Menu
By:
Filters
What's new

Match-up Discussion - Dualist FOREVER ELITE'S Dualist MU chart

FOREVER EL1TE

FOREVER EL1TE

Noob
Apparently, I never made a thread on this; so here it is.
Also : DUALIST NEEDS A BUFF NRS,
To read this,
The number next to the character name is the mu # in general, while the number next to the variation(s) are more specific. Also, I am an upplayer, so don't kill me.

Cassie Cage 4-6
Hollywood 4-6
Brawler 4-6
Spec Ops 4-6

D’Vorah 6-4
Brood Mother 6-4
Swarm Queen 6-4
Venomous 5-5

Ermac 3-7
Mystic 3-7
Spectral 4-6
Master of Souls 4-6

Erron Black5-5
Marksman 6-4
Gunslinger 5-5
Outlaw 5-5

Ferra & Torr 6-4
Ruthless 6-4
Vicious 5-5
Lackey 6-4

Goro 5-5?
Dragon Fangs 5-5
Kuatan Warrior 5-5
Tigrar Fury 5-5

Jacqui 6-4
High Tech 5-5
Shotgun 4-6
Full Auto 6-4


Jax 5-5
Pumped Up 5-5
Heavy Weapons 4-6
Wrestler 5-5

Johnny Cage 4-6
A-List 4-6
Fistcuffs 5-5
Stunt Double 4-6

Kano 5-5
Cybernetic 5-5
Commando 6-4
Cutthroat 4-6

Kenshi 6-4
Kenjutsu 6-4
Balanced 6-4
Possesed 5-5

Kitana 5-5
Mournful 5-5
Royal Storm 4-6
Assassin 6-4

Kotal Kahn 6-4
Blood God 6-4
War God5-5
Sun God 6-4

Kung Jin 5-5
Shaolin 5-5
Ancestral 6-4
Bojutsu 6-4

Kung Lao 4-6
Buzz Saw 5-5
Tempest 4-6
Hat Trick 5-5

Liu Kang 4-6
Dragon’s Fire 4-6
Flame Fist 4-6
Dualist 5-5

Mileena 4-6
Ethereal 3-7
Piercing 4-6
Ravenous 4-6

Quan Chi 6-4
Warlock 5-5
Summoner 6-4
Sorcerer 6-4

Raiden 5-5
Thunder God 5-5
Displacer 5-5
Master of Storms 7-3

Reptile 5-5
Noxious 4-6
Deceptive 6-4
Nimble 5-5

Scorpion 4-6
Ninjutsu 4-6
Hellfire 4-6
Inferno 5-5

Shinnok 4-6
Necromancer 6-4
Imposter4-6
Bone Shaper4-6

Sonya Blade 5-5
Special Forces ?
Covert Ops 6-4
Demolition ?

Sub-Zero 4-6
Cryomancer 4-6
Unbreakable 4-6
Grandmaster 4-6

Takeda 6-4
Ronin5-5
Shirai Ryu6-4
Lasher6-4

Jason ?
Slasher 4-6


Tanya 5-5
Kj 5-5
Pyromancer5-5
Dn5-5

Tremor 6-4
Crystal 6-4
Metallic 6-4
Aftershock 5-5

Predator 5-5
Laser 6-4
Warrior 6-4
Hunter 4-6

Triborg: 6-4
Cyrax 6-4
Sektor 5-5
Smoke 6-4

Alien: ?
Acidic 4-6
Broke Rekkas ?
The unused one ?

Leather Face: 5-5
Chainsaw: 6-4
Pretty lady 4-6
Butcher ??

BRC: 5-5
DM 6-4
Bartitsu 5-5
DB 6-4


Winning mus by character: 9
Losing mus by character:10
Even mus by character: 11

Winning mus by variation:26
Losing mus by variation:31
Even mus by variation:33
My counting may be of by 2-3.

In total.
Dualist is mid-high tier.
Around that B- to A- spot if your tier list goes "S, A+, A, A-, B+" etc. Probably B+ tier. Which is good, but could be better.
Did I forget about the buffs part? I'll post a thread on that :DOGE:REO

@Kickbykick @Bruno-NeoSpace
 
Last edited:
Derptile

Derptile

RIP Ex Smash
Well I'd say he loses to D'Vorah, Erron Black, Jax, Kano, and Goro(100% srs), also IDK about losing to Ermac 3-7.
 
Qhris

Qhris

Noob
Interesting thought: Aside from standard character buffs, how would you feel if stance switch characters could have an option to start out in the opposite stance from the character select screen? I'm not at all an expert on dualist, but if this option were available would any of these match ups change?
 
Kickbykick

Kickbykick

Noob
Nice post again. Am not sure bout Jax, Devorah SwarmQueen, Kano, Erron, Full Auto Jacqui, Tremor, Necromancer Shinnok, Flame Fist Liu Kang, Shaolin Kung Jin and Mournful Kitana.
Great List tho.

Hey @Damaja325 what do you think about mileena.:(
 
Last edited:
FOREVER EL1TE

FOREVER EL1TE

Noob
Derptile said:
Well I'd say he loses to D'Vorah, Erron Black, Jax, Kano, and Goro(100% srs), also IDK about losing to Ermac 3-7.
Click to expand...
I think Ermac wins 7-3, being a Ermac main. I played xaraka and another pro lk player named "street m6o" (He was @ summer jam. Good liu kang player.
And they both really struggle with the mu, Ermac's tools shut down liu kang really bad.
 
Saltea Moonspell

Saltea Moonspell

"Mind Over Matter" I dont mind, and X dont matter
Thanks for tagging me, though I am an really early dualist main so regarding the mu I cant say much. I will be playing a lot this month offline so I should have a small picture really soon so I will be back and discuss.
 
Phosferrax

Phosferrax

Original Liu Kang cop.
Don't know about dem Ermac or Kano numbers. Why do you have CT and Commando losing? And please explain 3-7 against Ermac.

I think people have forgotten how rough a '3-7' mu is...
 
FOREVER EL1TE

FOREVER EL1TE

Noob
Phosferrax said:
Don't know about dem Ermac or Kano numbers. Why do you have CT and Commando losing? And please explain 3-7 against Ermac.

I think people have forgotten how rough a '3-7' mu is...
Click to expand...
I believe lk beats kano in general but I think cybernetic is even. I play the mu a lot with @imblackjames and I don't feel that kano is a risk to Lk. Honestly, commando might be even to considering his command grab is good for armoring and gives him better oki. But his Parry doesn't make a difference in this mu because he has to guess the normal im doing and even then I can stop pressing buttons on a read. I believe his Parry just creates a mind game.
I believe Ermac beats lk 7-3 because Ermac has all the tools to stop liu kang.
Lk cant zone, can't dragon kick, out damaged, and gets out spaced. @xarakamaka can probably back me up on this that Ermac beats lk and IMO destroys him
 
FOREVER EL1TE

FOREVER EL1TE

Noob
PND_Ketchup said:
When you say Dualist needs buffs, what kind of changes are you hoping for Dualist specifically?
Click to expand...
Dualist still has bugs which no character should have.
•Orbs will explode in the corner for some maps because of the coding nrs put in. It's like the orbs hit an in visible wall and explodes on its own. Idk if I'm explaining it right, but because of this orbs because useless in some maps which harms dualist potential.
•Orbs can also create a frame gap when they explode. For example, if I'm doing f213 and the orb explodes between the F2(1), it creates a frame gap in the string which you can punish.
These are the bugs I noticed and I'm sure there are more. But for buffs:
•His healing to have a better use, as of now it heals like 0.30%? There's no point in using this move because of the risk, there's no reward and I think another player made a vid comparing kotals healing to dualist.
•His damage buff needs to stay on hit for at least level 1 and 2.
Kotal can do his mid combo and keep it on hit. However lk loses his automatically if he gets hit. A lot of characters keeps theirs on hit and lk should be the same.
•Orb recovery lessened by 5 to 10 frames.
•Damage buff recovery lessened by 10 frames
•Stance switch recovery lessened by 5 frames.
 
Last edited:
EMPEROR PRYCE

EMPEROR PRYCE

WAR SEASON "THE WEAK EXPOSED!"
FOREVER EL1TE said:
Dualist still has bugs which no character should have.
•Orbs will explode in the corner for some maps because of the coding nrs put in. It's like the orbs hit an in visible wall and explodes on its own. Idk if I'm explaining it right, but because of this orbs because useless in some maps which harms dualist potential.
•Orbs can also create a frame gap when they explode. For example, if I'm doing f213 and the orb explodes between the F2(1), it creates a frame gap in the string which you can punish.
These are the bugs I noticed and I'm sure there are more. But for buffs:
•His healing to have a better use, as of now it heals like 0.30%? There's no point in using this move because of the risk, there's no reward and I think another player made a vid comparing kotals healing to dualist.
•His damage buff needs to stay on hit for at least level 1 and 2.
Kotal can do his mid combo and keep it on hit. However lk loses his automatically if he gets hit. A lot of characters keeps theirs on hit and lk should be the same.
•Orb recovery by 5 to 10 frames.
•Damage buff recovery lessened by 10 frames
•Stance switch recovery lessened by 5 frames.
Click to expand...

I agree with everything here dude.

Except the stance switch speed up. Can't he already frame trap and combo from stance switch??
 
FOREVER EL1TE

FOREVER EL1TE

Noob
EMPEROR PRYCE said:
I agree with everything here dude.

Except the stance switch speed up. Can't he already frame trap and combo from stance switch??
Click to expand...
He was able to do both those things pre patch, except pre patch most SS combos were 1-3 frame links. Now most combos are 3-5 frame links (2-frame links are also common) but his pressure has dropped. Since his best string dropped from +7 to +4. This SS buff is just a complimentary one, it's not really needed lol
 
Phosferrax

Phosferrax

Original Liu Kang cop.
FOREVER EL1TE said:
I believe lk beats kano in general but I think cybernetic is even. I play the mu a lot with @imblackjames and I don't feel that kano is a risk to Lk. Honestly, commando might be even to considering his command grab is good for armoring and gives him better oki. But his Parry doesn't make a difference in this mu because he has to guess the normal im doing and even then I can stop pressing buttons on a read. I believe his Parry just creates a mind game.
I believe Ermac beats lk 7-3 because Ermac has all the tools to stop liu kang.
Lk cant zone, can't dragon kick, out damaged, and gets out spaced. @xarakamaka can probably back me up on this that Ermac beats lk and IMO destroys him
Click to expand...
I think you need to level up the Kano you play against then. Kano can really outspace Liu Kang with s2, f4, b1 and d4 all with more range and advancing, which Kang doesn't really have. Low fireballs suck so he can just air ball over them, or just get the zoning advantage and not trade with them because his knives recover so fast. He's also got great options out of the pressure.

Ermac has soul ball and big damage, and a punishable 6f d1. That is not enough to warrant a 3-7. His means of opening people up are completely punishable and he might have better range, but Kang has a much better walk and run speed to compensate. Soul ball doesn't mean he can't through a fb, he just can't throw them like an idiot. Kang has a great d2 that stops Ermacs air game which is very important as well.
 
L

LASD

Noob
FOREVER EL1TE said:
I believe lk beats kano in general but I think cybernetic is even. I play the mu a lot with @imblackjames and I don't feel that kano is a risk to Lk. Honestly, commando might be even to considering his command grab is good for armoring and gives him better oki. But his Parry doesn't make a difference in this mu because he has to guess the normal im doing and even then I can stop pressing buttons on a read. I believe his Parry just creates a mind game.
I believe Ermac beats lk 7-3 because Ermac has all the tools to stop liu kang.
Lk cant zone, can't dragon kick, out damaged, and gets out spaced. @xarakamaka can probably back me up on this that Ermac beats lk and IMO destroys him
Click to expand...
Idk how much my opinion counts on this but being both a co-main of Ermac and Liu, I can safely say Ermac is Liu's worst MU. Whenever someone tries mirror matching me with Liu, I just switch to Ermac and its not even close. Liu has to respect the soul ball so the only chance he gets in is mb fk. If ermac player reads this its a 36% + meterless combo. That's really a bad mu for Liu, so i gotta agree with Elite. I thought I was the only person who thought this was such a bad mu for 6man
 
You must log in or register to reply here.