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Discussion in 'Jason Voorhees' started by macro, May 6, 2015.
Let the games begin!
has anyone had any success with the other two variations? since slasher as of right now seems like the only viable one? but anyways from what it seems grandmaster sub zero is a really bad match up for him with the only way of getting in being EX bf3 and even then he can ice ball at the same time to break that armor
Ya, Jason has limited option in the Grandmaster MU, i find relentless better due to his teleport and certain strings into clone are a guarenteed ex grab
I think other variations are realy good in my opinion with the tick throws, how far B122 takes you, and coming back to life are crazy useful.
Plus the frames on his B12 and B1 are crazy!
I've said this before, but I can definitely see the other two variations being better later on. Slasher seems to be somewhat basic with pretty weak normals all around
Be careful, they might change the topic name
I bet he loses to almost everyone in the cast or is lucky to go even wih a few. This guy is Mk9 Jade tier
Seems to be the case, definitely gotta work for your win.
I've had some luck with Unstoppable (even took a match from Tom Brady's SZ). His main problem is against zoners, since he has no meterless way in, and since he arises without meter and little health, well, you can predict how that works out. So far my least favorite matchup was Kitana.
I play Unstoppable Jason, against Slasher Jasons I use Warrior Goro, and against Mileena and against Sub I'd go Slasher/Rentlessless over Unstoppable generally.
I basically agree. The only thing I will say is that abusing heal against zoners can be very effective, because it essentially negates all chip. But yeah, being resurrected full screen against kitana with 10% is rage-inducing.
I took a break on the Unstoppable for a bit of Slasher I think I am going to level up Relentless and unstoppable I am surprised. Tom Bradys guide isn't out yet I would love to hear what he thinks of the 3 variations of Jason let me check the Reo stream right now to think of it...
edit: I always thought relentless was safer but I thin mb Unstoppable because the heal and the dmg buff forces the opponent to come to you its a sort of projectile.
Sometimes the MU threads need to be variation specific. For some characters MU are more or less the same from all variations but Jason´s Slasher is waaaaay different from Jason´s Relentless/Unstoppable. And that´s why we are talking about differences between variations and not about matchups
P.D: I hate MU Slasher vs GrandTurtle (3-7?)
I have a question what is relentless suppose to do a about slightly negative low profile d3s?
After blocking one (for example Mileena's) Jason is pushed back where d1 whiffs and b1 and his other low pokes are beat out. The low profile of the opponents d3 makes it where armor whiffs (even x-Ray) and it beats out reversal back breaker. I have been backing up and using f4; I have also had limited success with trying to whiff punish with b1. What do you guys do?
Whats the MU against MoS Ermac? (Relentless Jason)
Cause every time @Afumba chooses Ermac( MoS) in the Select screen i wanna do this:
Sry - I dont see this MU ending well for Jason at all neither against MoS nor Mystic. But if so i like to know too ofc
@YOMI REO @GGA Jeremiah @Big D @YOMI RM Glass Sword (This touches on your question a few posts up)
Figured we might as well try and get these boards going here.
In terms of bad matchups, GM Sub, DF Liu Kang, and A list Cage seem like the struggle. Kang and Cage can feel free to just throw out d3/d4 respectively and it pretty much stuffs out b1 attempts, leaving us to try and approach with a 20ish frame low, or a read for a well timed jump in. (add the great pressure they have on top of that) Is there a certain approach we can take? I find if they're getting a bit to happy with the low profile that you can walk back and start up ex pursuit, but it's a shame having to spend a bar on that. Personally I like backing up and counter poking with b1, as our d1 doesn't exactly have great reach. It seems pretty inconsistent on Cage and Kang though.
Also Jeremiah, I saw in your thread you're struggling with Summoner Quan. What parts of the matchup are giving you issues?
His zoning and meter build. I can't deal with bat. My teleport is too slow. I don't know when it is best to armor in the MU yet. He almost always has the life lead. If I do manage to win a round it is usually because I used all my meter and round 2 Quan is sitting on full meter. Once he gets me to respect his bat, that opens up his super long range overhead.
Do you guys play against solid Summoners? If so is there any footage?
The zoning definitely is frustrating to deal with, that's pretty typical in Quan matchups though. The teleport isn't really used to punish his zoning, more to establish screen presence, punish a string, a read for a punish etc. The best way to get him off of meter build is to get him on his ass sadly. Luckily we can actually be pretty stingy with our meter in this matchup, so what's worked for me personally is reacting with EX clothesline. You can get through any of his projectiles on reaction and get a knockdown, and it's ridiculous air hitbox works on his jump unless it's the peak.
Once you have the knockdown he goes through regular Quan bs, so go at him. Off a midscreen knockdown a backdash or njp are really effective, but you can shut them down off a read, the worst that happens is b12 is blocked and you're -1. If you notice a backdashing trend you can just use Pursuit and let them enjoy that.
Still feeling the matchup out, but doesn't feel nearly as bad as his horrible matchups after a bit of time in the lab. If I'd have to throw a number out it'd be 4-6 or borderline 5-5.
Unfortunately I get the pleasure of being an online warrior, but I get more sorcerer experience than anything. Maybe @General M2Dave or @STB Shujinkydink could weigh in with their perspectives as well. On Dinks chart he has this as even, so he could give you the other side of it.
@YOMI REO @Big D @GGA Jeremiah
Hey how are you guys approaching the Kobu matchup? To be honest I'm a little lost on what our options are, even if I guess have a chance to get out of the Rekka pressure, my poke seems to stop a little short in certain situations. Is armor our only reliable way to get out?
Edit. I know armoring against Tanya sucks, but not sure what other options are available.
I have a funny story for all of you. Was playing against Metzos's kuatan warrior the other day using relentless. It's a really bad situation, pursuit doesn't do much because
1) goro telestomp, easy to do even with reverse inputs
2) earthquake can be done by up,up+all buttons (since goro doesnt have any other down down command) and dangerous specials in general
3) good down pokes to quickly check which button is where
also anti zoning with lake mist is not an option against earthquake so, except killing machine for ending rounds and a slight dmg buff (because that's what it is), variation moves are decorative
Then I did something stupid. I picked Unstoppable. 5 minutes later I was trying to remember from the things I've eaten that day, what could possibly had "dangerous" mushrooms in it, cause I was winning
But, after looking at it more clearly, unstoppable has guaranteed buffs after tight squeeze and sometimes after temple punch. You don't always have to ruin your combo to get them. Also well placed dmg buffs and meter management create much better situations than relentless
what I want to say is when playing relentless try using pursuit and lake mist as much as possible in order to realize where and when they excel. If they don't work, put the chain on
TLDR: UNSTOPPABLE WORKS
So is unstoppable a better style to fight in match ups?
Nope. If you're gonna go with Unstoppable, you might as well just use Relentless. At least you still get Killing Machine (dd4) and you have access to Dark Pursuit (dd3).
The "perks" of using Unstoppable are useless. His dd3 and dd4 are all pretty effin' bad and don't bring much of anything (if anything at all) to the table.