Buff thread only for Captain Cold

[Tanno]

Just in case the patch hits, it would be good for ours bad boy to change a bit his gameplay, so that he can be more competitive and deadly against the other characters. Now he's weak and is already screaming for buffs before he can save his icy ass from the other fellas. Here are some suggestions to make him good to go. I only hope that his opponents stop disrespecting him and start calling him MISTER Snart.

Combo strings:
1) New and added strings that start with LOW. I would suggest a low kick followed with the other same attacks from F233 and B232. This way they would be truly 50/50, which is something that CC lacks.
2) 12 (Criminal Code): More Cancel frames (from 23 to 30). This will fix its connection with the special attacks.
3) 21 (Icy Heart): Change the second attack into a low kick (Roundhouse kick) or a low punch.
4) 213 (Freeze): Change the second attack into a low kick (Roundhouse kick) or a low punch, AND the third attack into a back kick.

Special Moves:
1) Fix the Wall and MB Wall to hit confirm all the projectiles (Cyborg's bots, Ivy's pet's saliva, etc). Don't know how will it work against Hyenas, but we'll see. This way they will be prevented and protect CC. Additional fix: Make hurtboxes on those summoning attacks, such as Cyborg's bots, Ivy's pet's saliva, etc.
2) Fix the Wall to stop triggering the Clash since it's a kind of projectile one.
3) Make only the upper side of Wall's hitbox a bit taller, since it's a Wall that prevents both ground and aerial attacks.
4) DB2 (Wall): Less Active frames (from 37 to 30). Just make it similar to UB Sub's Parry.
5) MB DB3 (MB Big Freeze): Less active frames (Now it reads N/A, but I feel that it's around 15 or so). Make it back to 7, meaning the same like the Big Freeze. Get rid of the lame swing.
6) DF3 (Frost Field): Add new distances for DF3, similar to DF2 (Death-Cicle). B for close and U for far.

Character Powers:
F4 (Glacier Grenade): Less Start Up frames (from 62 to 50). Get rid of the lame pistolero shit. Additional fix: Add new distances for F4, similar to DF2 (Death-Cicle). D for close and U for far.

Charging Gun:
Make the charging from holding it into just tapping it or just into auto-charge. Just tapping it will fully charge one bar.

The rest are good and nice.

What do you guys say about this? Just say yours suggestions and reason them politely.

 

[Zionix]

Just in case the patch hits, it would be good for ours bad boy to change a bit his gameplay, so that he can be more competitive and deadly against the other characters. Now he's weak and is already screaming for buffs before he can save his icy ass from the other fellas. Here are some suggestions to make him good to go. I only hope that his opponents stop disrespecting him and start calling him MISTER Snart.

Combo strings:
1) New and added strings that start with LOW. I would suggest a low kick followed with the other same attacks from F233 and B232. This way they would be truly 50/50, which is something that CC lacks.
2) 12 (Criminal Code): More Cancel frames (from 23 to 30). This will fix its connection with the special attacks.
3) 21 (Icy Heart): Change the second attack into a low kick (Roundhouse kick) or a low punch.
4) 213 (Freeze): Change the second attack into a low kick (Roundhouse kick) or a low punch, AND the third attack into a back kick.

Special Moves:
1) Fix the Wall and MB Wall to hit confirm all the projectiles (Cyborg's bots, Ivy's pet's saliva, etc). Don't know how will it work against Hyenas, but we'll see. This way they will be prevented and protect CC. Additional fix: Make hurtboxes on those summoning attacks, such as Cyborg's bots, Ivy's pet's saliva, etc.
2) Fix the Wall to stop triggering the Clash since it's a kind of projectile one.
3) Make only the upper side of Wall's hitbox a bit taller, since it's a Wall that prevents both ground and aerial attacks.
4) DB2 (Wall): Less Active frames (from 37 to 30). Just make it similar to UB Sub's Parry.
5) MB DB3 (MB Big Freeze): Less active frames (Now it reads N/A, but I feel that it's around 15 or so). Make it back to 7, meaning the same like the Big Freeze. Get rid of the lame swing.
6) DF3 (Frost Field): Add new distances for DF3, similar to DF2 (Death-Cicle). B for close and U for far.

Character Powers:
F4 (Glacier Grenade): Less Start Up frames (from 62 to 50). Get rid of the lame pistolero shit. Additional fix: Add new distances for F4, similar to DF2 (Death-Cicle). D for close and U for far.

Charging Gun:
Make the charging from holding it into just tapping it or just into auto-charge. Just tapping it will fully charge one bar.

The rest are good and nice.

What do you guys say about this? Just say yours suggestions and reason them politely.

Even if captain cold doesn't feel complete in his toolkit, I'd much rather they brought the top down than brought the bottom up.

 

[Tanno]

Even if captain cold doesn't feel complete in his toolkit, I'd much rather they brought the top down than brought the bottom up.

I would love to know the other fighters, but I'll leave them to the others to decide what they want to do with them. I only know about CC, since I labbed him this far and his problems are greatly noticeable. He's already bottom, but with some buffs I hope that he will be somewhere in the middle.

 

[G11OST]

Even if captain cold doesn't feel complete in his toolkit, I'd much rather they brought the top down than brought the bottom up.

I strongly disagree, I like empowering rather than handicapping

I think nerfs should be handled very carefuly or we can end up with crippled characters

 

[RiBBz22]

The buffs in this thread are pretty ridiculous, but let's be real Captain Cold does need help. When you really look at his design and gameplan, he inherently struggles in this game because a huge amount of characters will be able to check nearly every special move he has just by putting moves on the screen that occupy horizontal space. At the same time, I understand that if you aren't careful with the buffs, a small change could give him something pretty stupid due to all the setups he has involving hard to block stuff.

What I would like to see:

-Faster trait charge, I would suggest that the trait charges at least 25% faster to the point where bar 2 fills up as fast as bar 1 does today.
-Faster projectile startup (cold blast and possibly death-cicle)
-B2 hit state changed to mid
-Stand 1 changed to 7 frame startup
-Increased forward walk speed
-MB cold blast 2nd shot is slowed down slightly so that the two projectiles occupy more space.

 

[M.D.]

DF3 could use some actual thought.
In the corner you can't set it up as it gets set up offscreen which is useless. Either make it snap to corner or add distances, that is a good idea.

Wall definitively needs to get fixed to be completely projectile absorb from start to end and during mb.

And most importantly:

MAKE HIS AIR PLATFORM A NORMAL MOVE WITHOUT GEAR!!!!!!

 

[JDF9799]

The buffs in this thread are pretty ridiculous, but let's be real Captain Cold does need help. When you really look at his design and gameplan, he inherently struggles in this game because a huge amount of characters will be able to check nearly every special move he has just by putting moves on the screen that occupy horizontal space. At the same time, I understand that if you aren't careful with the buffs, a small change could give him something pretty stupid due to all the setups he has involving hard to block stuff.

What I would like to see:

-Faster trait charge, I would suggest that the trait charges at least 25% faster to the point where bar 2 fills up as fast as bar 1.
-Faster projectile startup
-B2 hit state changed to mid
-Stand 1 changed to 7 frame startup
-Increased forward walk speed
-MB cold blast 2nd shot is slowed down slightly so that the two projectiles occupy more space.

I agree. I'd also maybe like to see his 1, 2 string (overhead) combo with his 3 bar trait. I feel like level 3 is lacking a bit. Level 2 seems to be a lot better, and also saving trait to boost special moves is more beneficial. Taking the time to get three bars of trait in order to get overhead starter seems reasonable.

 

[Tanno]

The buffs in this thread are pretty ridiculous, but let's be real Captain Cold does need help. When you really look at his design and gameplan, he inherently struggles in this game because a huge amount of characters will be able to check nearly every special move he has just by putting moves on the screen that occupy horizontal space. At the same time, I understand that if you aren't careful with the buffs, a small change could give him something pretty stupid due to all the setups he has involving hard to block stuff.

What I would like to see:

-Faster trait charge, I would suggest that the trait charges at least 25% faster to the point where bar 2 fills up as fast as bar 1.
-Faster projectile startup
-B2 hit state changed to mid
-Stand 1 changed to 7 frame startup
-Increased forward walk speed
-MB cold blast 2nd shot is slowed down slightly so that the two projectiles occupy more space.

Yours suggestions are good. Honeybee suggested that the Cold Blast has to freeze the character, similar to Sub's Iceball.

However, bear in mind the following and my reasons of those buffs.

Mine suggestions are not that ridiculous. He lacks the 50/50, and all of his special moves (except of Death-Cicle) hit only in the middle. All of the characters I faced learned him and only block low, because they feel safe this way. All of his special moves are YOLO and can be punished.

Forgot to add that he has nothing that starts with OH, except of his F3, which makes it hard to punish the low blocking opponents.

I felt that CC is a defensive zoning character. He lacks the necessary tools to defend himself from the CQC chars. I found so far 2 techs against the CQC chars, but not those of the zoners. I suggested the OP buffs, because this way he would be a threat against them and start learning to respect him.

:/

 

[RiBBz22]

I agree. I'd also maybe like to see his 1, 2 string (overhead) combo with his 3 bar trait. I feel like level 3 is lacking a bit. Level 2 seems to be a lot better, and also saving trait to boost special moves is more beneficial. Taking the time to get three bars of trait in order to get overhead starter seems reasonable.

Level 2 definitely leads to all of his real dirt. And right now he needs that bullshit to squeeze out wins against opponents with better tools than him. I've never used lvl 3 in a real match, but I am really not playing Cold anymore except for funsies at this point until something happens with him.

 

[RiBBz22]

Yours suggestions are good. Honeybee suggested that the Cold Blast has to freeze the character, similar to Sub's Iceball.

However, bear in mind the following and my reasons of those buffs.

Mine suggestions are not that ridiculous. He lacks the 50/50, and all of his special moves (except of Death-Cicle) hit only in the middle. All of the characters I faced learned him and only block low, because they feel safe this way. All of his special moves are YOLO and can be punished.

Forgot to add that he has nothing that starts with OH, except of his F3, which makes it hard to punish the low blocking opponents.

I felt that CC is a defensive zoning character. He lacks the necessary tools to defend himself from the CQC chars. I found so far 2 techs against the CQC chars, but not those of the zoners. I suggested the OP buffs, because this way he would be a threat against them and start learning to respect him.

:/

Cold Blast freezing would honestly be broken as fuck. I dunno even know about the MB version doing that TBH. I think smaller buffs are the way to start with Cold because he could be insane if you give him too much IMO. But that is the flaw in his design...fundamentally he has poor tools, but in terms of bullshit he has a lot of it...however, you can't use any of it against half the cast because they shut literally all of those tools down.

 

[RiBBz22]

DF3 could use some actual thought.
In the corner you can't set it up as it gets set up offscreen which is useless. Either make it snap to corner or add distances, that is a good idea.

Wall definitively needs to get fixed to be completely projectile absorb from start to end and during mb.

And most importantly:

MAKE HIS AIR PLATFORM A NORMAL MOVE WITHOUT GEAR!!!!!!

Actually I meant to write that into my change suggestions. DF3 right now is a horrible special with not much practical use. Buff it or remove it for something else (upward cold blast?)

 

[RiBBz22]

Yours suggestions are good. Honeybee suggested that the Cold Blast has to freeze the character, similar to Sub's Iceball.

However, bear in mind the following and my reasons of those buffs.

Mine suggestions are not that ridiculous. He lacks the 50/50, and all of his special moves (except of Death-Cicle) hit only in the middle. All of the characters I faced learned him and only block low, because they feel safe this way. All of his special moves are YOLO and can be punished.

Forgot to add that he has nothing that starts with OH, except of his F3, which makes it hard to punish the low blocking opponents.

I felt that CC is a defensive zoning character. He lacks the necessary tools to defend himself from the CQC chars. I found so far 2 techs against the CQC chars, but not those of the zoners. I suggested the OP buffs, because this way he would be a threat against them and start learning to respect him.

:/

People blocking low non-stop are subject to getting thrown a ton by Cold. His staggers into throw are pretty good overall, so you need to make your opponent respect that first.

Cold is actually pretty good against rushdown characters. He is able to get cold blast and icicles on the screen and pester people trying to jump at him with D2.

 

[DubiousShenron]

Just in case the patch hits, it would be good for ours bad boy to change a bit his gameplay, so that he can be more competitive and deadly against the other characters. Now he's weak and is already screaming for buffs before he can save his icy ass from the other fellas. Here are some suggestions to make him good to go. I only hope that his opponents stop disrespecting him and start calling him MISTER Snart.

Combo strings:
1) New and added strings that start with LOW. I would suggest a low kick followed with the other same attacks from F233 and B232. This way they would be truly 50/50, which is something that CC lacks.
2) 12 (Criminal Code): More Cancel frames (from 23 to 30). This will fix its connection with the special attacks.
3) 21 (Icy Heart): Change the second attack into a low kick (Roundhouse kick) or a low punch.
4) 213 (Freeze): Change the second attack into a low kick (Roundhouse kick) or a low punch, AND the third attack into a back kick.

Special Moves:
1) Fix the Wall and MB Wall to hit confirm all the projectiles (Cyborg's bots, Ivy's pet's saliva, etc). Don't know how will it work against Hyenas, but we'll see. This way they will be prevented and protect CC. Additional fix: Make hurtboxes on those summoning attacks, such as Cyborg's bots, Ivy's pet's saliva, etc.
2) Fix the Wall to stop triggering the Clash since it's a kind of projectile one.
3) Make only the upper side of Wall's hitbox a bit taller, since it's a Wall that prevents both ground and aerial attacks.
4) DB2 (Wall): Less Active frames (from 37 to 30). Just make it similar to UB Sub's Parry.
5) MB DB3 (MB Big Freeze): Less active frames (Now it reads N/A, but I feel that it's around 15 or so). Make it back to 7, meaning the same like the Big Freeze. Get rid of the lame swing.
6) DF3 (Frost Field): Add new distances for DF3, similar to DF2 (Death-Cicle). B for close and U for far.

Character Powers:
F4 (Glacier Grenade): Less Start Up frames (from 62 to 50). Get rid of the lame pistolero shit. Additional fix: Add new distances for F4, similar to DF2 (Death-Cicle). D for close and U for far.

Charging Gun:
Make the charging from holding it into just tapping it or just into auto-charge. Just tapping it will fully charge one bar.

The rest are good and nice.

What do you guys say about this? Just say yours suggestions and reason them politely.

Lul.

 

[KingHippo]

I think a few small changes will do a lot of good to create this sort of defensive tank with explosive offense locked behind trait:

-B232 goes from high, high, high to mid, mid, high (gives cold a reasonable mid that he can use off a jump in and for punishes. Last hit can stay high because of the frame advantage)
-Frost Field now slows the opponent while they are in its area of effect (I can't remember if it does this now, but it should, seeing as how it's like a mini cold grenade field. Slowing down a melee character, even for a second, can be really good)
-Frosted Tips now does a damage reduction in addition to DOT damage to opponent (Gives FT more general use, but most importantly, gives him the edge to win zoning wars by out-damaging other projectiles with his own)

I think those are good enough to accentuate his strengths to tough out some of his weaknesses. He's then be able to Tip up and win projectile wars by attrition and go for riskier things like trait charge without fear of a huge loss of life

 

[Dankster Morgan]

Even if captain cold doesn't feel complete in his toolkit, I'd much rather they brought the top down than brought the bottom up.

I used to think this, but then Tarkatan Alien, Cyber Sub-Zero, and Kotal Kahn happened.

 

[M.D.]

I used to think this, but then Tarkatan Alien, Cyber Sub-Zero, and Kotal Kahn happened.

Which means they got nerfed so they can be 10-0ed by grandmaster subzero.

 

[Dankster Morgan]

Which means they got nerfed so they can be 10-0ed by grandmaster subzero.

Aaaand he's back

 

[T-box88]

Yours suggestions are good. Honeybee suggested that the Cold Blast has to freeze the character, similar to Sub's Iceball.

However, bear in mind the following and my reasons of those buffs.

Mine suggestions are not that ridiculous. He lacks the 50/50, and all of his special moves (except of Death-Cicle) hit only in the middle. All of the characters I faced learned him and only block low, because they feel safe this way. All of his special moves are YOLO and can be punished.

Forgot to add that he has nothing that starts with OH, except of his F3, which makes it hard to punish the low blocking opponents.

I felt that CC is a defensive zoning character. He lacks the necessary tools to defend himself from the CQC chars. I found so far 2 techs against the CQC chars, but not those of the zoners. I suggested the OP buffs, because this way he would be a threat against them and start learning to respect him.

:/

Dont need a 50/50 to be good. Black atom, aquaman super man and batman all dont have true 50/50's and their fine. Be careful asking for safe 50/50's and better projectiles #ihatedeadshot

 

[Tanno]

I think a few small changes will do a lot of good to create this sort of defensive tank with explosive offense locked behind trait:

-B232 goes from high, high, high to mid, mid, high (gives cold a reasonable mid that he can use off a jump in and for punishes. Last hit can stay high because of the frame advantage)
-Frost Field now slows the opponent while they are in its area of effect (I can't remember if it does this now, but it should, seeing as how it's like a mini cold grenade field. Slowing down a melee character, even for a second, can be really good)
-Frosted Tips now does a damage reduction in addition to DOT damage to opponent (Gives FT more general use, but most importantly, gives him the edge to win zoning wars by out-damaging other projectiles with his own)

I think those are good enough to accentuate his strengths to tough out some of his weaknesses. He's then be able to Tip up and win projectile wars by attrition and go for riskier things like trait charge without fear of a huge loss of life

-B232: I can do this one after JI3 just fine (got used to it since Sub's JIK starting corner combos). I already have it recorded in my PS4. Once I get the video editing program installed I will work on them to show later.
-Frost Field (I believe you mean the Glacier Grenade): Yep, it indeed does slow the opponent within the area of effect only if juggled. If standing still, it will freeze him.
-Frosted Tips (I believe you mean either the BF1): Yep, it does. It happened against Bladam. One single BF1 just ate his projectile, like Sub's MB Iceball. Unfortunately, it doesn't happen against the other zoners.

Dont need a 50/50 to be good. Black atom, aquaman super man and batman all dont have true 50/50's and their fine. Be careful asking for safe 50/50's and better projectiles #ihatedeadshot

I will be careful on this, but the other characters already have 50/50, like Firestorm. It's just in case some very good CQC players get close to him. :/

 

[TRVP6GXD]

This buff thread is major lulz.

"Daddy boon can you please completely change my character and make him top tier."

Buffalo seems to do well with CC without crying for buffs.

 

[Tanno]

This buff thread is major lulz.

"Daddy boon can you please completely change my character and make him top tier."

Buffalo seems to do well with CC without crying for buffs.

Buffalo already admits that he's crap. Wonder Chef says the same. Have you ever played him?

 

[TRVP6GXD]

Buffalo already admits that he's crap. Wonder Chef says the same. Have you ever played him?

Yes. He could use SOME help but your buff wish list is over the top and pretty ridiculous.

 

[ShadyHeart]

All I really want is:
1. Mids somewhere in B232
2. 12 to link into low special.
3. DF3 to be useable in the corner.
4. Tap trait to channel a whole bar instead of charge mechanic.

Maybe give him a diagonal upward shot.

 

[Tanno]

Yes. He could use SOME help but your buff wish list is over the top and pretty ridiculous.

You guys always say that someone else's buff/nerf list are ridiculous. Nothing changed here in TYM. He need some tweaks to be safe against the rest of the cast. He even has some LAME moves that makes him slower than supposed. He's just a serious ice fighter, not some show-off pistolero fella.

If you have some suggestions and reason them, please, do so, otherwise get your shit talk elsewhere.

 

[KingHippo]

-B232: I can do this one after JI3 just fine (got used to it since Sub's JIK starting corner combos). I already have it recorded in my PS4. Once I get the video editing program installed I will work on them to show later.
-Frost Field (I believe you mean the Glacier Grenade): Yep, it indeed does slow the opponent within the area of effect only if juggled. If standing still, it will freeze him.
-Frosted Tips (I believe you mean either the BF1): Yep, it does. It happened against Bladam. One single BF1 just ate his projectile, like Sub's MB Iceball. Unfortunately, it doesn't happen against the other zoners.

I think you misunderstood my post.

-I'm not talking about doing combos, I mean if you're jumping with, say, jump 1 and you want to land a blockstring, it can be difficult to avoid getting pointed out with that minimal frame advantage. This change would solve that
-I meant Frost Field, which is df3. The mb one does freeze the opponent if they are in it too long, I just want the regular one to slow the opponent if they are in it
-I mean Frosted Tips, which is the first level of his character power. The bf1 would become more powerful with this charge because he could have a average damaging projectile while having less damage done to him from other projectiles, so he'd win trades