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Five Buffs Jade Needs

GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
  • BF1 MB has no gap on block
  • 43-BF1 MB works on everyone properly
  • Staff normals don't randomly whiff inside their own hitbox
  • D1 has better range and 2 more frames of advantage on hit (up from 9)
  • D4 doesn't push back as far so that it actually works as a turn taker
 
Things I wish for......
BF1 MB hits mid
Pole vault MB that doesn't cause Jade to fly over the opponent when you do it to late.
Deadly assassin B2124 doesn't have such a crazy gap that people poke you right out of it.(really wish she had these combos all the time)
Faster Parry that you can hold
Better range on F343
More fair recovery on strange combos like B12 and F41
Can we get a MB edenian spark? Or what about the staff spin?
 

MagicMan357

"130 ms is more legit than Labbing" - TYM
  • s1 and s12 should have better frames
  • make 214 a true launcher
  • give her an amp staff spin for juggles
  • Do something with vanishing winds amp version, it makes no sense
  • Give deadly assassin an actual point to use it
 
I'd change the Nitro kick krushing blow requirement. Have it activate after a 7 or 8 hit combo. I tested it with easy crushing blow and I could get 400+ damage.
 

THTB

RIP Arez & Booya
I always see the no gap in MB glaive in buff talks, but no one ever acknowledges it's +6 in your face.

b1, b12,f2 safe. f2 speed up slightly. Kounter/Punish KB somewhere. 43 xx MB glaive working on everyone.

After that, don't even have to touch her for the rest of the game's lifespan.
 

GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
I always see the no gap in MB glaive in buff talks, but no one ever acknowledges it's +6 in your face.

b1, b12,f2 safe. f2 speed up slightly. Kounter/Punish KB somewhere. 43 xx MB glaive working on everyone.

After that, don't even have to touch her for the rest of the game's lifespan.
Doesn't matter that it's +6 when you get ducked and punished on reaction for using it.

I like your changes, though.
 

THTB

RIP Arez & Booya
Doesn't matter that it's +6 when you get ducked and punished on reaction for using it.
Yeah, but if there's no gap and it's gonna still leave her point blank, that's gonna be gone. Cage doesn't even get that kinda privilege for plus frame fireballs.

If I'm going to change them, I'd say up the damage on each hit. EX glaive is useful midscreen for maintaining pressure. If it did more damage, I don't think anything else would need to change.
 

GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
Yeah, but if there's no gap and it's gonna still leave her point blank, that's gonna be gone. Cage doesn't even get that kinda privilege for plus frame fireballs.

If I'm going to change them, I'd say up the damage on each hit. EX glaive is useful midscreen for maintaining pressure. If it did more damage, I don't think anything else would need to change.
Fair point, though the useful midscreen, I wouldn't say that. Starting up a glaive is literally how you eat a krushing blow from any character worth playing in a tournament, for more damage in a single hit than you have done so far all match lol.
Or get teleported on, or get slidededed by ScrubZero etc
Glaive needs to be much more fearsome for it to be anything but an occasional check. I'd nominate it for one of the worst projectiles in the game.

Jade has serious issues rooted in the fact that all her normals are basically papersheets you try to papercut people with and they come at you with industrial chainsaws.
 

THTB

RIP Arez & Booya
Fair point, though the useful midscreen, I wouldn't say that. Starting up a glaive is literally how you eat a krushing blow from any character worth playing in a tournament, for more damage in a single hit than you have done so far all match lol.
Or get teleported on, or get slidededed by ScrubZero etc
Glaive needs to be much more fearsome for it to be anything but an occasional check. I'd nominate it for one of the worst projectiles in the game.

Jade has serious issues rooted in the fact that all her normals are basically papersheets you try to papercut people with and they come at you with industrial chainsaws.
EX glaive on hit is what I'm referring to. It's not a good option outside of that, but after confirming b343 midscreen to it, that's pressure you can potentially loop back into another time with a strike-throw mixup.
 

Crimea

Noob
  • f41 safe on block (It's just a knockdown, not a mixup and the string already has a gap, doesn't need it to be so negative on block)
  • new krushing blow on b12 if the first hit whiffs (another source of damage is a plus for Jade. And it's a useless string right now)
  • 124 krushing blow if you punishing (so at least one solid punish in a match)
  • 9f Parry (down from 12f)
 
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GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
EX glaive on hit is what I'm referring to. It's not a good option outside of that, but after confirming b343 midscreen to it, that's pressure you can potentially loop back into another time with a strike-throw mixup.
It's reactable is the problem. During the very first tournament where Waz and KP took Emerald for a spin literally everyone, literally always ducked and d2'd b3-exglaive shenanigans on reaction before the second glaive came out.
 

Espio

Back To Basics
Lead Moderator
There's a couple things I would like to see primarily a total retool/redesign of her crushing blows. This is part of why her damage is so suspect.

Shadow kick crushing blow should be: land three amplified shadow kicks similarly to Sub-Zero's. As it stands now, you have to rely on tagging your opponent with shadow kicks back to back. Make it do 30% like other similar crushing blows.

Her throw crushing blow, just let it do 32% like other grab crushing blows without the ability to combo. As a Baraka main, I NEVER have to concern myself with anyone escaping my throw damage on crushing blow and I can get it on TWO throws and it's unbreakable damage. I don't have to go hopefully they don't breakaway out of this. This is the same thing with Skarlet as well who has two crushing blows on throws plus unbreakable damage with it so it's not a character play style issue cause Baraka and Skarlet play very differently yet have the concept applied identically. Hurts her damage and comeback factor which she already suffers from as is.

1,2,4 crushing blow should be off of a punish so it's an actual viable crushing blow and isn't reliant on the opponent's sloth. That would buff the damage too.

Back 3,4,3 should do about 11% in line with other three hit strings and I'd like to see Back 3,4,3 ex glaive to do about 23% if they don't wanna buff her combo ability/damage. I can work with 23% into pressure as that reduces the margin of error. You can only mess up four times instead of six which is a huge difference.


A MB version of staff spin would be great. Make it -7 with pushback for a bar. I think I'd feel more comfortable with that than gapless ex glaive plus frames. She'd be resetting the neutral for a bar with this and it wouldn't lead to anything crazy. They could even make it do barely any additional chip damage on the last hit and I'd be fine with that.

I don't think making forward 2 or Back 1,2 safe is really beneficial because the problems with these strings go far beyond mere safety, they are easily dealt with on reaction with flawless block or in some cases jab normals and pokes reliably blow them up. That won't fix her issues.
 

MagicMan357

"130 ms is more legit than Labbing" - TYM
Are we still downplaying jade as a whole? I will admit her 3rd variation is dogshit.
 

haketh

Noob
Yeah theirs zero reason for F41 to be unsafe, I use F4 pretty generously on D4 happy players but theirs literally no point to F41 as is. Like if it was -6 with pushback I’d be content.
 

GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
She's mid to low-mid at best, tbh.
In some's dreams. I don't think Raiden is worse but I can accept that someone is, maybe him.
But I can't see who else could be worse than Jade right now. Everybody can combo for some damage, everyone has a functional string into a functional launcher with some tools or other.
 

GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
There's a couple things I would like to see primarily a total retool/redesign of her crushing blows. This is part of why her damage is so suspect.

Shadow kick crushing blow should be: land three amplified shadow kicks similarly to Sub-Zero's. As it stands now, you have to rely on tagging your opponent with shadow kicks back to back. Make it do 30% like other similar crushing blows.

Her throw crushing blow, just let it do 32% like other grab crushing blows without the ability to combo. As a Baraka main, I NEVER have to concern myself with anyone escaping my throw damage on crushing blow and I can get it on TWO throws and it's unbreakable damage. I don't have to go hopefully they don't breakaway out of this. This is the same thing with Skarlet as well who has two crushing blows on throws plus unbreakable damage with it so it's not a character play style issue cause Baraka and Skarlet play very differently yet have the concept applied identically. Hurts her damage and comeback factor which she already suffers from as is.

1,2,4 crushing blow should be off of a punish so it's an actual viable crushing blow and isn't reliant on the opponent's sloth. That would buff the damage too.

Back 3,4,3 should do about 11% in line with other three hit strings and I'd like to see Back 3,4,3 ex glaive to do about 23% if they don't wanna buff her combo ability/damage. I can work with 23% into pressure as that reduces the margin of error. You can only mess up four times instead of six which is a huge difference.


A MB version of staff spin would be great. Make it -7 with pushback for a bar. I think I'd feel more comfortable with that than gapless ex glaive plus frames. She'd be resetting the neutral for a bar with this and it wouldn't lead to anything crazy. They could even make it do barely any additional chip damage on the last hit and I'd be fine with that.

I don't think making forward 2 or Back 1,2 safe is really beneficial because the problems with these strings go far beyond mere safety, they are easily dealt with on reaction with flawless block or in some cases jab normals and pokes reliably blow them up. That won't fix her issues.
Well yes, her Krushing Blows deal about one third of what anyone else's do. You get hit with Kitana's, that's 30%, for example.

Shadow kick: Why should it be three when it's two right now?
Amp Butterfly: 1 bar for pushback? What? lmao

I agree with the rest. MB Butterfly should be -13 and launch, meterless should have pushback on block so that it's safe and be -5 or so. This single change alone would make Jade an overall playable character.
 

Arqwart

Resident "Subhuman Piece of Trash" Edenian Player
Well yes, her Krushing Blows deal about one third of what anyone else's do. You get hit with Kitana's, that's 30%, for example.

Shadow kick: Why should it be three when it's two right now?
Amp Butterfly: 1 bar for pushback? What? lmao

I agree with the rest. MB Butterfly should be -13 and launch, meterless should have pushback on block so that it's safe and be -5 or so. This single change alone would make Jade an overall playable character.
For the shadow kick KB, I believe Espio was saying to just land 3 enhanced kicks in general throughout the match (akin to Zero's slide KB) instead of its current 2 in a row.

As for the amp'd Butterfly, I really just do not see them ever making it a launcher. They've really put Jade in a box where they just do NOT want her to have multi-string combos except in rare occasions. I'd be fine with Butterfly having an amp that shoves back purely so it's a usable tool aside from corner combos.

Overall, I think Jade just needs a redo on multiple base tools to allow her to have more options. As it is, I feel her #1 key weakness is that she's got ~5 universal tools that carry her entire kit on their shoulders (B3 string, D2, D4, grabs, and Glow). Going by the theme of the thread of 5 changes, here are mine:

  1. Launcher KBs no longer launch. They now deal more upfront damage (30%-35%) and knock away with high plus frames for Jade to position as she wishes. Jade has little to do after the launches as it is on TOP of her having no worthwhile launcher to force breakaways beforehand. 99% of the time that I land a launcher KB, it results in an immediate breakaway resulting in the same damage as generic one-bar combos of other characters.
  2. F41 is now safe 100% safe. Be it via pushback or lowered block frames. Dont care which, though I'd prefer knockback.
  3. 43 amp'd razor-rang is now universal across all hitbox types.
  4. B12 is now safe on block at further distances (pokeable punish if next to them cause we cant be having a long-range overhead super safe). Maybe -9 or -10?
  5. B12 now has a punish KB for 25%-30% damage. It's odd to me that the spacing / poke character doesnt have a punish KB.
Boom. Now she gets two more strings she can utilize regularly, more explosive KBs, an additional burst KB, and an additional universal combo starter at midscreen. These changes help Jade across the board, granting additional power to every single variation. Her overall gameplan doesnt truly change, but she will be able to utilize more options as the situation calls for instead of relying on her ~5 tools (+whatever she's got in her variation).
 

Vhozite

Jade Worshipper
I don't think we needed another thread about buffing Jade.

To answer the question, I'd really like them to look at her KB's.

Why is she (afaik) the only character who's throw KB launches instead of just giving the straight 32%?

Shadowkick KB is weird, since the condition (2 hits in a row) is usually reserved for overheads, but its a combo ender. Should be changed to punish or 3 amps like Sub slide.

I'd also like to see f41 safe and b12 either safe or get a KB if only the second hit connects.