheads
1 mid

You'll want to be blocking low as Bane has a fast low for small damage as well as two other low starters that lead to moderate damage. Two of his overheads are slow and easy to react to while the other is not but does little damage. You can low parry to evade the throw and full combo punish.

 

[The PantyChrist]

I picked two random characters to test out the strings I can parry. Lex and Bane.

Lex can do 113 (no one does 113) or 112, which means you guess right and get 11% or guess wrong and get full combo punished.

Bane can do b21 (legit string) or b23 (even better string), which means you guess right and get 11% or guess wrong and get full combo punished.

Lol, I think I'm done experimenting with parry

It's actually easier to just parry the starters. Standing 1s or specials on wakeup. Lex will most likely wake up with corps charge which cannot be parried. Bane however has no low wakeups and they can all be parried except body press and super. I think wakeup stuffing Is a decent way to use it actually

 

[OnlineRon91]

Against some characters like bane it's definitely an option, but many already use a wakeup that can't be parried. Zods Zod Charge, Supermans rising / breath, ds' sword flip, mmhs push / tele, shazams phycho chrusher / tele, BAs lightning cage.

 

[The PantyChrist]

True but there are other ways to punish/ deal with those. The key is knowing their wakeup options and what they like to do on wakeup

 

[Fromundaman]

It's actually easier to just parry the starters. Standing 1s or specials on wakeup. Lex will most likely wake up with corps charge which cannot be parried. Bane however has no low wakeups and they can all be parried except body press and super. I think wakeup stuffing Is a decent way to use it actually

Depends on how much invincibility the wakeup has. If it's still invincible when it hits the parry, then the parry won't work.

 

[StevoSuprem0]

Oh yeah, definitely not saying which things are/aren't parryable isn't useful, but it's already out there- the WW parry guide covers everything very well. I'm just thinking something kinda summarizing the commonly used starter/footsie strings, and parryable specials, for each character would be a bit more useful than regurgitating that information again.
To use GL as an example again, b13 is the main starter/footsie string you'll be seeing. On a good read, you can parry the starter low (or neutral jump if you aren't at disadvantage from something before that for a punish), or inbetween using normal parry. Just a quick example.

 

[Qwark28]

Oh yeah, definitely not saying which things are/aren't parryable isn't useful, but it's already out there- the WW parry guide covers everything very well. I'm just thinking something kinda summarizing the commonly used starter/footsie strings, and parryable specials, for each character would be a bit more useful than regurgitating that information again.
To use GL as an example again, b13 is the main starter/footsie string you'll be seeing. On a good read, you can parry the starter low (or neutral jump if you aren't at disadvantage from something before that for a punish), or inbetween using normal parry. Just a quick example.

there is absolutely no need to ever parry b1 on a read

either neutral jump or wait for b1 to come out and backdash or parry the 3

 

[StevoSuprem0]

there is absolutely no need to ever parry b1 on a read

either neutral jump or wait for b1 to come out and backdash or parry the 3

If you're at negative frames from blocking a f3 or something like that, you can't jump because the b1 will still catch you and if you backdash the b1 will still get you because of its range, making parry the only option, or yes, blocking the b1 and parrying the 3.

 

[Qwark28]

If you're at negative frames from blocking a f3 or something like that, you can't jump because the b1 will still catch you and if you backdash the b1 will still get you because of its range, making parry the only option, or yes, blocking the b1 and parrying the 3.

I said backdash or parry the B1-3, obviously you won't jump B1 when at - frames., I feel like I have to dumb down every single post I make in this sub forum.

 

[OnlineRon91]

I said backdash or parry the B1-3, obviously you won't jump B1 when at - frames., I feel like I have to dumb down every single post I make in this sub forum.

Can you explain what you mean "frames"?

 

[Qwark28]

Can you explain what you mean "frames"?

frames is when bugs bunny hits elmer on the head

 

[StevoSuprem0]

I said backdash or parry the B1-3, obviously you won't jump B1 when at - frames., I feel like I have to dumb down every single post I make in this sub forum.

And I said if you backdash, b1 will catch you. And it does. Then I went on to confirm that you had a point, and you can just block the b1 and parry the 3. Talk about dumbing shit down... if you dumbed them down any more they wouldn't exist. All you do is make base claims with no breakdown or talk about how awesome your next tech repost is gonna be.
If you don't like debating things, you can just stop posting any time you'd like. We can find all the places we can use d3 and repost old tech all on our own lol.

 

[Qwark28]

And I said if you backdash, b1 will catch you. And it does. Then I went on to confirm that you had a point, and you can just block the b1 and parry the 3. Talk about dumbing shit down... if you dumbed them down any more they wouldn't exist. All you do is make base claims with no breakdown or talk about how awesome your next tech repost is gonna be.
If you don't like debating things, you can just stop posting any time you'd like. We can find all the places we can use d3 and repost old tech all on our own lol.

I'm trying to tell you to backdash after the B1 is blocked...

I don't like debating things when I have to post 3-4 times for one simple line to be understood

Every "old" tech I have posted I've improved on the old base or created new setups altogether... I don't even recall J3 d2 MB RLG ever being mentioned here, or the fact you can safe jump almost every wakeup in the game and punish them, but I guess you already knew that and just didn't bother to share.


I've put up with a lot of nitpicking and condescending replies from you when all I've done is pretty much improve every set up I've worked on, whether it is a new BnB for wallcarry, how to get 33% into a wake up punishing safe jump, how to bypass multi hitting wakeups with proper timing or avoid having to time it altogether with J2, but I guess that's small shit that you'd figure out yourself by adding D3 to everything.

 

[Hellbringer]

What are your toughts of using parry as bait? For example when your crouching against aquaman just inside his b2 range, trying to bait him going for b2 that you can easily parry because its rather slow.

Just giving some ideas.

 

[Qwark28]

What are your toughts of using parry as bait? For example when your crouching against aquaman just inside his b2 range, trying to bait him going for b2 that you can easily parry because its rather slow.

Just giving some ideas.

I would MB F3 and see if he can cancel into scoop fast enough to break your armour, if not, do MB F3 when you got meter instead.

 

[StevoSuprem0]

I'm trying to tell you to backdash after the B1 is blocked...

I don't like debating things when I have to post 3-4 times for one simple line to be understood

Then say it more descriptively the first time. Sometimes, you've been right but it's not clear what your saying. Other times, you're straight up wrong but don't wanna admit it (I too suffer from this stubbornness, but it's all in pursuit of getting the right information and bettering the character).

Every "old" tech I have posted I've improved on the old base or created new setups altogether... I don't even recall J3 d2 MB RLG ever being mentioned here, or the fact you can safe jump almost every wakeup in the game and punish them, but I guess you already knew that and just didn't bother to share.

The j3 d2 RLG stuff has been discussed in my teeth loop thread, after I posted a setup using j3 d2 teeth and someone (I think laudman) shared that j3 d2 rlg links and lets you get a combo. When you posted that tech, I said that part was known, but the d3 usage was new and the crossup properties based on spacing and whether you use j2 or j3 was a cool find.

I've put up with a lot of nitpicking and condescending replies from you when all I've done is pretty much improve every set up I've worked on, whether it is a new BnB for wallcarry, how to get 33% into a wake up punishing safe jump, how to bypass multi hitting wakeups with proper timing or avoid having to time it altogether with J2, but I guess that's small shit that you'd figure out yourself by adding D3 to everything.

Yeah, I have been a dick to you a few times, but only when you do the whole "Got some groundbreaking, unbelievable, amazing, gamechanging tech coming soon guys" - - - - then you post something that's legitimately known (like I just said, and the j2 in the corner stuff). To be fair, you came to this character after alot of us had already posted a lot of work on him, and you didn't seem to read through all of the comments and such on some of the old tech talk, so you probably legitimately missed some of it and thought you were discovering it. But the way you frame those reveals is just obnoxious when it winds up being something known.
You and I argue about matchups all the time, and I will say here and now that you are both a better player than me and have a shitload more matchup experience than I do. I only try to call you on shit because I think your wrong about something, and have been proven wrong myself in doing so on several occasions and admitted so, as have you. And every time that happens, the Joker community improves in the process. So stay salty or get over it lol, your style annoys me and I annoy you, but we tend to get shit done.

 

[StevoSuprem0]

What are your toughts of using parry as bait? For example when your crouching against aquaman just inside his b2 range, trying to bait him going for b2 that you can easily parry because its rather slow.

Just giving some ideas.

Tom has actually talked about this situation a few times, you're definitely correct. You can block low in case he goes for the low starter, but b2 is reactable and you can land a parry on it pretty easily. Not sure if there is a better punish for this situation though.

 

[Qwark28]

Then say it more descriptively the first time. Sometimes, you've been right but it's not clear what your saying. Other times, you're straight up wrong but don't wanna admit it (I too suffer from this stubbornness, but it's all in pursuit of getting the right information and bettering the character).


The j3 d2 RLG stuff has been discussed in my teeth loop thread, after I posted a setup using j3 d2 teeth and someone (I think laudman) shared that j3 d2 rlg links and lets you get a combo. When you posted that tech, I said that part was known, but the d3 usage was new and the crossup properties based on spacing and whether you use j2 or j3 was a cool find.


Yeah, I have been a dick to you a few times, but only when you do the whole "Got some groundbreaking, unbelievable, amazing, gamechanging tech coming soon guys" - - - - then you post something that's legitimately known (like I just said, and the j2 in the corner stuff). To be fair, you came to this character after alot of us had already posted a lot of work on him, and you didn't seem to read through all of the comments and such on some of the old tech talk, so you probably legitimately missed some of it and thought you were discovering it. But the way you frame those reveals is just obnoxious when it winds up being something known.
You and I argue about matchups all the time, and I will say here and now that you are both a better player than me and have a shitload more matchup experience than I do. I only try to call you on shit because I think your wrong about something, and have been proven wrong myself in doing so on several occasions and admitted so, as have you. And every time that happens, the Joker community improves in the process. So stay salty or get over it lol, your style annoys me and I annoy you, but we tend to get shit done.

I have NO problem admiting when I'm wrong, every single time you told me "this has been found" I openly admitted that while the BASE aspect of something like a bnb or such has been discovered, I've simply come up with another use for it. That part is fully new and fully usable.

Like I said, I never "came" here. I'd been reading on my character all along, not posting does not mean not being up to date. I miss one post and post the same thing into more setups 5 days later and it's tagged as already found even when I experimented further on it.

Nothing I ever posted as good tech was already known except the sweep being ambiguous at certain distances, everything else I worked on to improve and you came in every thread which basically went like this

" This is an old setup but now can be done like this"

"Already known"

"Yes, but you can access it easier, get more damage and even force your opponent in completely different situations than possible before"

"Already found"

I've explained multiple times how they're different and everyone else does get it. And for not wording myself correctly :

there is absolutely no need to ever parry b1 on a read

either neutral jump or wait for b1 to come out and backdash or parry the 3

I don't have anything against you but please do read and test the stuff I post. 99% of the time it's not as you make it look, when I say "completely changes the way you use crowbar" as for the tech I'm about to vid it meant that whatever setup on wakeup/no wakeup 50/50 you used to get you now get without wasting a bar on MB crowbar and it has now become a way to just get the guaranteed MB crowbar teeth d2 crowbar otg. I never say anything without being 99% sure and without testing it myself.

It doesn't help the Joker forums, it's just a reminder of older setups in a way that annoys me and actually makes me hesitant to post new stuff due to having to deal with frowning and false statements every single time I post my findings.

 

[StevoSuprem0]

snip

I'm 90% sure you can't backdash that b1 in any way whatsoever, especially with Joker and his shit backdash, but I could be wrong. Need to screw with it when I get home.
I haven't said it every single time though. That new BnB you posted with the f23 teeth 213 was completely new and an awesome find and that's exactly what I said when you posted it. The j3 d2 rlg and most of the sweep stuff was known in general and can be found in a bunch of places. I don't really care either way. In the beginning, it annoyed me because some was things I had posted and some was things from others that we had around, then you came in with the same stuff slapping your name on it and getting front paged for old news that we had put work into. Now I realize that you're generally making small tweaks that improve the tech overall, but I just take issue with the way you build them up and what not when it's just small changes and improvements because I'm hungering for something huge with this character to change the meta and every time this happens its a letdown lol.
I'll just shut up.
Carry on.

 

[Qwark28]

I'm 90% sure you can't backdash that b1 in any way whatsoever, especially with Joker and his shit backdash, but I could be wrong. Need to screw with it when I get home.
I haven't said it every single time though. That new BnB you posted with the f23 teeth 213 was completely new and an awesome find and that's exactly what I said when you posted it. The j3 d2 rlg and most of the sweep stuff was known in general and can be found in a bunch of places. I don't really care either way. In the beginning, it annoyed me because some was things I had posted and some was things from others that we had around, then you came in with the same stuff slapping your name on it and getting front paged for old news that we had put work into. Now I realize that you're generally making small tweaks that improve the tech overall, but I just take issue with the way you build them up and what not when it's just small changes and improvements because I'm hungering for something huge with this character to change the meta and every time this happens its a letdown lol.
I'll just shut up.
Carry on.

Honestly, all you had to do was just send me one link whenever I was saying already found stuff and I'd gladly give all credit to the original finders, you have to help me to help you you see. If I unknowingly stole tech that was frontpaged then credit goes to whoever found the original setup and then to me for improving on it.

When I hype up tech it's honestly not something that will suddenly make Joker top tier or anything, I can't be faulted for your expectations man.

 

[StevoSuprem0]

Honestly, all you had to do was just send me one link whenever I was saying already found stuff and I'd gladly give all credit to the original finders, you have to help me to help you you see. If I unknowingly stole tech that was frontpaged then credit goes to whoever found the original setup and then to me for improving on it.

When I hype up tech it's honestly not something that will suddenly make Joker top tier or anything, I can't be faulted for your expectations man.

Kinda. In the end, it's just fun to bust your balls and sometimes it gets blown out of proportion. I'm really not the only one who's drawing these conclusions. I'm just the only one being a dick about it for laughs. But c'mon, we're playing JOKER here.

 

[StevoSuprem0]

Actually guys a thought just came to me
with higher level ha's
i think we have access to safe insta overheads
currently, as you may already know, insta j2's are super punishable, but with ha's they could be safe
This would further expand our teeth mix up game as we would be able to mix up between b1 and insta j2 for the launch
and perhaps it would make the 2,1,2 teeth mix up better because insta j3 may possibly launch them directly into the teeth since it would hit lower

Just theory crafting

I looked at this a little as well and it holds up nicely, but against ducking opponents it's insanely tough to land an instant j2/3 due to the lower hitbox and how fast he is jumping (unless it's just me, idk). But if you pull it off, this works in the situation you posed and also allows access to combo into 21 and I think 32 following an instant j2, giving us an actual overhead option if we are standing directly in their face and precise to 1-2 frames with the execution. I don't think I'll ever pull that off consistently, but might be something you guys can make use of . I confirmed this for 3 HAs, not sure if it works on 2 but I don't think so, and probably not on 1 either, but not sure. And, of course, instant j2 into 11 works without HAs at all. Just to recap!

 

[The PantyChrist]

So I was experimenting with shit with the parry last night. According to the frame data it's 13f advantage. The standing one is too far to really follow up but the low will allow a max range sweep, crowbar, or far teeth if you're feeling fancy. It's significantly less advantage than 112 or f21 but c'est la vie. May be useful down the road after breakin pressure