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Injustice 2 numbers for EVO revealed, no 8AM pools

A F0xy Grampa

Problem X Promotions
Premium Supporter
I read through this thread, and 99% of the people replying to this thread have no idea what they're talking about. This is just another case of people jumping to self-hate when they didn't actually look at the facts.

This has nothing to do with INJ2 -- the numbers are down across the board.

SFV 2016 Entrants -- 5065
SFV 2017 Entrants -- 2622

Snash 4 2016 Entrants -- 2637
Smash 4 2017 Entrants -- 1514

Melee 2016 entrants -- 2350
Melee 2017 entrants -- 1435

There are less entrants for EVO actoss the board. Which will mean less random people to enter Inj2. Did you really think the 1100 entrants for MKX were all our community? No. That included hundreds of players from other games. So when there are less people playing other games at EVO, we get less random entrants.

People didn't even read the other numbers because thety were so eager to find a reason to bash our community. This needs to stop.

MKX year 1 - 1167
MKX year 2 - 767

Injustice Year 1 - 883

Doesnt look good to me considering that every other year 1 release for each NRS game had more entrants than a year 1 tourney for the previous game.

Regardless of the circumstances, this is still the first year where we've not grown on year 1 numbers since ever.
 
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CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
MKX year 1 - 1167
MKX year 2 - 767

Injustice Year 1 - 883

Doesnt look good to me considering that every other year 1 release for each NRS game had more entrants than a year 1 tourney for the previous game.

Regardless of the circumstances, this is still the first year where we've not grown on year 1 numbers since ever.
Smash and SF have grown at EVO every year until this year. This is the first EVO I can think of in recent years that is actually down thousands of attendees total from the previous year. That just doesn't happen (it usually gets bigger every year).

It's just an aypical year and numbers are down all over.

But besides that, this is the first NRS game we've had that isn't actually a completely new game. Everyone has seen Aquaman and his trident rush, BA divekicks/lightning, Superman and the f23 laser show before etc. You can't really compare this to MKX -- or even IGAU or MK9, because it's not the same.
 
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Linkuei82

Live by the sword, Die by the sword
Premium Supporter
Smash and SF have grown at EVO every year until this year. This is the first EVO I can think of in recent years that is actually down thousands of attendees total from the previous year. That just doesn't happen (it usually gets bigger every year).

It's just an aypical year and numbers are down all over.

But besides that, this is the first NRS game we've had that isn't actually a completely new game. Everyone has seen Aquaman and his trident rush, BA divekicks/lightning, Superman and the f23 laser show before etc. You can't really compare this to MKX -- or even IGAU or MK9, because it's not the same.
SF has grown each year. The numbers for SFV is still higher then each year SFIV appeared in evo. The over 5k numbers fro SFV was freakishly unrealistic. No one was thinking that 5k or more was going to show up this year.

What we were saying is that MKX reached 1k it's first year. Tekken reached 1k it's first year at evo. INJ2 is a new game and didn't even reach 1k and we are all trying to figure out the factors why.
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
SF has grown each year. The numbers for SFV is still higher then each year SFIV appeared in evo. The over 5k numbers fro SFV was freakishly unrealistic. No one was thinking that 5k or more was going to show up this year.

What we were saying is that MKX reached 1k it's first year. Tekken reached 1k it's first year at evo. INJ2 is a new game and didn't even reach 1k and we are all trying to figure out the factors why.
Look at the chart:
https://www.eventhubs.com/imagegallery/2017/jul/01/evo-numbers-over-years/1/

Everything in red is down from its previous appearance at EVO. Blazblue is new as well. First EVO for a brand new KoF also.

Smash was hit just as hard as SF after being up for several years in a row.
 

villainous monk

Terrible times breed terrible things, my lord.
Look at the chart:
https://www.eventhubs.com/imagegallery/2017/jul/01/evo-numbers-over-years/1/

Everything in red is down from its previous appearance at EVO. Blazblue is new as well. First EVO for a brand new KoF also.

Smash was hit just as hard as SF after being up for several years in a row.
So the question I have is why?

With mk having a big year in 2015 and a tapering off in 2016 and mostly the same for other games why the decline? I'm to honesty surprised that inj2 numbers are where they are.

I don't want to be that guy and say is it from the economy, advertisement, not enough support from communities other then from the game itself, like top players, streamers, or is it the games? Or due too the influx of online support like esl, nrs hometown heroes or all the other cup leagues for these games? Or Is evo just in a down year?

Like I said I'm surprised by all the numbers but I kind of I'm kind of interested in knowing why.
 

ExpectFlames

Lord of embers
So the question I have is why?

With mk having a big year in 2015 and a tapering off in 2016 and mostly the same for other games why the decline? I'm to honesty surprised that inj2 numbers are where they are.

I don't want to be that guy and say is it from the economy, advertisement, not enough support from communities other then from the game itself, like top players, streamers, or is it the games? Or due too the influx of online support like esl, nrs hometown heroes or all the other cup leagues for these games? Or Is evo just in a down year?

Like I said I'm surprised by all the numbers but I kind of I'm kind of interested in knowing why.
No yomi villians...
 

Rathalos

Play Monster Hunter!
Premium Supporter
SFV losing numbers was inevitable, people just singed up because of the hype of playing a new SF and trying to get into the game early, since a lot of people feel like they missed out on SF4, since joining that game late was pretty hard. Turns out fighting games are hard, and SFV is not to everyones taste.

Those numbers were inflated to hell with people who were going to drop the game no matter what happened.

I'm more interested in the Smash numbers, is there any reason for that? Smash milfs not paying for there kiddies to come this year? Another tournament taking away EVO entrants?
 

Zoidberg747

My blades will find your heart
SFV losing numbers was inevitable, people just singed up because of the hype of playing a new SF and trying to get into the game early, since a lot of people feel like they missed out on SF4, since joining that game late was pretty hard. Turns out fighting games are hard, and SFV is not to everyones taste.

Those numbers were inflated to hell with people who were going to drop the game no matter what happened.

I'm more interested in the Smash numbers, is there any reason for that? Smash milfs not paying for there kiddies to come this year? Another tournament taking away EVO entrants?
Not part of the smash community but some reasons i've been hearing:

1. The Smash 4 tournament last year was ran terribly. No organization, pools ran late and bracket runners disappeared randomly. Rules were applied inconsistently or were broken frequently. There were not nearly enough setups etc etc. I'd bet a big part of them getting the Sunday spot was EVO trying to make up for this, but last year left a bad taste in a lot of Smash 4 players mouths.

2. Melee players are super miffed about being put on Saturday, especially because they think melee is overall a way better game than Smash 4. A lot of them don't feel the event is worth going to if it is only 2 days.

3. Over-saturation of tournaments. Melee has like 12 or 13 huge majors every year and a ton of regionals. A lot of these are smash focused which makes them way better for casual level players (which a majority of EVO entrants are). Unless they like other FGs there are way better tournaments for smash players specifically in their mind.
 

haketh

Noob
I'm more interested in the Smash numbers, is there any reason for that? Smash milfs not paying for there kiddies to come this year? Another tournament taking away EVO entrants?
Smash 4 & Melee have more of their own speciality tournaments & I'm guessing people are choosing to go to those rather then spend a shitton of money on EVO.

That's not a good reason, it's not like it is guaranteed for another legendary moment to happen this year.
How is that not a good reason when it got EVO tons of coverage & more often than not Blaz has what's agreed to be one of the better Top 8s each year it's in? Plus anyway it's good to rotate games on Top 8 Sunday so we're not seeing the same games each Sunday, it's a good spotlight for smaller scenes.
 

STORMS

Owner / Director
Administrator
Ya you can blame them. Sponsored players can play more than one game. Marvel players are sponsored and the game has no money. Smash players are sponsored and sometimes the game gets no pot bonus. I get going where the money is buy you can play multiple games. Some of which having no insane pots. Sonicfox does it. Justin Wong does it other people do it. Its absurd to think that just cause you are sponsored means you shouldn't play multiple games if you like the game
I stand corrected. Good points.
 

Jynks

some heroes are born, some made, some wondrous
Sorry to ask this again... but I got no reply..

Is IJ2 still not getting a Main Stage Final? Or did they change that? I have heard conflicting things.
 

Zoidberg747

My blades will find your heart
Sorry to ask this again... but I got no reply..

Is IJ2 still not getting a Main Stage Final? Or did they change that? I have heard conflicting things.
It's on whatever the main stage is for Saturday finals, but it is not in the event center on Sunday and certainly won't be on as big of a stage as that. Don't know if that answers your question or not.
 

Jynks

some heroes are born, some made, some wondrous
i see cool.. thanks man. So not in the stadium kinda thing like MKx was last year : ( booooo!!! : )
 

haketh

Noob
Ya you can blame them. Sponsored players can play more than one game. Marvel players are sponsored and the game has no money. Smash players are sponsored and sometimes the game gets no pot bonus. I get going where the money is buy you can play multiple games. Some of which having no insane pots. Sonicfox does it. Justin Wong does it other people do it. Its absurd to think that just cause you are sponsored means you shouldn't play multiple games if you like the game
I still get games in Breakers Revenge & vanilla 98 with Justin & Floe if I have a setup & they're at tournaments I'm at. I can't remember the last time I had people play MK9/UMKIII/MKT ETC when I have setups at tournaments & I see people talk all the time about how they still love these games.
 

Error404

Noob
It also worth noting that the games frustrating zoning and obvious balance issues are a problem. Especially considering that Tekken 7 came out 2 weeks after injustice. I can see a lot of new players quickly droping I2 in favor of T7.
 

Jynks

some heroes are born, some made, some wondrous
I think a factor at least in the Saturday session is the timing. The NRS community insists on 3/5.. and that is fine.. but Evo is now broadcast on television.. this means it needs to hit very strict timetables.

I suspect that IJ2 was moved to the 1st day for finals off the main stage due to the unpredictability in the match times.

It also worth noting that the games frustrating zoning and obvious balance issues are a problem. Especially considering that Tekken 7 came out 2 weeks after injustice. I can see a lot of new players quickly droping I2 in favor of T7.
I doubt that has anything to do with anything. The Zoning issue is such a minor thing and not even unique to this game. I get that some people (maybe you) dislike it, or like Tekken better but I really doubt this is a contributing factor in any meaningful way.
 

Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
I think a factor at least in the Saturday session is the timing. The NRS community insists on 3/5.. and that is fine.. but Evo is now broadcast on television.. this means it needs to hit very strict timetables.

I suspect that IJ2 was moved to the 1st day for finals off the main stage due to the unpredictability in the match times.



I doubt that has anything to do with anything. The Zoning issue is such a minor thing and not even unique to this game. I get that some people (maybe you) dislike it, or like Tekken better but I really doubt this is a contributing factor in any meaningful way.
It wasn't moved to Saturday, it never was on Sunday. It was picked to be on Saturday before the game eveb came out.
 

Roy Arkon

I will leave my seal on you!
It wasn't moved to Saturday, it never was on Sunday. It was picked to be on Saturday before the game eveb came out.
Did I mention the disrespect already?

Speaking of EVO, this might be dumb for me to point that out now, but I've noticed that BB has less entrants then GG, yet BB is on Sunday while GG is also on Saturday. And people bring up the fact that BB had one of the best EVO moments in history back in 2014 that justifying that spot, except that this is the first time since 2014 that any BB game makes it to EVO, not just for Sunday, but OVERALL.

I mean, the whole EVO lineup is just stupid. It seems like that unless it's a Capcom game, a game that comes from a company that is in good relations with Capcom (Tekken 7 from Namco) or a Smash game, it's not going to get the proper treatment. Yes it is only speculation but it does seems like it.
 

Dondarrionz

Askani'son
I doubt that has anything to do with anything. The Zoning issue is such a minor thing and not even unique to this game. I get that some people (maybe you) dislike it, or like Tekken better but I really doubt this is a contributing factor in any meaningful way.
I partially agree with your point but zoning is actually an issue. Not the aspect of playing against it but that no one wants to watch a zoner poke their way to victory. It's boring and frustrating for nearly everyone watching and just a massive downer to see and it's a hype killer. People are just going to turn that shit off.

Purely from a casual viewpoint, that shit's bad for business.
 

Marlow

Premium
Premium Supporter
I don't think Injustice 2 being on Saturday is "disrespect", I think it's logistics. I don't even think it's a problem though. I'd rather have a Saturday night finals than a Sunday day finals anyways.
 

ExpectFlames

Lord of embers
I partially agree with your point but zoning is actually an issue. Not the aspect of playing against it but that no one wants to watch a zoner poke their way to victory. It's boring and frustrating for nearly everyone watching and just a massive downer to see and it's a hype killer. People are just going to turn that shit off.

Purely from a casual viewpoint, that shit's bad for business.
This is a incontrovertible fact. It's hilarious that people try to agree against this. People on the forum sometimes forget that there are more casuals than hardcore lol
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
I think a factor at least in the Saturday session is the timing. The NRS community insists on 3/5.. and that is fine.. but Evo is now broadcast on television.. this means it needs to hit very strict timetables.

I suspect that IJ2 was moved to the 1st day for finals off the main stage due to the unpredictability in the match times.
Only SFV was on TV -- nothing else was on ESPN2.

And I'm not sure if that's happening again this year. The announcement in 2016 was already made by this time.
 

Marlow

Premium
Premium Supporter
This is a incontrovertible fact. It's hilarious that people try to agree against this. People on the forum sometimes forget that there are more casuals than hardcore lol
IDK, I watched a lot of ComboBreaker and CEO streams, there wasn't that much full screen zoning going on. I thought CEO top 16 through finals was pretty hype.
 
Maybe the launch entrance numbers are less because IJ2 was release on consoles only and there was no PC release. Remember MKX was launched on both PC and consoles. Being a PC only guy, I don’t have access to IJ2.
 

Zoidberg747

My blades will find your heart
Maybe the launch entrance numbers are less because IJ2 was release on consoles only and there was no PC release. Remember MKX was launched on both PC and consoles. Being a PC only guy, I don’t have access to IJ2.
Unlikely. The PC releases for NRS have always been ass.

If anything it's because the SFV numbers are way down and that means less crossover entrants.