Question - Kung Jin Bojutsu vs. Shaolin: which is the better variation for high level play (and why?)

[D7X]

May want to pick him up for a bit! How much easier is the Bojutsu variation?

If you think Ancestral's the best be sure to write why too! =)

 

[TackyHaddock]

Shaolin is significantly better than both bojutsu and ancestral. Bojutsu might be slightly easier to learn, but shaolin is not really hard to learn either. Ancestral is probably hardest to learn and master.

 

[D7X]

Shaolin is significantly better than both bojutsu and ancestral. Bojutsu might be slightly easier to learn, but shaolin is not really hard to learn either. Ancestral is probably hardest to learn and master.

Thanks! I've seen one Shaolin player, and a shit ton of BJS. I'm surprised!

 

[Renzokuken]

Depends on whether you like safety or damage. You get the armored launchers and damage in Bojutsu, but Shaolin has safer mixups, better zoning, and more anti-airing tools.

Tournament wise, Shaolin is overall better than Bojutsu. It's already a strong top 10 variation IMO.

 

[Psyren136]

I'd say boj is easier to learn but shaolin would prolly be more competitive right now.

@EXILE CoRzz could give you a better answer. I think he's been a kung main since day 1 or very early on.

 

[TyCarter35]

From what I know, it comes down to what you value, safety or juicier damage. If u want safety, Shaolin hands down, bojutsu is for dmg and easy to learn. From a competitive stand point, Shaolin can still put up solid dmg and has some decent zoning tools with the chakram which Bojutsu lacks in. Shaolin as it has respectable dmg, semi-decent zoning and safety so no contest for Shaolin. Bojutsu is still viable, you just have to be more unpredictable as many ppl know the MU

 

[Tweedy]

I don't think it's fair to say that Shaolin is significantly better than Bongjutsu. Bong is just clearly worse, however, it's not bad, or much worse. You could use either, but if you want to give yourself the best chance to win, Shaolin is the best in most match ups.

 

[Dankster Morgan]

Shaolin is better for sure. Bojutsu is definitely easier, and if I were trying to start someone out on the game and it was their first fighter or something, then Bojutsu would be a good place to start for them.

 

[Trustypatches]

Shaolin is his best for sure but Boj is still a very solid variation. If I had to recommend which one to play for a new player? I would pick Shaolin but not because I believe it's better.

If you are playing Boj you 100% have to be hitconfirming everything all the time which is something new players can find difficult (I definitely did) whereas in Shaolin you won't get any real punishment for not hitconfirming other than missing out on higher damage on hit. Shaolin is also known for some of the easiest execution in the game (not including optimal corner combos) which is another thing new players struggle with. Other than that, Boj tends to get zoned out a lot worse which I remember despising as a new player lol. Shaolin doesn't ever get zoned badly, thanks to low chakram and occasional use of upkick.

I think Boj has been tied with being a "noob" variation because of the release of the game where everyone thought Kung Jin was top 1 unbeatable broken and so every new player picked up the character and just did instant NJPs all day along with random armored launchers. When I actually look at the character I don't see why it was ever known as noob friendly really.

 

[WettyFapMan]

Pick Shaolin and never hit confirm anything

 

[God Confirm]

Which specific openers does Shaolin make safe for KJ?

 

[xxFalcon Loverxx]

Shaolin.

 

[FinalBoss_FGC]

Let me break it down for you.

Safety
Shaolin - end any combo with up kick, drop and its safe
Bojutsu - you have to hit confirm your specials because none of them are safe

Damage
Shaolin - does mid-20s meterless, low tp mid-30s with one meter
Bojutsu - low 30s meterless, high 30s to low 40s metered

Zoning
Shaolin - has universal straight and up arrow along with a low projectile in low chakram and a mid projectile in straight chakram that you can control in mid air
Bojutsu - has universal straight and up arrows along with a pretty pointless fireball that only covers the air


The ONLY aspect that Bojutsu is better at than Shaolin is damage and that doesn't even matter. You have safe strings that do around 6% chip in Shaolin.

Absolutely Shaolin 100% of the time.

 

[FinalBoss_FGC]

Shaolin is his best for sure but Boj is still a very solid variation. If I had to recommend which one to play for a new player? I would pick Shaolin but not because I believe it's better.

If you are playing Boj you 100% have to be hitconfirming everything all the time which is something new players can find difficult (I definitely did) whereas in Shaolin you won't get any real punishment for not hitconfirming other than missing out on higher damage on hit. Shaolin is also known for some of the easiest execution in the game (not including optimal corner combos) which is another thing new players struggle with. Other than that, Boj tends to get zoned out a lot worse which I remember despising as a new player lol. Shaolin doesn't ever get zoned badly, thanks to low chakram and occasional use of upkick.

I think Boj has been tied with being a "noob" variation because of the release of the game where everyone thought Kung Jin was top 1 unbeatable broken and so every new player picked up the character and just did instant NJPs all day along with random armored launchers. When I actually look at the character I don't see why it was ever known as noob friendly really.

Its important to note that in Bojutsu, pre-patch bo swat was safe on block if I remember correctly

 

[BlackJackSnack]

Bojutsu is still a good variation, his 5050s are punishable but you can always choose to end in mb flip kick to be safe or go into low bowswing to mix it up.

Shaolin however does less damage especially with no meter, but you are so incredibly safe on his enders that he almost always controls the flow of the match.

Both good variations but I would say Shaolin is better imo

 

[stamatis]

interesting question.....
Well listen,i play bojutsu since the reasonable nerfs he received.
This variation is not good.Why?
you must hit confirm every move you do.
half of the cast can break his armoured launcher.
once you perform his overhead string you are - all the way.
he has the worst projectile in the game.
his ex arrows can be crouched block,so no safety at all.
his strings on whiff suck.
i feel really comfortable with this variation and i accept his weaknesses,but this is just me.
I think shaolin will make your life easier.

 

[FinalBoss_FGC]

interesting question.....
Well listen,i play bojutsu since the reasonable nerfs he received.
This variation is not good.Why?
you must hit confirm every move you do.
half of the cast can break his armoured launcher.
once you perform his overhead string you are - all the way.
he has the worst projectile in the game.
his ex arrows can be crouched block,so no safety at all.
his strings on whiff suck.
i feel really comfortable with this variation and i accept his weaknesses,but this is just me.
I think shaolin will make your life easier.

He is fine.


His arrow is def not the worst projectile in the game because you can't punish him full screen on whiff like you can others..he has to play the neutral game but his neutral game is pretty strong.

 

[stamatis]

He is fine.

His f243 is safe. That's why you hit confirm the f24 and if its blocked you do 3

His arrow is def not the worst projectile in the game because you can't punish him full screen on whiff like you can others..he has to play the neutral game but his neutral game is pretty strong.

f243 is -11.
the arrow does 4% damage.

 

[GrimJack]

One more thing, in Bojutsu, after a combo the opponent is full screen and that means give away most of your oki and get zone again. While after lounge and drop in shaolin, you are at the perfect distance for a 50/50

 

[Tweedy]

Also in Bojutsu you're only getting oki midscreen if you end in B34 or maybe something. DB3 might do a lot of damage but it doesn't grant pressure unless you're in the corner.

In Shaolin DB3 + D4 sets up oki on any part of the screen.

Btw I feel that Stamatis or whatever guy. When you play a variation or character to be a hipster, and it turns out to be good(entire Mileena community lawlz), it stings. Real hipsters play Ancestral breh.

Edit: Someone literally posted what I said about oki 3 minutes before me. Sheet. I'll leave this post because of the hipster comment I guess lol.

 

[D7X]

Thanks all! Didn't think Shaolin was this much better, haha!

 

[Shaikhuzzaman]

I think bojutsu is significantly easier to use but considerably worse in comparison to shaolin which isn't really hard to use either

Steer clear of ancestral. Every game becomes a challenge

 

[Trustypatches]

The ONLY aspect that Bojutsu is better at than Shaolin is damage and that doesn't even matter. You have safe strings that do around 6% chip in Shaolin.

Absolutely Shaolin 100% of the time.

14 frame armor that launches for 36% (probably something more optimal somewhere) midescreen is pretty big to be fair. I also wouldn't say more damage doesn't even matter, at the end of the day everything you do is for damage. Another thing people forget is 221 in Boj and Ancestral doesn't have a gap, so you can still break 11 frame armors without having to be full combo punishable if they block. I just thought about ex low bo swing as well, that effectively gives him a low and oh armored wakeup game too. (low and oh armor both come out on 16th frame)

 

[Trustypatches]

interesting question.....
Well listen,i play bojutsu since the reasonable nerfs he received.
This variation is not good.Why?
you must hit confirm every move you do.
half of the cast can break his armoured launcher.
once you perform his overhead string you are - all the way.
he has the worst projectile in the game.
his ex arrows can be crouched block,so no safety at all.
his strings on whiff suck.
i feel really comfortable with this variation and i accept his weaknesses,but this is just me.
I think shaolin will make your life easier.

I don't see hitconfirming every move as a minus for the character. The fact that you can visually see something has been blocked and not commit to the unsafe special is a + in my view. It just means you can't autopilot. He still has a 9 frame double hitting ex flykick which isn't that rewarding on hit but still better than nothing. Ex db3 is still 14 frames so even though it can be broken I wouldn't say it is that bad as they have to go out of their way to try and crush it. Not like Predators standard armor which will be broken without even trying. I also don't think all his stuff sucks on whiff. At the end of the day, variationless Jin has 11 with 4 frames of whiff recovery, a disjointed hurtbox and great range. That string is imo arguably one of the best neutral game strings there is. I don't play Boj anymore but I still see it as good.

But yes straight arrow is utterly trash lmao.

I also forgot to mention that the options after a blocked f24 are actually really good: Stop at f24 to be -8, with a very hard punish in MOST MU's, go into f243 and jail a safe ex cartwheel OH which goes into HKD or go for an unsafe low (ex low which launches in the corner for 32% (or more?)) and both of these come out on the same frame and are 16 frames so it's a true 50/50. For MU's where the ex straight arrow is NOT low profiled, you can still go for these and end at +7. Nothing is guaranteed at +7 but it's a hell of a lot better than being punishable.

Basically you can make them guess a true mixup after they have already blocked right once on the initial OH lol. If you go for ex OH then they can't even punish after blocking right twice.

 

[Trustypatches]

I think something that is often forgotten is how much better b12 is in shaolin than b14. It makes his low so reliable as a neutral tool. No whiffing on block or hit is seriously good.