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If DAMIAN had a different moveset and frame data than NW...

AK L0rdoftheFLY

I hatelove this game
Premium Supporter
I Loved the concept of Human cyrax and robo cyrax having different frame data for specials. Now MKX has 3 different versions of each character. This has made me think about the hatred for DAMIAN and how his move set really should be slightly different than Dick's.

My thoughts are based around the nature of the two characters and how they differ in aggression and ideals. Dick is more reserved like batman but Damian is more brutal and violent.

ESCRIMA:

Regular Escrima Fury is the same animation as Dicks meterburn version...it just gets one his of armor when meterburned. To compensate, damage is same as regular on both version regardless if meturburned or not.

Scatterbombs are the same but meterburn version instead just increases the startup speed and grants one hit of armor. This acts similarly to Grundy's mb swamp hands in terms of frames. It offers only a slight advantage on hit and does not do as much damage as Dick's mb scatterbombs. It will be a more reliable AA when meterburned though.

Wing Dings are also bombs that stay on the ground when thrown while he is in the air. the MB version instead of throwing another, instead activates the bombs causing a knockdown on hit and slight advantage on block. They have a large ground hitbox and a small air hitbox similar to GP. Same damage as wingdings if everything hits. If only the MB hits it grants slightly more damage than the last hit of old mb wing dings.

Ground spark is Red instead of Blue. Regular version acts the exact same but mb version cancels you to Staff allowing you to special cancel into flying grayson, staff spin or ground pound. If they jump your GS you can hit them with FG. If they block it you can check with GP. Staff spin and GP have frame gaps of 6 frames of greater allowing them to be interrupted from the right range. SS can also be meterburned following the MB GS. MB GS can be delayed as long as GS is on the screen.

(This opens up a few options for prolonged pressure if not interrupted or full comboed. 33GSmb SS mb GP MB)

Flip kick is the exact same as before. MB version grants a stance switch to staff that can be special cancelled like GS. Frame gap makes ss and gp dangerous but opens up FG. (See FG notes to see why this is important).

STAFF:

Flying Grayson does more damage and hits high. (15% instead of 13% and 3% on block). To compensate, it is -8 on block and on hit grants less advantage. This means it is punishable by almost the entire cast if blocked. It also has one hit of armor.

Regular Ground pound has the same frame data and damage but causes a knockdown on hit with more advantage. It is not a hard knockdown. MB version pops them up just like before. Frame data on block is the same.

Staff Spin is the exact same with no changes.

How would you differentiate DAMIAN from Dick in this game? I would honestly rather play Kid Damian as Robin in the Injustice Comic with an entirely different moveset all together but this is just for fun.

I tried to be fair and not just make him better. I think this is just different enough to make it interesting but not give him any advantage. He is not as safe but hits a little harder with the FG meta and GS meta.
 

TopTierHarley

Kytinn King
Premium Supporter
I Loved the concept of Human cyrax and robo cyrax having different frame data for specials. Now MKX has 3 different versions of each character. This has made me think about the hatred for DAMIAN and how his move set really should be slightly different than Dick's.

My thoughts are based around the nature of the two characters and how they differ in aggression and ideals. Dick is more reserved like batman but Damian is more brutal and violent.

ESCRIMA:

Regular Escrima Fury is the same animation as Dicks meterburn version...it just gets one his of armor when meterburned. To compensate, damage is same as regular on both version regardless if meturburned or not.

Scatterbombs are the same but meterburn version instead just increases the startup speed and grants one hit of armor. This acts similarly to Grundy's mb swamp hands in terms of frames. It offers only a slight advantage on hit and does not do as much damage as Dick's mb scatterbombs. It will be a more reliable AA when meterburned though.

Wing Dings are also bombs that stay on the ground when thrown while he is in the air. the MB version instead of throwing another, instead activates the bombs causing a knockdown on hit and slight advantage on block. They have a large ground hitbox and a small air hitbox similar to GP. Same damage as wingdings if everything hits. If only the MB hits it grants slightly more damage than the last hit of old mb wing dings.

Ground spark is Red instead of Blue. Regular version acts the exact same but mb version cancels you to Staff allowing you to special cancel into flying grayson, staff spin or ground pound. If they jump your GS you can hit them with FG. If they block it you can check with GP. Staff spin and GP have frame gaps of 6 frames of greater allowing them to be interrupted from the right range. SS can also be meterburned following the MB GS. MB GS can be delayed as long as GS is on the screen.

(This opens up a few options for prolonged pressure if not interrupted or full comboed. 33GSmb SS mb GP MB)

Flip kick is the exact same as before. MB version grants a stance switch to staff that can be special cancelled like GS. Frame gap makes ss and gp dangerous but opens up FG. (See FG notes to see why this is important).

STAFF:

Flying Grayson does more damage and hits high. (15% instead of 13% and 3% on block). To compensate, it is -8 on block and on hit grants less advantage. This means it is punishable by almost the entire cast if blocked. It also has one hit of armor.

Regular Ground pound has the same frame data and damage but causes a knockdown on hit with more advantage. It is not a hard knockdown. MB version pops them up just like before. Frame data on block is the same.

Staff Spin is the exact same with no changes.

How would you differentiate DAMIAN from Dick in this game? I would honestly rather play Kid Damian as Robin in the Injustice Comic with an entirely different moveset all together but this is just for fun.

I tried to be fair and not just make him better. I think this is just different enough to make it interesting but not give him any advantage. He is not as safe but hits a little harder with the FG meta and GS meta.
If anything they could have changed the color of GS, but this would have been a cool concept
 

Laos_boy

Meow Hoes
I Loved the concept of Human cyrax and robo cyrax having different frame data for specials. Now MKX has 3 different versions of each character. This has made me think about the hatred for DAMIAN and how his move set really should be slightly different than Dick's.

My thoughts are based around the nature of the two characters and how they differ in aggression and ideals. Dick is more reserved like batman but Damian is more brutal and violent.

ESCRIMA:

Regular Escrima Fury is the same animation as Dicks meterburn version...it just gets one his of armor when meterburned. To compensate, damage is same as regular on both version regardless if meturburned or not.

Scatterbombs are the same but meterburn version instead just increases the startup speed and grants one hit of armor. This acts similarly to Grundy's mb swamp hands in terms of frames. It offers only a slight advantage on hit and does not do as much damage as Dick's mb scatterbombs. It will be a more reliable AA when meterburned though.

Wing Dings are also bombs that stay on the ground when thrown while he is in the air. the MB version instead of throwing another, instead activates the bombs causing a knockdown on hit and slight advantage on block. They have a large ground hitbox and a small air hitbox similar to GP. Same damage as wingdings if everything hits. If only the MB hits it grants slightly more damage than the last hit of old mb wing dings.

Ground spark is Red instead of Blue. Regular version acts the exact same but mb version cancels you to Staff allowing you to special cancel into flying grayson, staff spin or ground pound. If they jump your GS you can hit them with FG. If they block it you can check with GP. Staff spin and GP have frame gaps of 6 frames of greater allowing them to be interrupted from the right range. SS can also be meterburned following the MB GS. MB GS can be delayed as long as GS is on the screen.

(This opens up a few options for prolonged pressure if not interrupted or full comboed. 33GSmb SS mb GP MB)

Flip kick is the exact same as before. MB version grants a stance switch to staff that can be special cancelled like GS. Frame gap makes ss and gp dangerous but opens up FG. (See FG notes to see why this is important).

STAFF:

Flying Grayson does more damage and hits high. (15% instead of 13% and 3% on block). To compensate, it is -8 on block and on hit grants less advantage. This means it is punishable by almost the entire cast if blocked. It also has one hit of armor.

Regular Ground pound has the same frame data and damage but causes a knockdown on hit with more advantage. It is not a hard knockdown. MB version pops them up just like before. Frame data on block is the same.

Staff Spin is the exact same with no changes.

How would you differentiate DAMIAN from Dick in this game? I would honestly rather play Kid Damian as Robin in the Injustice Comic with an entirely different moveset all together but this is just for fun.

I tried to be fair and not just make him better. I think this is just different enough to make it interesting but not give him any advantage. He is not as safe but hits a little harder with the FG meta and GS meta.
Damian is my favorite robin. IMO he should has a sword instead of his escrim sticks

Ground spark
- he takes his sword like zatanna low magic
Wingdings
- ninja stars

He has a smaller hit box than Grayson
 

Rickyraws

This mean you don't like me?
Because of how many people hate Damian, his changes must be elusive. If he becomes a no brainer and people use him simply because he's slightly better, it wouldn't be satisfying. If he's no different from his counter part, no one would use him. If his changes were elusive, then players would have to make a decision, and potentially learn to love him due to preference with regards to his play style.

Do you play the one with slightly faster frames or the one with a lower hitbox?

Do you play the one with a touch more mobility or less recovery frames?

Do you play the one with cooler clash quotes, or badass tech grab quips?

Not to mention 'good' and 'bad' Green Lantern both have different win screens. Same can be done for Nightwing.
 

AK L0rdoftheFLY

I hatelove this game
Premium Supporter
maybe... not add armor to everything?
why not? DAMIAN charges head first into danger with less regard for his own safety. The armor is morea about the way DAMIAN acts. he still takes damage while doing it and I believeI only added armor to EF, SB, and FG.

The first two will not change too much. Burn a bar for mb b3 or mb EF...no big difference. SB becomes a tad more useful. FG with armor but being unsafe is a good trade and you know it.
 

TKB

Noob
yall put too much faith in armor.
To be perfectly honest, I like your concept but I think this would make him significantly stronger than the current nightwing in the game and nobody would bother playing Dick anymore. (and it's not just the armor)
 

mfkaoz

Banned
Regime shazam should have a constant aura of lightning that does 35%chip every time you come close to him. Oh and an air torpedo.
 

BigMilk

Former Divine Power Abuser
Ok, this is my concept on giving Dick & Damian different movesets. Damian would be more of a rushdown archtype while Dick would be more defensive, counterzone archtype.

Damian: Escrima fury would give full animation on block but remain as punishable(does 4% chip). MB Flip kick is +3 or +4 on block. Ground Spark can jump cancel forward. Escrima F3 more similar to BM F3. Flying Grayson can MB for two hits of armor. Escrima has better forward walk speed.

Dick: MB Wingdings track anywhere on screen. Escrima has wall jump. Scatterbombs or d2 have 8f startup. Ground Spark can jump cancel neutral or away. MB Staff Spin is 0 on block but instead of last hit for advantage, it becomes a safe retreat (similar to BM b23) Escrima B3 has more range. Escrima walk back animation is the moonwalk.
Thoughts?
@AK L0rdoftheFLY
 
Last edited:

AK L0rdoftheFLY

I hatelove this game
Premium Supporter
Ok, this is my concept on giving Dick & Damian different movesets. Damian would be more of a rushdown archtype while Dick would be more defensive, counterzone archtype.

Damian: Escrima fury would give full animation on block but remain as punishable(does 4% chip). MB Flip kick is +3 or +4 on block. Ground Spark can jump cancel forward. Escrima F3 more similar to BM F3. Flying Grayson can MB for two hits of armor. Escrima has better forward walk speed.

Dick: MB Wingdings track anywhere on screen. Escrima has wall jump. Scatterbombs or d2 have 8f startup. Ground Spark can jump cancel neutral or away. MB Staff Spin is 0 on block but instead of last hit for advantage, it becomes a safe retreat (similar to BM b23) Escrima B3 has more range. Escrima walk back animation is the moonwalk.
Thoughts?
@AK L0rdoftheFLY
fucking brilliant
 

BigMilk

Former Divine Power Abuser
fucking brilliant
Also, Damian MB Ground Spark puts you in a stun on hit(similar to Lex's mine) which allows you to go for your typical Gotham Reset Garbage(see BM & BG). This would give Damian a better midscreen game. Damian would be a deadly pressure character but still worse than Dick. Moonwalk trumps all :)