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The Deadshot Debate.

Rebalance Deadshot?

  • Yes.

    Votes: 125 73.5%
  • No.

    Votes: 10 5.9%
  • There's no way to adjust him without defeating the purpose of his design.

    Votes: 35 20.6%

  • Total voters
    170

ryublaze

Noob
A possible solution would be to adjust the recovery and meter building of the wrist cannon, but keep the current recovery for trait wrist cannon so that the zoning is enhanced in trait only, similar to Dr. Fate's design.
I like this suggestion. Just to add on I think blue trait shouldn't deal more damage on hit/block than red trait because right now blue trait is better than red trait unless you are in the corner. By taking away the damage buff altogether it would give more incentive to use red trait.
 

Slymind

Noob
While I do think Deadshot still needs a bit more nerfs, he seems to be more of a problem for the viewerbase. He still has losing match-ups just like he did pre-patch, so he's not unbeatable. Then there are some smaller things about the match-up that players aren't doing (such as taking your free dash after rifle/trick shot/db2, not dashing after mb rifle, properly whiff punishing his wakeup, character specific punishes on b12u3, taking advantage of his low damage, etc.)
Maybe there is also some frustration to the fact that for you to fight Deadshot you have to be on point with everything all the time, dash, crouch, reads, punish, while DS himself keep basically using two moves from afar before you can finally reach him.

I actually knew this was coming the moment they went through him in the patch stream. I proposed some type of recharge mechanic for DS back then, so you can limit his projectile usage, oh well, it's up to NRS figure this out.

I for one think the character design and gameplan is very lame, as a sniper it would make more sense to be a character that needs a few shots to be deadly instead of making a rain of bullets.
 

Invincible Salads

Seeker of knowledge
I like this suggestion. Just to add on I think blue trait shouldn't deal more damage on hit/block than red trait because right now blue trait is better than red trait unless you are in the corner. By taking away the damage buff altogether it would give more incentive to use red trait.
however wrist cannon, if nerfed, needs to be left with enough recovery to combo off of in the corner, ie f23~bf1.

like i said i hope this character keeps his strong zoning, while still having some options to get people off of him upclose. nothing too crazy tho.
 

dribirut

BLAK FELOW
Chip damage is nooooot the problem in this game. It's the insane meter building you get plus having 4 bars available to spend.

I think it's dumb to get meter while taking damage
 
Personally I enjoy Deadshot's zoning game. What I don't enjoy is seeing DS players not give a shit weather their opponent is afar (good zoning), close (50/50) or in the corner (over 500 dmg). NRS needs to change DS so his players are motivated to keep their opponent afar and it'll be all good.
What is that combo that does over 500 dmg in the corner?!? And on who on Darkseid or on Bane in debuff?!?
 

Crusty

Retired forever; don’t ask for games.
I suggest that one thing be done only. In the past, NRS has over-buffed and over-normalized which has lead to some overpowered and worthless characters. The objective is to balance Deadshot as Catwoman and Black Adam were balanced, not ruin him.

I would also reduce Red Hood's EX lunge chip damage in half.
I approve of that change but you gotta take into consideration other moves that have a similar startup and function. Those moves should be normalized in chip damage as well.
 

dribirut

BLAK FELOW
I main DS and have won tournaments with him. I voted yes. He is now Tanya status bc of a few things. He is very easy to use and people can pick him up in a week. A good zoner should be very hard to use like sinestro or Zod or dr fate. His issue is the high shot. I have no idea how to fix him. If you nerf startup or recovery of high shot he loses mid screen damage that was already among the worst in the game. Nerf high shot it gives him the deadshot treatment. It has to happen. Maybe if he was harder to use and the devs stopped catering to scrubs or "we need to make everyone easy to use" this wouldn't happen.

I'm lost. Was going to travel after dlc was out but I really don't feel like I hv a char. Dr fate is unplayable for me bc of all the errors. Hell even bdon gets them and almost lost his top 8 qualifying match can honeybee bc of one.
Bro I'm gonna pretend like you didn't say sinestro was hard to use.. just gonna walk away
 
If the bf1 has to stay then the knee needs to be toned down. One bar for a plus wake up or corner pressure is nothing off this character. I'd also ask his d1 to be 8 frames. He's a zoner leave him zoning.
 

EMPRESS_SunFire

Regina George of discord
If the bf1 has to stay then the knee needs to be toned down. One bar for a plus wake up or corner pressure is nothing off this character. I'd also ask his d1 to be 8 frames. He's a zoner leave him zoning.
His MB Knee si not plus tho, it's -3.

His wake-up si fine if he gets his up-close game toned down.
 

kevkopdx

Noob
Her zoning is way scarier when she has trait, yeah! I personally think more Starfire players should use her stardust special way more. It does a lot of chip damage and when you cancel it into trait it's just too much. People will want to try to avoid that which means it opens up for dashes or MB rolls which all can be punished by her on a read, she has the surprise factor that makes you think twice before even moving.
Her up-close game isn't that good but she does probably twice his damage and she is pretty safe in general.
Her air normals are ridiculous tbqh.

Not saying she is Tanya/Alien level of dumb but I think she is extremely good and has the potential to be broken, and I agree with F0xy that most people are probably not using her right yet, I don't think I've seen people abuse her mindgames as much as they could.
but if you compare her mus, dont you think there are way more counterpick opportunities against starfire as compared to deadshot? there are more zoners that can go head to head with her as opposed to deadshot. I think cyborg and blue beetle can contend, and it would be fun to see them be tourney viable against her. (early impressions)
 

SM StarGazer

The voice of reason in a Sea of Salt
Hey OP! Can you send me the names of the *Currently* 8 people that voted NO on 'rebalancing' (Nice word for nerf bitches ya'll anit slick.) Deadshot.

I just found a Death Note outside my window and I'm itching to use it. I know 8 people that deserve...so far.
 

ABACABB

End Of Humanity
Hey OP! Can you send me the names of the *Currently* 8 people that voted NO on 'rebalancing' (Nice word for nerf bitches ya'll anit slick.) Deadshot.

I just found a Death Note outside my window and I'm itching to use it. I know 8 people that deserve...so far.
I hope you always fight deadshots in tourneys :p
 

DarksydeDash

You know me as RisingShieldBro online.
I don't want them to completely butcher the guy so I propose these changes, let them rock, and then see how his perfomance is.

- Reduce his meter gain overall, which means less chip damage overall.
- Make his overhead string a mid to prevent 50/50 staggers
- Add a little bit more recovery frames to straight shot so he can't rapid fire it.
 
The speed, meterbuild and recovery on straight shot is insane.

Mb low rifle I mean like they nerfed trident rush and left this?

His gaps help him up close because poking will get blown up by the gaps being there. If they took away the gaps in b12u3 he wouldn't be able to stagger. You could basically option select poke out. Either take out the gaps or make one of his 50/50s a mid.

I think trick shot is fine. It has a bit more recovery than straight shot.

Changing the game as a whole could create more problems. The game is fine outside of Deadshot atm IMO.

Edit: The problem with exploiting the gaps in b12u3, is that first of all it starts with a low so you're literally sitting there waiting to backdash out of a unreactable advancing low, while he could be doing whatever else. Plus where does backdashing get you vs Deadshot? The gaps have helped him since day 1.
literally my biggest problem with deadshot are all his gaps in the b12u3 string. staggerable 50/50s should not exist.
 

Meep8345

Noob
however wrist cannon, if nerfed, needs to be left with enough recovery to combo off of in the corner, ie f23~bf1.

like i said i hope this character keeps his strong zoning, while still having some options to get people off of him upclose. nothing too crazy tho.
You don't even need f23 to combo into bf1 lol. You're so scared of b12 that his overhead is easy to hit and lets not mention he can cancel it either into bf1 or mb bf3 and be safe, so there's a mind game in the overhead alone.
 

Invincible Salads

Seeker of knowledge
You don't even need f23 to combo into bf1 lol. You're so scared of b12 that his overhead is easy to hit and lets not mention he can cancel it either into bf1 or mb bf3 and be safe, so there's a mind game in the overhead alone.
regardless its one of his main launchers in the corner, and bf1 is the only real way to get anything, so yea he does need his wrist shot to have at least good enough recovery so that he can combo off it. sorry if you don't agree but thats bare minimum where it needs to be.
 
I really think we only need to beef his b1 and b12 and make it severely unsafe so he can't stagger and if he wants to mix up to get you off and you correctly block it he eats 30%-40% and is still in a bad position. This of which means he will either try to fight and risk losing or mb roll out but spending meter meaning less mb rifle. Overall I think this is the best way without butchering the character.
 

Tweedy

Noob
regardless its one of his main launchers in the corner, and bf1 is the only real way to get anything, so yea he does need his wrist shot to have at least good enough recovery so that he can combo off it. sorry if you don't agree but thats bare minimum where it needs to be.
This is just false info. You can combo off of f23 knee in the corner.