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Match-up Discussion - Grandmaster Help With Goro

hkriderz

hkriderz

Lin Kuei Scum, yellow robot enthusiast
I played a set with a good Goro yesterday ( the one with the flame breath) And I know my stuff with sub. It was an absolute mop. I can't believe people ask for buffs for Goro. Goro is safe, he's plus, he has a double armor hitconfirmable launcher into good damage, he has fast pokes, he has a stomp that becomes a 50 50 with the tracking, a command grab, and he builds meter like nobody's business.

I couldn't do anything. I was always scared of his armor on wakeup even with the clone out since I have to spend my own bar to break it. After punchwalk he would either AA my jump over, block my poke and continue his meter build, or do another Ex and put me back in the same situation. Very frustrating. On top of that I had no answer to stomp. I did slide but then he becomes safe with the distance and it becomes free meterbuild -_-

Please help. What is my universal answer to stomp, and how do I deal with punchwalk mindgames and armor? Any Goros who would want to help me with this matchup would be appreciated?

@flappysamyhamy @Rolling_Toaster @Dankster Morgan @ any sub mains @ any Goro mains
 
Tweedy

Tweedy

Noob
Stomp has really bad risk/reward. Just guess where he's gonna land and dash/backdash/stand still, and punish. If you're right you get F4 xx ice ball. He gets a stomp. It's fair that you have to guess.

If he's blocking your poke, you're free to do whatever you want. Throw, B2, etc. I would say to F3 more than poke, though. F33 into klone, hit confirm into EX ice ball on hit, if you can. He can't just mash after a blocked punchwalk to beat your F3. Don't jump after punchwalk. Goro players are always looking for U1 after punchwalk.

Just block his armor, or go in regardless. The worst thing that you can do, is let him get out without having to use meter. If you have him in the corner and he does EX punchwalk, he's out of that meter and if he lands, it's gonna be tough for him to get oki. Sub's backdash is probably hella obnoxious for Goro when he's trying to get oki, when he doesn't have Sub in the corner.
 
Solomon Gorondy

Solomon Gorondy

Should Goro be top 5?
Makes meter like nobody's business? Only if that business went bankrupt. I bet Tigrar Fury burnt it down for the insurance money.

Like tweedy said the universal answer to Stomp is dash, back-dash, or stand your ground. Goro has a 1/3 chance to to hit for 10% while you have a 2/3 chance to punish with a full combo. If you crouch under the Ice Clone while Goro uses Stomp, Goro will be punished for a full combo as all three of his options are forfeit. You can even run>crouch on reaction if the clone is in front of you. Slide will dodge Stomp every time which is a good thing.

Sub-Zero has to respect Goro's wake-up even when he's cornered which is an oddity. Punchwalk is -5 on block and Sub-Zero has a good back-dash so, if a post blocked Punchwalk is bothering you, just go back to the mid-range neutral game. Goro is good at close range but struggles outside of that especially if you get a clone up.

Like all characters, Goro is much better when he has you cornered. Luckily your Ex-Slide beats his lows, his throws, and low profiles under his overheads, while also switching sides. Goro's options for EX Slide are block low or EX-Punchwalk.

I think Dragon Fangs is Goro's best variation cause he can poke through the Ice Clone without freezing. If it`s not, it`s Tigrar, "Great Balls of," Fury.
 
Tanno

Tanno

The Fantasy is the Reality of the Mind
When you see him doing the telestomp, do the Ice Klone immediately or time your D2. I did it and froze him spot on. His telestomp is so slow. If your reaction against telestomp is slow, just slide.

As for the rest, I don't know well, so I did read about the other stuff. Very useful.
 
CrazyFingers

CrazyFingers

The Power of Lame Compels You
I feel like this is the only matchup where goro can really do his thing because you can't really corner him and sub-zero has slow pokes and bad ways to contest Goro's neutral. I usually don't have an issue with the matchup when I play Goro and I'm usually abyssmal with GM matchups but that's me, idk if the matchup is actually good for goro tho
 
hkriderz

hkriderz

Lin Kuei Scum, yellow robot enthusiast
Dankster Morgan said:
Make sure you know how to armor break punch walk in the corner
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I do. But it feels like a waste of bar unless on a godlike read. If Goro delays the armor its a waste.

Dankster Morgan said:
I think it's even, I just struggle with Goro as a personal thing. It's not really Sub's fault when I lose to Goro, Goro is just a weird character.
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After yesterday, Goro might be the same for me too. It feels harder than its said to be.
 
RoboCop

RoboCop

The future of law enforcement.
Administrator
Premium Supporter
Stomp isn't invincible. With Jax, I just d2. If it hits, I actually get a combo. If he alters the stomp and I whiff, I still recover fast enough to punish. I don't know how good SZ's d2 is, but I think even NJP might catch stomp. I wouldn't be surprised if SZ's b2 could beat it.

You can also use backdash invincibility to beat it, though this is a lot less consistent. Either way, Stomp can't be delayed or anything, so once you learn the timing, you should be able to punish it 100% of the time. And like @Tweedy said, even if you mess up and get caught, you take, what, 12% damage? No biggie.
 
Tanno

Tanno

The Fantasy is the Reality of the Mind
karaokelove said:
Stomp isn't invincible. With Jax, I just d2. If it hits, I actually get a combo. If he alters the stomp and I whiff, I still recover fast enough to punish. I don't know how good SZ's d2 is, but I think even NJP might catch stomp. I wouldn't be surprised if SZ's b2 could beat it.

You can also use backdash invincibility to beat it, though this is a lot less consistent. Either way, Stomp can't be delayed or anything, so once you learn the timing, you should be able to punish it 100% of the time. And like @Tweedy said, even if you mess up and get caught, you take, what, 12% damage? No biggie.
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I did that D2 and didn't affect SZ at all. I'm a GM SZ mainer here. I even had to Ice Klone in reaction against Mileena's telekick.
 
Knoterror

Knoterror

Noob
Frost Bomb is a great counter to stomp. You can easily turn that into damage and a corner setup.

Truth is, a GM has to accept that the meta in this matchup is different than most. GM is used to steamrolling through armor in the corner and now he can't always do that, in all practicality. Sometimes you're just going to have to respect EX Punchwalk. You have to play around it. The Punchwak mind games are real. Lol

I think Goro wins the long set personally. Specifically KW against GM. The ground pound gives no shits about run-ins or slides or, most importantly, clones on the screen, and sets up a pound/stomp/fireball guessing game that can be pretty hilarious. One hard knockdown and its easy enough to frustrate a GM into getting caught with Goros F3 for around 35-40 percent. Sub should mostly be whiff punishing Goro, in my opinion. Subs D1 and D3 are 9 frames against Goro's 6 frames and Goro can punish clone cancels. Sub doesn't want to be anywhere close to Goro.
 
Alright RyRy

Alright RyRy

Florida Kombat
Just run on reaction to stomp, Goro without meter maybe the one the hardest characters to get out of the ice clone corner game. Goro cannot punish B2 in the corner at decent range unless he is using KW.

Brady plays this MU perfectly, better than any other sub I have ever played.

Don't try Goro on wake-up unless he has 0 meter.
 
Tanno

Tanno

The Fantasy is the Reality of the Mind
EVB Alright RyRy said:
Just run on reaction to stomp, Goro without meter maybe the one the hardest characters to get out of the ice clone corner game. Goro cannot punish B2 in the corner at decent range unless he is using KW.

Brady plays this MU perfectly, better than any other sub I have ever played.

Don't try Goro on wake-up unless he has 0 meter.
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Do you have a YT link with Tom playing against Goro? Thanks. Would love to watch it. It would be valuable data.
 
flappysamyhamy

flappysamyhamy

EMPEROR FLAPPY / EGGPLANT
The trick is making him waste all of his meter, respect him. After punchwalk don't try to jump. That complicates things. just check with f3 or bait out more armor, even that in itself is a guess, idk man, that's how I play the mu and I've always been ok at it. For the stomp I just run forward and f4 Iceball punish, or Backdash it. It's kinda crazy that its a guess. Maybe you could just ex frostbomb, I'd need to lab it though. If you don't have meter to armor break him in the corner, you can backdash and jump back punch. It's hard to keep him in the corner but with the right conditioning and reads it's still really overwhelming for goro.
 
TheGangstaFace

TheGangstaFace

Psn, Xbox, Twitter: TheGangstaFace
Lol I just made a similar thread the other day. Go check it out, the Goro community made very valid arguments about why this character needs buffs
 
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