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Clash system alternatives

Hanzer0

Wanna order chinese later?
This thread is for discussing and pitching alternatives to the current clash mechanic.
Does anyone prefer breakers to clash? essentially the same thing without the wagering (which doesn't seem to add depth like intended from my point of view).

Since there is no pushback on block i came up with this idea:
for 1 bar of meter, on block you could push your attacker away.
This would stop their offense and reset you both to neutral at mid distance away.
This clash option would still give you defensive options without relying on always having meter to break.
Maybe certain characters could have different clash results, i.e. grundy has a short pushback but slight advantage to set up throws as a reversal for offense heavy characters while someone like green arrow would push them back farther but doesn't get the frame advantage.

Post your thoughts and your ideas of how to change the current clash system.
 

Invincibeast

Stay Free
I feel like the Wager system could work out fine, although I dont know all the details about it. However, in the gameplay videos available it seems far to easy to pull out the wager, making it happen too frequently in a match.
I personally loved the breakers in MK9, I feel like NRS hit that right on the money and wouldn't mind seeing that again. If the Wager system only came out as often as breakers do in MK9 it could be a viable/game changing mechanic.
 

Rathalos

Play Monster Hunter!
Paying meter for pushblock.........
Pushblock would probably fuck with the pacing of the game, but if it was limited by meter, it could work.
I don't see them doing that though.
Would rather have something like an Alpha counter.
 
Doesn't marvel, and skullgirls have pushblock though? It's perfectly fine in those games, I think it would be good to add in this game as well.
 

Rathalos

Play Monster Hunter!
Doesn't marvel, and skullgirls have pushblock though? It's perfectly fine in those games, I think it would be good to add in this game as well.
Ya but those are way different types of games. You have way more mobility in those games so pushblock isn't really that big of a deal.
This game is much more inline with MK and SF where spacing and footsies are super important.

At least I think, who knows how the final game will be.
 

Hanzer0

Wanna order chinese later?
Ya but those are way different types of games. You have way more mobility in those games so pushblock isn't really that big of a deal.
This game is much more inline with MK and SF where spacing and footsies are super important.

At least I think, who knows how the final game will be.
This is what i'm thinking as well. Chip damage is also a very important factor. If it's in, i think the pushback for meter would work well. If not, we'll probably be seeing a lot of mixups, where a breaker mechanic might work better.
 

shaowebb

Get your guns on. Sheriff is back.
I'm going for Alpha counters in the corner where a defending player can activate a stage transition by blowing meter. I'd blow more than 2 bars though. Maybe 3 or 4 since its so powerful a tool. This way its not always on deck in corner situations. If they time the action right they can counter a move into the transition to get the damage, the breathing down time during the cinematic (unless they choose to skip it) and they get the spacing perks that transitions normally yield. Those things just strike me as a better defensive than offensive tool.

In addition I would like to add for 2 bars just guards like in Soul Calibur. Not a pushblock but if you time an input at the exact moment someone hits you it should cut your blockstun recovery in half on that move and induce a slight bit more recovery for the move onto your opponent. The window is small and it doesn't force them off you so if you do this you HAVE to convert it into something which under pressure (as we know from MK) could easily be dropped or missed. This should only work on block though. This is not a breaker for 2 bars. You get combo-ed your still getting bodied. This is just a tool to help handle block strings.

Other alternatives to clashes as a comeback mechanic is honestly to not have comeback mechanics. I like KoF a lot and I wouldn't mind if dash throughs or rolls were incorporated universally to give folks options to get out of tight spots and earn it for themself without boosts or combo snuffers. I like that more than comeback gimmicks that break combos or net huge boosts to players honestly. Still I understand that comeback tools like those aren't necessarily bad or cheap I just like KoF is all I'm saying. If it helps draw casuals into fighters to have such tools then power to them. I'll figure out how to use that stuff to my advantage all the same :)
 

THTB

Arez | Booya | Riu48 - Rest Easy, Friends
The clash can work...just shortened it. After the burst, have the characters immediately charge at each other, and give like a 60-75 frame window to input a wager.
 

shaowebb

Get your guns on. Sheriff is back.
Yeah the cinematic is its worst aspect really. Without that if you could just input it at the meter level you wanted during the input it'd be better since it'd be more like a breaker with risk. The thing I feel though is that with it tied to the same meter that everything else uses for offense that it deters people from ever doing anything else unless it would kill. We saw this in MK9 and even though there is argument that there were other reasons for it we also saw it in Tatsunoko vs Capcom and it had some really great hypers that could extend combos as well as do unscaled damage.

I think any breaker system has to be put on a seperate meter that fills in tandem to super meter or based on something else otherwise the greatest tool in any game is to simply be able to end an opponents combo whenever you want. Folks will and have proven before they'll save meter at all cost to have that option and that relegates hypers to next to never occurring alongside of most ex- moves.
 

THTB

Arez | Booya | Riu48 - Rest Easy, Friends
Separate breaker system really is blah. The way it functions in MK9 is probably the best incarnation of a breaker system I've ever seen. Things like a breaker should never be made in a way that allows a player to escape a combo without serious repercussions in other areas. In MK9, you lose the opportunity to use half of your moveset more than once in a row. In BB, various attributes for your character become weaker.

If you're going to make a breaker system with separate meter for it, the damage might as well be high, because a bad break means you just lost the round.
 

Rathalos

Play Monster Hunter!
If they make it share the same meter and they did and will probably keep it that way.
They really need to make meter burning, bounce cancels, and super attacks actually worth using, and not just sprinkling armor on everything.

I'd prefer damage to be heavily meter dependent, like 30% meterless is the norm, and like 50-70% depending on how much meter you throw at the combo. Quan chi being the best example, just toned down and less stupid.
 

xSMoKEx

Coward Character User
Sounds like a good idea to play with for MK10 to me.
That's how P4A runs. It's alright but hard to pull off in a game like MK. I like the tradeoff of the current meter system. You can spend it to inflict more damage or take less damage, that would imo ruin the balance of an MK game if it's anything like MK9.