Match-up Discussion Batgirl MUs Post 1.06

[Pan1cMode]

The batgirl boards are dead so here are my opinions on BGs MUs post patch. Any input is appreciated and welcomed.



Aquaman 5-5

Ares 6-4

Bane 5-5

Batgirl 5-5

Batman 5-5

Black Adam 6-4

Catwoman 5-5

Cyborg 7-3

Deathstroke 6-4

Doomsday 5-5

Flash 5-5

Green Arrow 6-4

Green Lantern 6-4

Harley Quinn 5-5

Hawkgirl 6-4

The Joker 6-4

Killer Frost 5-5

Lex Luthor 6-4

Lobo 6-4

Martian Manhunter 5-5

Nightwing 5-5

Raven 6-4

Scorpion 6-4

Shazam 5-5

Sinestro 5-5

Solomon Grundy 5-5

Superman 6-4

Wonder Woman 5-5

Zatanna 6-4

Zod 5-5

Losing MUs: 0
Advantage MUs: 14
Even MUs: 16

 

[DevilMaySpy]

@SonicFox5000

 

[Pan1cMode]

@SonicFox5000
@RiBBz22
@AK Reno_Racks
@RenegadeVA

 

[RiBBz22]

The batgirl boards are dead so here are my opinions on BGs MUs post patch. Any input is appreciated and welcomed.



Aquaman 3.5-6.5

Ares 6-4

Bane 5-5

Batgirl 5-5

Batman 4.5-5.5

Black Adam 6-4

Catwoman 5-5

Cyborg 6-4

Deathstroke 6-4

Doomsday 5-5

Flash 5-5

Green Arrow 6-4

Green Lantern 6-4

Harley Quinn 5-5

Hawkgirl 5.5-4.5

The Joker 6-4

Killer Frost 5-5

Lex Luthor 6-4

Lobo ??

Martian Manhunter 5-5

Nightwing 5-5

Raven 6-4

Scorpion 6-4

Shazam 5-5

Sinestro 5-5

Solomon Grundy 5-5

Superman 6-4

Wonder Woman 5-5

Zatanna 5-5

Zod 5-5

Loosing MUs: 2
Advantage MUs: 12
Even MUs: 15
Unsure MUs: 1

I agree with most of the matchups. Some quick thoughts...

I still think that Aquaman is a 3-7 MU, I think that she loses to Batman 4-6, and I don't feel comfortable enough in the MMH matchup with BG to say it is a 5-5 yet. I could see Flash being a losing matchup as well.

I think she has a slight advantage over Bane and Hawkgirl (probably 6-4's)

I don't think she beats Black Adam or Superman (solid 5-5 IMO). If Superman recovered a little slower from his projectiles I think BG would win this and the MU would totally change.

I think that Batgirl is an awesome character, but I have always felt that Frost is the better option so I end up playing her more. My opinion is that Batgirl is slightly overrated since most people on this site seem to consider that she is without a doubt better than KF.

 

[Pan1cMode]

I agree with most of the matchups. Some quick thoughts...

I still think that Aquaman is a 3-7 MU, I think that she loses to Batman 4-6, and I don't feel comfortable enough in the MMH matchup with BG to say it is a 5-5 yet. I could see Flash being a losing matchup as well.

I think she has a slight advantage over Bane and Hawkgirl (probably 6-4's)

I don't think she beats Black Adam or Superman (solid 5-5 IMO). If Superman recovered a little slower from his projectiles I think BG would win this and the MU would totally change.

I think that Batgirl is an awesome character, but I have always felt that Frost is the better option so I end up playing her more. My opinion is that Batgirl is slightly overrated since most people on this site seem to consider that she is without a doubt better than KF.

I'm hesitant to put vs. AM as a 7-3. Just looking at other character's 7-3s it's not as bad as them. Also, I could see her having the advantage over Bane but again I think atm it's 5-5.

For hawkgirl I have it listed as 5.5-4.5 advantage BG. BG struggles greatly with HG pressure. Her only answer is df2 and that's hella risky. I look at the GL MU and I see that as a solid 6-4. I don't see BG beating HG to the same extent.

I still feel that we have the advantage vs. BA and SM. Prepatch I was always a proponent of claiming these as even MUs. Now, I do feel that Babs has the advantage in these MUs.



As for your comment on Frost, I co-main her along with Zatanna and Babs. I mostly take her out for AM though. Occasionally for BM (although I normally use Zatanna for that). I feel that BG is the stronger of the two (at least for me).

 

[Rip Torn]

Batman 4.5-5.5
One of her worst mu's. she can't AA j2 at all. Trait let's batman get in and then it's time for j2's. Batgirl takes all the risk on bat uppercut reversals and yolo smoke bombs. I think it's a solid 4-6.

Black Adam 6-4
Actually I think BA has the slight edge. His keep-away game is really annoying for a character like BG. If BG gets too close he can dive kick away to the other side and play more keep away. Batgirl again has to make great reads while BA gets to stay safe. 4.5-5.5 BA.

Green Arrow 6-4
I think this is actually even or in GA's favor. Fire arrows are a problem for BG. She has to make smoke bomb reads while GA reloads. Sky alert can save GA from getting hit by smoke bomb and starts a combo if it hits. BG wants to get in but GA has good keep away so it's very uphill for BG. 4.5-5.5.

Martian Manhunter 5-5
This has got to be in MMH favor. lets just compare the two characters: MMH has a safe overhead teleport that leads to a full combo for no meter spent. Batgirl's teleport is totally unsafe, hits mid, only leads to a combo if you have meter to spend. Not to mention his randomly crosses up and has a massive hitbox that BG can't dash out of. MMH has better zoning. MMH has better anti air and more range on normals especially with trait. MM has a better b3/f3. His d1 is faster than hers. His wake ups are harder to blow up. He's basically better at everything. 4-6

Superman 6-4
I agree with RiBBz22 5-5

WW, HG, Sinestro and Flash can be troublesome but I'm not sure on those so I agree with 5-5. Oh, and I think she beats Shazam 6-4.

Basically I think she has 5 bad match ups. Unfortunately, she loses to top tier characters because she is so unsafe and she has to get in to do anything. Her slow bad range normals really hurt her up-close game against the d1 special characters like Black Adam and Aquaman.

 

[astronout]

Batgirl does NOT beat Green Lantern.
(MU exp Blackula, Kenetic Ororchi)

Batman beats Batgirl 6-4
(MU exp Forever King, Darth Arma)

Batgirl does NOT beat Joker
(MU exp Qwark)

Batgirl does NOT beat Lex Luthor
(MU exp Rev0lver)

Batgirl does NOT beat Black Adam
(MU exp Rico Suave)

Batgirl does NOT beat Superman
(MU exp KDZ)

I highly doubt Batgirl beats Raven but not completely sure

And I am pretty confident in calling Wonder Woman vs Batgirl 6-4 in WW's favor
(MU exp Foxy Grandpa)

and Aquaman vs Batgirl is a solid 7-3 in his favor
(MU exp Tom Brady)

also, Doomsday may have the advantage vs batgirl
(MU exp EMPR Whiteboi)

 

[Qwark28]

Batgirl does NOT beat Green Lantern.
(MU exp Blackula, Kenetic Ororchi)

Batman beats Batgirl 6-4
(MU exp Forever King, Darth Arma)

Batgirl does NOT beat Joker
(MU exp Qwark)

Batgirl does NOT beat Lex Luthor
(MU exp Rev0lver)

Batgirl does NOT beat Black Adam
(MU exp Rico Suave)

Batgirl does NOT beat Superman
(MU exp KDZ)

I highly doubt Batgirl beats Raven but not completely sure

And I am pretty confident in calling Wonder Woman vs Batgirl 6-4 in WW's favor
(MU exp Foxy Grandpa)

and Aquaman vs Batgirl is a solid 7-3 in his favor
(MU exp Tom Brady)

also, Doomsday may have the advantage vs batgirl
(MU exp EMPR Whiteboi)

Joker loses the matchup. Your vortex is dumb, I can't AA you appropriately and you outzone me.

 

[Red Reaper]

Batgirl does NOT beat Green Lantern.
(MU exp Blackula, Kenetic Ororchi)

Batman beats Batgirl 6-4
(MU exp Forever King, Darth Arma)

Batgirl does NOT beat Joker
(MU exp Qwark)

Batgirl does NOT beat Lex Luthor
(MU exp Rev0lver)

Batgirl does NOT beat Black Adam
(MU exp Rico Suave)

Batgirl does NOT beat Superman
(MU exp KDZ)

I highly doubt Batgirl beats Raven but not completely sure

And I am pretty confident in calling Wonder Woman vs Batgirl 6-4 in WW's favor
(MU exp Foxy Grandpa)

and Aquaman vs Batgirl is a solid 7-3 in his favor
(MU exp Tom Brady)

also, Doomsday may have the advantage vs batgirl
(MU exp EMPR Whiteboi)

Seeing all these losing MU's and your Killer Frost avatar made me think you were MylesRight.

 

[astronout]

Joker loses the matchup. Your vortex is dumb, I can't AA you appropriately and you outzone me.

you win all trades in the air, batgirl doesn't zone anyone, and teleport is easily read and punished. and your Oki game is dump

it's easy to say batgirl wins the MU but both characters have to work equally as hard to close out any match.

 

[astronout]

Seeing all these losing MU's and your Killer Frost avatar made me think you were MylesRight.

i don't think she loses any of the MU's i posted aside from aquaman and possibly WoWo

 

[Qwark28]

you win all trades in the air, batgirl doesn't zone anyone, and teleport is easily read and punished. and your Oki game is dump

it's easy to say batgirl wins the MU but both characters have to work equally as hard to close out any match.

I only win air trades if you don't do a j1 or j2 fast enough. Your bola will always trade with my gunshot and then you get your vortex. Teleport being read and punished is more about me knowing when to shoot and when not.

 

[SoundsLikePAUSE]

Agree with @Rip Torn She definitely doesn't beat Green Arrow. He can out zone her and DB2 any attempt she makes to use her vortex shenannigans. I put it at 5-5 only because of her corner damage potential.

 

[RM Truth]

Batgirl-Lobo is 6-4 Batgirl IMO

Lobo has to work to get in on her because of Bola and one wrong guess puts him in the vortex. Lack of good wake-ups means that in the corner he has to block properly and dies if he doesn't. Only thing Lobo has on her is damage when he touches her and oki to deal with her wakeups. It's possibly 5-5 but I'm leaning more towards Batgirl favor.

@GGA Fill Pops

@Pan1cMode

 

[RM Truth]

Joker is 6-4 at the worst IMO for reasons Qwark gave

Green Arrow is 6-4 at the worst IMO

 

[Red Reaper]

Green Arrow 6-4
I think this is actually even or in GA's favor. Fire arrows are a problem for BG. She has to make smoke bomb reads while GA reloads. Sky alert can save GA from getting hit by smoke bomb and starts a combo if it hits. BG wants to get in but GA has good keep away so it's very uphill for BG. 4.5-5.5.

Martian Manhunter 5-5
This has got to be in MMH favor. lets just compare the two characters: MMH has a safe overhead teleport that leads to a full combo for no meter spent. Batgirl's teleport is totally unsafe, hits mid, only leads to a combo if you have meter to spend. Not to mention his randomly crosses up and has a massive hitbox that BG can't dash out of. MMH has better zoning. MMH has better anti air and more range on normals especially with trait. MM has a better b3/f3. His d1 is faster than hers. His wake ups are harder to blow up. He's basically better at everything. 4-6

We should play these match ups next WNF (Kan't make it today..). I should have a konverter by next week so I'll finally be able to play kasuals without being severely handicapped by the Xbox Pad...

PS: MMH overhead tele doesn't randomly kross up. It's based on the opponent's movement or orbs..

 

[RM Truth]

Batman 4.5-5.5
One of her worst mu's. she can't AA j2 at all. Trait let's batman get in and then it's time for j2's. Batgirl takes all the risk on bat uppercut reversals and yolo smoke bombs. I think it's a solid 4-6.

Black Adam 6-4
Actually I think BA has the slight edge. His keep-away game is really annoying for a character like BG. If BG gets too close he can dive kick away to the other side and play more keep away. Batgirl again has to make great reads while BA gets to stay safe. 4.5-5.5 BA.

Green Arrow 6-4
I think this is actually even or in GA's favor. Fire arrows are a problem for BG. She has to make smoke bomb reads while GA reloads. Sky alert can save GA from getting hit by smoke bomb and starts a combo if it hits. BG wants to get in but GA has good keep away so it's very uphill for BG. 4.5-5.5.

Martian Manhunter 5-5
This has got to be in MMH favor. lets just compare the two characters: MMH has a safe overhead teleport that leads to a full combo for no meter spent. Batgirl's teleport is totally unsafe, hits mid, only leads to a combo if you have meter to spend. Not to mention his randomly crosses up and has a massive hitbox that BG can't dash out of. MMH has better zoning. MMH has better anti air and more range on normals especially with trait. MM has a better b3/f3. His d1 is faster than hers. His wake ups are harder to blow up. He's basically better at everything. 4-6

Superman 6-4
I agree with RiBBz22 5-5

WW, HG, Sinestro and Flash can be troublesome but I'm not sure on those so I agree with 5-5. Oh, and I think she beats Shazam 6-4.

Basically I think she has 5 bad match ups. Unfortunately, she loses to top tier characters because she is so unsafe and she has to get in to do anything. Her slow bad range normals really hurt her up-close game against the d1 special characters like Black Adam and Aquaman.

Batgirl doesn't only have Smoke Bomb against GA. Her dash is incredibly good and its pretty easy to get in. GA has to make reads as well to Up Arrow, otherwise BG dashes in for free at least twice.

 

[Red Reaper]

i don't think she loses any of the MU's i posted aside from aquaman and possibly WoWo

Fair enough..

 

[Rip Torn]

We should play these match ups next WNF (Kan't make it today..). I should have a konverter by next week so I'll finally be able to play kasuals without being severely handicapped by the Xbox Pad...

PS: MMH overhead tele doesn't randomly kross up. It's based on the opponent's movement or orbs..

I'm down. I can't make it this week either so next week for sure.

I guess it doesn't randomly cross up, but after certain knockdowns it does cross up which is sort of random because there is no reason that it should.

 

[Red Reaper]

I'm down. I can't make it this week either so next week for sure.

I guess it doesn't randomly cross up, but after certain knockdowns it does cross up which is sort of random because there is no reason that it should.

Don't know what knockdowns you're talking about. Pre-patch B13 ender was untechable and you kould make it kross up that way but now there's no reason not to tech roll.

But yeah. Look forward to next week.. Bringing back my Martian.

 

[Rip Torn]

Batgirl doesn't only have Smoke Bomb against GA. Her dash is incredibly good and its pretty easy to get in. GA has to make reads as well to Up Arrow, otherwise BG dashes in for free at least twice.

I know, I just like to point out that he can beat out smoke bomb outright. He doesn't even have to take the chip damage.

 

[Rip Torn]

Don't know what knockdowns you're talking about. Pre-patch B13 ender was untechable and you kould make it kross up that way but now there's no reason not to tech roll.

But yeah. Look forward to next week.. Bringing back my Martian.

I thought it crossed up after 112 combo ender and after certain j3's but I could be wrong.

 

[Red Reaper]

I thought it crossed up after 112 combo ender and after certain j3's but I could be wrong.

I doubt it but I'll check later to make sure... 112 is a random string to use as a kombo ender..

 

[RM Truth]

Martian Manhunter 5-5
This has got to be in MMH favor. lets just compare the two characters: MMH has a safe overhead teleport that leads to a full combo for no meter spent. Batgirl's teleport is totally unsafe, hits mid, only leads to a combo if you have meter to spend. Not to mention his randomly crosses up and has a massive hitbox that BG can't dash out of. MMH has better zoning. MMH has better anti air and more range on normals especially with trait. MM has a better b3/f3. His d1 is faster than hers. His wake ups are harder to blow up. He's basically better at everything. 4-6

Have you tested what happens when Batgirl Smoke Bombs after he teleports?

 

[RM Truth]

I can agree with 5-5 for Nightwing. NW has some moves that can make Smoke Bomb whiff if they're making a read or reacting to a movement, which gives NW pressure. That and staff stance makes it difficult for her to get in range to start her vortex because of D1