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Rate Your Character (Injustice 2 Edition)

IMO

Joker:

1. 50/50 mix ups pressure(2/5) - Joker has a hard time opening an opponent for his BNBs. He has a nice low into overhead that can be used (B1 - crowbar), but it is slow enough to block on reaction and has to be set up. The mix ups he has do not lead into his damaging combos or set ups. But his corner pressure is insane due to his teeth set ups. He has hard to blockables but they are too situational IMO. He opens his opponents up with his J2.


2. Zoning and anti-Zoning(2/5) - His gun shot is a nice tool to catch back dashers or jumpers but it has to be used carefully since it's easy to punish. Since it doesn't kockdown on hit anymore its best used for meter building or punishing. His teeth can help to create space but joker needs to be close to the opponent. He gets zoned out very easily.

3. Neutral game and footsies(1/5) - This is the weakest part of his game IMO. In order to start his pressure he needs a knockdown just like in Inj 1. His b1 - 3 gives him a hard knockdown where he starts his teeth setups and pressure. But in order to get to this point you have to find a way to open the opponent up. His strings are pretty slow so you cant really pressure the opponent until he is on the ground.

4. Defensive Options(1/5) - Joker is definitely not a defensive character. He does not have a good wakeup and your best bet is to block correctly when knocked down. It is very hard to get someone off of you when they start their pressure. Inj 1 had acid flower which covered this but he does not have this anymore. His new parry is very good but it only works on highs and not lows.

5. Damage Output(5/5) - Joker's damage is insane. His BNBs include MB RLG. If you land this he can hit you for 49% easily as well as set up a hard knockdown. His new super allows for a follow combo and has way more damage this time around. You can get around 70% damage if you land his super.


Total Rating(11/25)

If 'Fun' was a rating it would be (5/5). Other joker mains feel free to chime in this is just my take on the character.
Ok so I don't play Joker so maybe I'm wrong. But its hard for me to accept the character being as bad as you say based on what I've seen from players. He seems like a decent mid-tier character. At the very least hes a lot better than swamp thing.

I don't think there's anyway you can justify saying his neutral and defensive options are both 1/5.
 

EMPRESS_SunFire

Regina George of discord
Ok so I don't play Joker so maybe I'm wrong. But its hard for me to accept the character being as bad as you say based on what I've seen from players. He seems like a decent mid-tier character. At the very least hes a lot better than swamp thing.

I don't think there's anyway you can justify saying his neutral and defensive options are both 1/5.
Yeah, I don't see him having just 1/5 with that B1, D2 and his air normals...
 
Ivy
Mix and pressure 3.5: personally I think her up close game is underrated. She's got decent staggers and a half screen f3 that gets her easy plus frames and she can setup hard to blockables with trait. Plus I think dautra cancels are super underrated as a pressure tool and I can see a lot of potential in her oki game with f3 cross up set ups

Zoning 4: I want to bump it to a 5 but there's a couple matchups where she has no full screen presence at all. If you're a character with poor air control and you have to get in then you're in for a rough time. The drill mb drill guessing game is great and if she catches you shared to move or you don't have a way to check her she can just set up trait and build a ton of meter and chip

Neutral 4: b2 is a great button and mb f3 can blow up any thing thrown out near mid screen plus she's got a great walk speed. The only thing stopping her from getting a 5 is lack of anti air but she's got a decent air to ait with jump 1

Defensive 1: she doesn't get much of her d1 and it's hard for her to deal with jump ins. Her wakeup is pretty shit. She gets good damage off it and it has invincibility but it gets low profiled, can't hit airborne opponents, and it gets blown you by moves that are throw immune.

Damage 4: her damage is super solid. Only reason it's not a 5 is because I think Adam is the only character who deserves a 5 in this category.

16.5/25
Agree with this. However, although Adam has great damage, have you seen Superman's damage? One good solid combo with Trait and damn near half you bar is gone.

Darkseid's damage is up there as well, imho.
 
Ok so I don't play Joker so maybe I'm wrong. But its hard for me to accept the character being as bad as you say based on what I've seen from players. He seems like a decent mid-tier character. At the very least hes a lot better than swamp thing.

I don't think there's anyway you can justify saying his neutral and defensive options are both 1/5.
I would say that you see some success with him bc people are unfamiliar with the matchup. Once you fight enough jokers hes easy to counter. He had all this stuff in inj 1 and was still considered the worst character. His D2 J3 etc. And they took away alot of things in inj 1 that he needed to start an offense. Sonicfoxx can make anybody look god tier. You remember when Forever King won a tournament with Goro? He was still considered bottom tier.
 

M2Dave

Zoning Master
Also any string that doesn't connect immediately in neutral can fall prey to DS' MB instant air stomp for a full combo. And the threat of teleport and regular jump-in (a better jump-in than Cold's) as well means that this is still a mixup.
Thank you for this example. I stand corrected, but claiming that Captain Cold's footsies are "trash" and "possibly 1/5" is a massive exaggeration. In my opinion, no character who has access to such an uppercut can have one of the worst footsies in the game. The fact that he has limited offense without trait, which is very difficult to charge against the top tier characters, is the real issue, not the footsies.

Did he do it for MKX? I remember the first 2 games but I don't remember MKX being done.
Mortal Kombat X was done. Check the first post for a link.

@General M2Dave what was P2W's rating system for MKX? I don't think it was great for that game, but I feel like it would fit INJ 2.
I cannot recall at the moment. I personally did not like the rating system because there were too many categories. My rating system is based on Tekken's. The categories have obviously been changed to reflect the importance of the current Injustice 2 meta.

I would love to see @PLAYING TO WIN 's rating of Deadshot, though. He has the best one that I have played by far.

Keep the ratings coming. With the help of others, I may select the most accurate ones and include the authors in a private conversation to form a tier list based on the information.
 

JLU51306

Bzzzt *Paging Doctor Fate*
Can't believe you have him a 4/5 for pressure and 2/5 for zoning. I thinks it's the other way around. I mean once you get his trait up he can zone with the best of them. He doesn't even have a F22 string. And most people end there combos in B232 so they can charge there trait
I don't really know where to begin. His zoning tools only work against characters with zero zoning capabilities (Black Canary, Brainiac, Bane, etc). Anyone with the shittiest projectile can stuff him out on his zoning, and not to mention can prevent him from ever trying to trait per zoning. And yes, he does have a f22 string (or f223 if you'd like). He's a pressure/defensive character, not zoning. If you're having trouble with his zoning, you're either a rushdown main who's impatient, or you're just impatient period.
 

Pan1cMode

AUS FGC represent!
What are his mixups tho like honestly? B1 into b1? He doesn't have any overhead besides f3. Explain to me what his mixups are because I don't think being able to cross up a f3 on wake up means you have good mixups.
He has a safe overhead and low that both lead to full combo.

He has several ambiguous cross up setups.

His mixups are not 2/5. Quit downplaying
 

Pan1cMode

AUS FGC represent!
Superman

50/50s and pressure: 3/5
Zoning: 4/5
Neutral: 4/5
Defensive: 4/5
Damage: 5/5

20/25

I think Superman's neutral is 5/5 in a lot of match ups and 3/5 in others, so I put it at 4/5. His zoning is some of the most underrated in the game but not good enough to warrant a 5 imo. His pressure is extremely overrated because people will always contest after trait, if you just play off of breath it's not as omg crazy as people say. He has nice mix in the corner tho. Could be a 4 because of that.

I didn't know where to put defense. His wake ups can be kinda suspect but he has a 6 frame d1 to back them up, and an amazing backdash. Not a 5 but probably a 4. His damage needs no explanation.
I gave superman 5/5 for zoning/counter zoning because although he isn't the best zoner, his aerial mobility, angle d3, and the ability to use projectiles both in the air and on the ground make him an exceptional counter zoner.

To put his neutral as anything less than 5/5 seems disingenuous to me. If you're gonna give black adam a 5/5 in neutral, you have to give superman one too.
 

chief713

Vertebral Subluxationist
BANE:

50/50 mix-ups and or pressure: 4/5

Tick throws off of 3 strings and several normals. Trait gives him armor on all specials and armor break on lvl 3. He's got a low launching string and for 2 bars can turn his armored, armor-breaking overhead (which also ticks into command grab) into a launcher. Took a point off because most of his stuff has poor range and is comically slow/unsafe. He's also neutered quite a bit by MBB3's.

Zoning and anti-zoning:
2/5

No projectiles. Very limited movement with slow, stubby strings and normals, a floaty jump and a slow recovering dash. All he has is MB roll and a 33f startup charge that can be easily MBB3'd on reaction. I gave him 2 pts because he has gdlk walk speed, a full screen super and can move through projectiles with F2 cancels at lvl 3 venom.

Neutral game and footsies:
3/5

Bane has little full screen presence and is often out ranged up close. Fastest normals are a 9f high and 11f D1; he relies on these for the bulk of his neutral, in addition to his trait armored specials. His offense opens up after landing D1 (low/OH/cmd grab mixup) but is easily avoidable with backdash, as D1 frame traps require incredibly strict timing. The high volume of unthrowable normals, strings and specials neuters command grab. All of Bane's specials, in addition to being super unsafe, are single hit, so MBB3's bodies his armor.

Defensive options:
4/5

Venom uppercut has fast startup, very good horizontal/vertical range, a wide hitbox that extends behind Bane and autocorrects. Block to bait it and you eat command grab. In the neutral, he has an air grab with a giant horizontal hitbox (catches CW j2 from far af) and his frame 1 armor allows him to disrespect gaps better than any char and also be able to do wakeup with specials even if he does delay WU. I took one point off because, again, he's heavily reliant on single hit specials and MBB3 just disrespects that.

Damage output: 3.5/5

This score probably seems odd since Bane has astronomical combo damage, especially with bounce cancels, but watch extended play of any Bane and you'll see that he rarely lands them. His primary combo starters are 11, B23 and B11. All of these have bad range and are 9f (high), 18f and 17f startup respectively. Most of Bane's damage comes from landing his armored specials. The risk/reward of that is heavily skewed against Bane, though. He takes damage from the attacks he armors through, and all of his specials are super unsafe. For every 2-4 correct guesses he makes, one combo will usually equal out or surpass the damage, while also often leaving him in a mixup with debuff hanging over his head.

Score:
16.5/25
 

Fred Marvel

It's actually Freddy Marvel
He has a safe overhead and low that both lead to full combo.

He has several ambiguous cross up setups.

His mixups are not 2/5. Quit downplaying
what overhead? his 28 frame f3? and either delay wake up or use a wake up with invincibility. at best his mixups are 3/5 but even if they were 4/5 he'd still be like 15 out of 25.

Defensive Options 4/5
Between Wall, poke (once they respect wall), and delay wakeup, I feel this is a point that is frequently underplayed.
gL has a 7 frame mid d1, 1 stuffable wakeup, and the worst backdash in the game but 4/5 for defensive options? his mb roll has a ton of startup too so how? im so confused at how you guys say im wrong but agree with this?

and im not downplaying i think Red Hood is a 20 out of 25
and great. green lantern just isnt good. he got nerfed more than batman superman and aquaman did and he was a lot worse than them in the first game.
 

tafka Djinn

One for three off the roof
gL has a 7 frame mid d1, 1 stuffable wakeup, and the worst backdash in the game but 4/5 for defensive options? his mb roll has a ton of startup too so how? im so confused at how you guys say im wrong but agree with this?

and im not downplaying i think Red Hood is a 20 out of 25
and great. green lantern just isnt good. he got nerfed more than batman superman and aquaman did and he was a lot worse than them in the first game.
If anything I might be willing to see it argued that his defense is a 3, but my honest evaluation puts him at 4 because he wakes up better than about half the cast.
If anything, consider that scoring within context of coming from playing Poison Ivy before him and just notch it down mentally to counteract the sheer force of the optimism that gave me on defense.

Green Lantern is still good in my personal opinion, not one of the nine I would consider viable as a solo main mind you, but still mid to upper mid. Also compared to Batman and Aquaman pretty much every character is bad.
 
BANE:

50/50 mix-ups and or pressure: 4/5

Tick throws off of 3 strings and several normals. Trait gives him armor on all specials and armor break on lvl 3. He's got a low launching string and for 2 bars can turn his armored, armor-breaking overhead (which also ticks into command grab) into a launcher. Took a point off because most of his stuff has poor range and is comically slow/unsafe. He's also neutered quite a bit by MBB3's.

Zoning and anti-zoning:
2/5

No projectiles. Very limited movement with slow, stubby strings and normals, a floaty jump and a slow recovering dash. All he has is MB roll and a 33f startup charge that can be easily MBB3'd on reaction. I gave him 2 pts because he has gdlk walk speed, a full screen super and can move through projectiles with F2 cancels at lvl 3 venom.

Neutral game and footsies:
3/5

Bane has little full screen presence and is often out ranged up close. Fastest normals are a 9f high and 11f D1; he relies on these for the bulk of his neutral, in addition to his trait armored specials. His offense opens up after landing D1 (low/OH/cmd grab mixup) but is easily avoidable with backdash, as D1 frame traps require incredibly strict timing. The high volume of unthrowable normals, strings and specials neuters command grab. All of Bane's specials, in addition to being super unsafe, are single hit, so MBB3's bodies his armor.

Defensive options:
4/5

Venom uppercut has fast startup, very good horizontal/vertical range, a wide hitbox that extends behind Bane and autocorrects. Block to bait it and you eat command grab. In the neutral, he has an air grab with a giant horizontal hitbox (catches CW j2 from far af) and his frame 1 armor allows him to disrespect gaps better than any char and also be able to do wakeup with specials even if he does delay WU. I took one point off because, again, he's heavily reliant on single hit specials and MBB3 just disrespects that.

Damage output: 3.5/5

This score probably seems odd since Bane has astronomical combo damage, especially with bounce cancels, but watch extended play of any Bane and you'll see that he rarely lands them. His primary combo starters are 11, B23 and B11. All of these have bad range and are 9f (high), 18f and 17f startup respectively. Most of Bane's damage comes from landing his armored specials. The risk/reward of that is heavily skewed against Bane, though. He takes damage from the attacks he armors through, and all of his specials are super unsafe. For every 2-4 correct guesses he makes, one combo will usually equal out or surpass the damage, while also often leaving him in a mixup with debuff hanging over his head.

Score:
16.5/25

Pretty accurate. Hard as fuck for him to whiff punish with anything other than D1 because his normals are slow and/or have terrible range. He's like a stump locked in position on every string except b23 which is really slow.

His specials are unsafe and easily full combo punished by everyone. He can't meter burn any of them for anything other than a bit of extra damage or a side switch.
 

SaSSolino

Soul Stealing Loyalist
I gave superman 5/5 for zoning/counter zoning because although he isn't the best zoner, his aerial mobility, angle d3, and the ability to use projectiles both in the air and on the ground make him an exceptional counter zoner.

To put his neutral as anything less than 5/5 seems disingenuous to me. If you're gonna give black adam a 5/5 in neutral, you have to give superman one too.
I completely agree, and to be honest Superman's pressure + corner mixups is at least 4/5.

BANE:

50/50 mix-ups and or pressure: 4/5

Tick throws off of 3 strings and several normals. Trait gives him armor on all specials and armor break on lvl 3. He's got a low launching string and for 2 bars can turn his armored, armor-breaking overhead (which also ticks into command grab) into a launcher. Took a point off because most of his stuff has poor range and is comically slow/unsafe. He's also neutered quite a bit by MBB3's.

Zoning and anti-zoning:
2/5

No projectiles. Very limited movement with slow, stubby strings and normals, a floaty jump and a slow recovering dash. All he has is MB roll and a 33f startup charge that can be easily MBB3'd on reaction. I gave him 2 pts because he has gdlk walk speed, a full screen super and can move through projectiles with F2 cancels at lvl 3 venom.

Neutral game and footsies:
3/5

Bane has little full screen presence and is often out ranged up close. Fastest normals are a 9f high and 11f D1; he relies on these for the bulk of his neutral, in addition to his trait armored specials. His offense opens up after landing D1 (low/OH/cmd grab mixup) but is easily avoidable with backdash, as D1 frame traps require incredibly strict timing. The high volume of unthrowable normals, strings and specials neuters command grab. All of Bane's specials, in addition to being super unsafe, are single hit, so MBB3's bodies his armor.

Defensive options:
4/5

Venom uppercut has fast startup, very good horizontal/vertical range, a wide hitbox that extends behind Bane and autocorrects. Block to bait it and you eat command grab. In the neutral, he has an air grab with a giant horizontal hitbox (catches CW j2 from far af) and his frame 1 armor allows him to disrespect gaps better than any char and also be able to do wakeup with specials even if he does delay WU. I took one point off because, again, he's heavily reliant on single hit specials and MBB3 just disrespects that.

Damage output: 3.5/5

This score probably seems odd since Bane has astronomical combo damage, especially with bounce cancels, but watch extended play of any Bane and you'll see that he rarely lands them. His primary combo starters are 11, B23 and B11. All of these have bad range and are 9f (high), 18f and 17f startup respectively. Most of Bane's damage comes from landing his armored specials. The risk/reward of that is heavily skewed against Bane, though. He takes damage from the attacks he armors through, and all of his specials are super unsafe. For every 2-4 correct guesses he makes, one combo will usually equal out or surpass the damage, while also often leaving him in a mixup with debuff hanging over his head.

Score:
16.5/25
How does he not have 5/5 in mixups? I mean, everything else is arguable, but that really isn't.
 

Jowabunga

Woooooooooooooo!
Really enjoying this thread - it's giving me a lot of context on characters I haven't tried yet.

Also, a friend of mine mains Aquaman and downplays him constantly so I've enjoyed showing him the couple "broken af" reviews here. Keep 'em coming fishy peeps. :D
 

EntropicByDesign

It's all so very confusing.
I know this going way out on a limb here but had anyone taken into account that some people aren't downplaying they just a different opinion than others?

This system isn't scientific, it's open to an individuals determination. Like myself, I rate damage and defense a little differently than some people. I consider damage to be how fast a character typically ends average rounds and when looking at defense I factor in that characters meter usage and need of meter for other things , because excess meter to me, equates to more ably making use of the games universal defense mechanics.

I'm not defending everything I've seen in this thread, just that not *everyone* is downplaying. Some people just rate things by different standards or consider things differently.
 

B. Shazzy

NRS shill #42069
the honest catwoman rating


1. 50/50 mix ups and/or pressure (5/5) – Spam fullscreen mids and "hitconfirm"with plus on block launchers cat stance. pretty much none of my buttons are unsafe, serveral overheads and lows, meterless launchers and good staggers best throw range

2. Zoning and anti-zoning (5/5) – spam evade and build scratches and meter for free wakeup or free billion damage combo. spam j2, low profiling whip trip or random b3 from midscreen and random Catdash MB from fullscreen that is needlessly awkward to punish and only -8 oh and since i have a low hurtbox some jabs whiff lul gdlk man

3. Neutral game and footsies (5/5) – pretty easy to look like i have footsies with fullscreen jumpins a chatacter hat is actually unantiairable, my ridiculous walkspeed, halfscreen mids with zero recovery, and halfscreen low whip trip. dont pretend like you dont want to mash j2 24/7 to get in and random B3 when im getting outfootsied and all else fails

4. Defensive options (5/5) – wakeup with one button fully invincible options i can make plus on block with meter. passive ability of small hurtbox. Mash D1 or mash random B3 because it lowprofiles literally everything. dont even have to mb b3 just do it, 6f normals and best backdash in the game jump back 2 nobody can chase

5. Damage output (4/5) – not the best because the bar is pretty high but not supergirl status either and gets like 50% with full trait anyway lul


24/25 prob top 5 and 2nd scrubbiest character in the game behind atrocitus
 
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Jowabunga

Woooooooooooooo!
There's subjectivity, but there's also a degree of relativity. When your opinion drastically differs from that of others who spend just as much if not more time with the character than you do, you're either onto something or don't really understand the full picture, OR you're intentionally skewing the perspective. I think comments like "Aquaman is really weak at zoning" and similar things make it pretty clear which scenario we're looking at here. :p
 

Tweedy

Noob
I gave superman 5/5 for zoning/counter zoning because although he isn't the best zoner, his aerial mobility, angle d3, and the ability to use projectiles both in the air and on the ground make him an exceptional counter zoner.

To put his neutral as anything less than 5/5 seems disingenuous to me. If you're gonna give black adam a 5/5 in neutral, you have to give superman one too.
Black Adam has better anti airs, better recovery on his advancing strings and black magic allows him to punish moves from a range Superman cannot. Plus divekick.

There are match ups where Superman just gets zoned and has to go in or get a really nice life lead. I can't put him at a 5 in zoning for that reason.
 

EMPRESS_SunFire

Regina George of discord
the honest catwoman rating


1. 50/50 mix ups and/or pressure (5/5) – Spam fullscreen mids and "hitconfirm"with plus on block launchers cat stance. pretty much none of my buttons are unsafe, serveral overheads and lows, meterless launchers and good staggers best throw range

2. Zoning and anti-zoning (5/5) – spam evade and build scratches and meter for free wakeup or free billion damage combo. spam j2, low profiling whip trip or random b3 from midscreen and random Catdash MB from fullscreen that is needlessly awkward to punish and only -8 oh and since i have a low hurtbox some jabs whiff lul gdlk man

3. Neutral game and footsies (5/5) – pretty easy to look like i have footsies with fullscreen jumpins a chatacter hat is actually unantiairable, my ridiculous walkspeed, halfscreen mids with zero recovery, and whip halfscreen low whip trip. do random B3 when im getting outfootsied and all else fails

4. Defensive options (5/5) – wakeup with one button fully invincible options i can make plus on block with meter. passive ability of small hurtbox. Mash D1 or mash random B3 because it lowprofiles literally everything. dont even have to mb b3 just do it, 6f normals and best backdash in the game jump back 2 nobody can chase

5. Damage output (4/5) – not the best because the bar is pretty high but not supergirl status either and gets like 50% with full trait anyway lul


24/25 prob top 5 and 2nd scrubbiest character in the game behind atrocitus
Make one for your characters please, would love to see them lul...
Specially Batman
 

Scoot Magee

But I didn't want to dash
the honest catwoman rating


1. 50/50 mix ups and/or pressure (5/5) – Spam fullscreen mids and "hitconfirm"with plus on block launchers cat stance. pretty much none of my buttons are unsafe, serveral overheads and lows, meterless launchers and good staggers best throw range

2. Zoning and anti-zoning (5/5) – spam evade and build scratches and meter for free wakeup or free billion damage combo. spam j2, low profiling whip trip or random b3 from midscreen and random Catdash MB from fullscreen that is needlessly awkward to punish and only -8 oh and since i have a low hurtbox some jabs whiff lul gdlk man

3. Neutral game and footsies (5/5) – pretty easy to look like i have footsies with fullscreen jumpins a chatacter hat is actually unantiairable, my ridiculous walkspeed, halfscreen mids with zero recovery, and halfscreen low whip trip. do pretend like uou dont want to mash j2 24/7 to get in and random B3 when im getting outfootsied and all else fails

4. Defensive options (5/5) – wakeup with one button fully invincible options i can make plus on block with meter. passive ability of small hurtbox. Mash D1 or mash random B3 because it lowprofiles literally everything. dont even have to mb b3 just do it, 6f normals and best backdash in the game jump back 2 nobody can chase

5. Damage output (4/5) – not the best because the bar is pretty high but not supergirl status either and gets like 50% with full trait anyway lul


24/25 prob top 5 and 2nd scrubbiest character in the game behind atrocitus
nah bro, deadshot. just playing man

JK

Alt controls suck btw. Thanks for storing my directions for dashes.

Yo hows that "godlike" netcode everyone is talking about working out when trying to punish MB catdash? 6 frames native lag plus online lol.
 
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DubiousShenron

Beware my power.
Black Adam has better anti airs, better recovery on his advancing strings and black magic allows him to punish moves from a range Superman cannot. Plus divekick.

There are match ups where Superman just gets zoned and has to go in or get a really nice life lead. I can't put him at a 5 in zoning for that reason.
*Downplay Your Character (Injustice 2 Edition)