If there was one more patch...

SaSSolino · Mar 29, 2017

Dankster Morgan said:
Acidic Alien is definitely better than any of Lao's variations. I'd put Cage over Lao but the rest are definitely arguable.

You are right about Acidic, to be honest for me Alien is the egg one, which is the only one I play. Cage is stronger than Lao in A-List, but the new cancels make him unreliable and personally I prefer consistency over power, but I can see your point.

Eldriken said:
Did Kotal really drop THAT much due to the change to b1 and losing his armored launcher? What the...

In my opinion, yes. He has to abuse his d1 to be respected now, which acually sucks even by a design standpoint.

War God lost his armored launcher, but with a his mid b1 he could have survived.

Blood God and his totem nerf were a little more drastic, but also losing his mid b1 really bodied him.

Sun God survived as I think he got buffed as well in the patch, besides this variation always used his d1 just as much as his b1, if not more.

I never was anything more than an occasional KK player, but Paulo really fucked up with this one.

RevetLeafing · Mar 29, 2017

JGillette said:
I'd like it too but with ex spinning kick that would be a bit broken

And @RevetLeafing
You had shared a video showing how ridiculous the damage scaling with teleport is with 1,1 u4 teleport, j3 teleport and xray, could you upload here as well please? Because it must be seen how unlogical the extending combos with teleport has become

This game has about 2 more months to live, I will miss Tanya and I'll still be playing mkx A LOT while inj 2 is out. There will always be something there for her

Eddy Wang · Mar 29, 2017

NeroOps said:
He's still a overall good character hes not complete shit unlike the characters i mentioned who suffer a lot more than he does in a lot of match ups.

He still is good just because he isn't cheap don't mean hes ass.

Lao isn't that great either, many other characters have strengths where he has obvious weakness
No wakeup
bad buttons
poor hitbox on spin
poor frame traps
wacky backdash and walkback speed.
bad strings in general
bad J2 which even whiffs on crouching characters, pretty hard to use
uneeded nerf on s1

While Hat Spin and Hat Grinder can mask some of the neutral weakness by ending anything bad with them to make him look good, KL can't defend himself much from characters who approach as fast as Cassie, Kotal etc.
And Hat Trick who can't mask his strings with anything ends up being worse, as a variation only played by a few.

He falls and he is done
Before ex spin was really a god send, since it conditioned ppl to watch out to when or where to press buttons, which in turn would gave him a sort of mental frame advantage, and a good wakeup option.

This is gone, and left a pretty big hole on his gameplay imo, NRS could easily fix this by giving him a better backdash, and a better walkback speed, this would compensate for his lack of defensive armor with being able to be even more mobile while on the ground, and easily space normals, and mixups while he is standing.

Hat Trick since its the weakest and he is even more minus than the rest, reducing 5 frames on all his frame traps would make his combos more easier to pull off, he would be at -1 at the best on neutral instead of -6 at best or worse which makes him wide open anything, it would frame trap 11f mids with a call back or jab, giving him the mental frame trap and his call back should also be reduced to -5 instead of -7 giving him +8 frame traps in the corner

KL doesn't need more special moves or super crazy changes like a new low combo starter or faster overheads starters or safer, in general i think the fewer things he needs is walkback speed buff, and backdash buff, this would buff, tempest and buzzsaw neutral, and hat tricks specific buffs would make him on par with the rest and have 3 competitive and viable variations, along with the things @REO already put as suggestion. Without forcing KL to jump all day to bait moves with dive kicks,, spacing or teleport for random reasons.

So the issue its not really he being free on wakeup, its the work he has to put on to not get knocked down, its just not fair compared to the less risks most of the cast takes to win and many of them still have a reliable wakeup, KL is lacking in both departments which makes him kinda weak and not really worth the effort since mostly everyone even if not as good at least they either need to work less or have a better wakeup...

just my 2cents.

GOOD DRAGON · Mar 29, 2017

Eddy Wang said:
Lao isn't that great either, many other characters have strengths where he has obvious weakness
No wakeup
bad buttons
poor hitbox on spin
poor frame traps
wacky backdash and walkback speed.
bad strings in general
bad J2 which even whiffs on crouching characters, pretty hard to use
uneeded nerf on s1

While Hat Spin and Hat Grinder can mask some of the neutral weakness by ending anything bad with them to make him look good, KL can't defend himself much from characters who approach as fast as Cassie, Kotal etc.
And Hat Trick who can't mask his strings with anything ends up being worse, as a variation only played by a few.

He falls and he is done
Before ex spin was really a god send, since it conditioned ppl to watch out to when or where to press buttons, which in turn would gave him a sort of mental frame advantage, and a good wakeup option.

This is gone, and left a pretty big hole on his gameplay imo, NRS could easily fix this by giving him a better backdash, and a better walkback speed, this would compensate for his lack of defensive armor with being able to be even more mobile while on the ground, and easily space normals, and mixups while he is standing.

Hat Trick since its the weakest and he is even more minus than the rest, reducing 5 frames on all his frame traps would make his combos more easier to pull off, he would be at -1 at the best on neutral instead of -6 at best or worse which makes him wide open anything, it would frame trap 11f mids with a call back or jab, giving him the mental frame trap and his call back should also be reduced to -5 instead of -7 giving him +8 frame traps in the corner

KL doesn't need more special moves or super crazy changes like a new low combo starter or faster overheads starters or safer, in general i think the fewer things he needs is walkback speed buff, and backdash buff, this would buff, tempest and buzzsaw neutral, and hat tricks specific buffs would make him on par with the rest and have 3 competitive and viable variations, along with the things @REO already put as suggestion. Without forcing KL to jump all day to bait moves with dive kicks,, spacing or teleport for random reasons.

So the issue its not really he being free on wakeup, its the work he has to put on to not get knocked down, its just not fair compared to the less risks most of the cast takes to win and many of them still have a reliable wakeup, KL is lacking in both departments which makes him kinda weak and not really worth the effort since mostly everyone even if not as good at least they either need to work less or have a better wakeup...

just my 2cents.

No wake up? What about his tele? isn't it invincible with armour?

LaidbackOne · Mar 29, 2017

GOOD DRAGON said:
No wake up? What about his tele? isn't it invincible with armour?

It has armor but the tracking on this move is terrible = Lao just spent 1/2 bars and got punished for it, lol.

Eddy Wang · Mar 29, 2017

GOOD DRAGON said:
No wake up? What about his tele? isn't it invincible with armour?

It has armor but its not invincible, armor its only on on startup, when he emerge from the other side its just as bad as his regular teleport.
It also very unreliable, can be be beaten by meaties, hard to use as a wakeup
advancing strings avoid it wasting meter he could use to do damage
easily baited out
followups aren't even reliable at all
tp4 is duckable
tp2 is duckable if there is a 1f delay or more
tp3 its duckable and combo punishable by some on block

In sum, if you don't want your tele ducked, then you have to yolo your ass out at the cost of meter, if they block the tele, GG, and if you delay, tp2 becomes duckable due the height and the hat hitbox nerf, so GG as well, and in the same height, dp3 becomes duckable as well.

KL TP is only good to react to projectiles fullscreen mostly.

GOOD DRAGON · Mar 29, 2017

LaidbackOne said:
It has armor but the tracking on this move is terrible = Lao just spent 1/2 bars and got punished for it, lol.

So the statement - he has no wake up is incorrect then? Its more like his wake up is terrible.

I mean all things considered a lot of people have terrible wake ups its still better that jax, blood god, pred, smoke e.t.c. where you can just press buttons and beat it or duck and negate it

Eddy Wang · Mar 29, 2017

GOOD DRAGON said:
So the statement - he has no wake up is incorrect then? Its more like his wake up is terrible.

I mean all things considered a lot of people have terrible wake ups its still better that jax, blood god, pred, smoke e.t.c. where you can just press buttons and beat it or duck and negate it

His wakeup is terrible so he has none, there is no point in using ex tp as wakeup since it doesn't work at all.

GOOD DRAGON · Mar 29, 2017

Eddy Wang said:
His wakeup is terrible so he has none, there is no point in using ex tp as wakeup since it doesn't work at all.

I see what about tp1? But you can also delay it as well so you don't emerge straight away.
In my opinion its still better than wake ups you can just straight up duck like jax and johnny's or keep pressing buttons and ignore completely like pred's. Plus it still gives you the option to launch for 40+%

If you don't want it give it to jax

we'll gladly take it off your hands

Eddy Wang · Mar 29, 2017

GOOD DRAGON said:
I see what about tp1? But you can also delay it as well so you don't emerge straight away.
In my opinion its still better than wake ups you can just straight up duck like jax and johnny's or keep pressing buttons and ignore completely like pred's. Plus it still gives you the option to launch for 40+%

If you don't want it give it to jax we'll gladly take it off your hands

Tp1 is duckable
Delay a wakeup won't track either, and makes you more vulnerable to getting jabbed out when you KL surfaces, its just a matter of picking any variation of KL and play it.

There is no difference between TP and those wakeup you mentioned, you can d1 on wakeup, and if you don't catch him on meaty you will catch him when he emerges since he has no armor when he does, its not a mixup either, its just bad.

high armored wakeups still work if someone its not trying to bait you, KL doesn't.

Pan1cMode · Mar 29, 2017

Zionix said:
Who said anything about converting? Cage isn't safe on his only use-able mid, so no it's not hilarious, its frustrating. Thats why I made the change, call it a buff if you wish but that string should not be -12 with the changes to stamina. Is jacqui -12 with no safe special from her only mid string? No..., yeah didn't think so.

Tri-borg is 4 different characters, no matter how you spin it, so using that to prove a point is a weak effort.

I also nerfed smoke and sektor, but you probably didn't notice crying over hi-tech.

At least suggest 'logical' buffs to high tech without making her stupid because if you ask me, its just hard to balance that variation.

Well, no one asked you because you obviously don't know anything about high tech.

And yeah, you could have read the Jacqui changes I suggested which are both logical and fair.

You also may have suggested nerfs to smoke and sektor, but none that would affect cyrax and cyber sub. This is because you understand that one good variation doesn't mean universal tools should be nerfed.

Comparing Jacqui's lol-range strings to Cage's knee also seems a bit disingenuous.

Tell you what, you play high tech and tell me how viable and deserving of nerfs she is.

NeroOps · Mar 29, 2017

Eddy Wang said:
Lao isn't that great either, many other characters have strengths where he has obvious weakness
No wakeup
bad buttons
poor hitbox on spin
poor frame traps
wacky backdash and walkback speed.
bad strings in general
bad J2 which even whiffs on crouching characters, pretty hard to use
uneeded nerf on s1

While Hat Spin and Hat Grinder can mask some of the neutral weakness by ending anything bad with them to make him look good, KL can't defend himself much from characters who approach as fast as Cassie, Kotal etc.
And Hat Trick who can't mask his strings with anything ends up being worse, as a variation only played by a few.

He falls and he is done
Before ex spin was really a god send, since it conditioned ppl to watch out to when or where to press buttons, which in turn would gave him a sort of mental frame advantage, and a good wakeup option.

This is gone, and left a pretty big hole on his gameplay imo, NRS could easily fix this by giving him a better backdash, and a better walkback speed, this would compensate for his lack of defensive armor with being able to be even more mobile while on the ground, and easily space normals, and mixups while he is standing.

Hat Trick since its the weakest and he is even more minus than the rest, reducing 5 frames on all his frame traps would make his combos more easier to pull off, he would be at -1 at the best on neutral instead of -6 at best or worse which makes him wide open anything, it would frame trap 11f mids with a call back or jab, giving him the mental frame trap and his call back should also be reduced to -5 instead of -7 giving him +8 frame traps in the corner

KL doesn't need more special moves or super crazy changes like a new low combo starter or faster overheads starters or safer, in general i think the fewer things he needs is walkback speed buff, and backdash buff, this would buff, tempest and buzzsaw neutral, and hat tricks specific buffs would make him on par with the rest and have 3 competitive and viable variations, along with the things @REO already put as suggestion. Without forcing KL to jump all day to bait moves with dive kicks,, spacing or teleport for random reasons.

So the issue its not really he being free on wakeup, its the work he has to put on to not get knocked down, its just not fair compared to the less risks most of the cast takes to win and many of them still have a reliable wakeup, KL is lacking in both departments which makes him kinda weak and not really worth the effort since mostly everyone even if not as good at least they either need to work less or have a better wakeup...

just my 2cents.

Co-Sonya has worse wake up options then Lao so whats your point her ex arrow kick can be whiffed just by ducking and her ex leg grab can be stopped as well especially when she fight against Mileena and i shouldn't even mention how bad her ex parry is. She has no wake up option against that psychotic bitch. A lot characters ex moves can be stopped if you attack at the right timing during the first frame if thats what you're referring too by not having a good wake up option.
Sonya has a bad J2 i don't see your point in that either. Bad buttons i wouldn't know about because i don't use Lao. Why am i comparing them because i do pretty damn well with Co-Sonya and that variation has many gaps in her setups which means she has fake pressure. Should i also mention people consider it her worse variation.
Everything you mention i just don't see how that makes Lao shit just because he don't do well in a couple of variation match ups which every character has. Like i said i would recommend him before any of the characters i mentioned.

RequiemOfaVortex · Mar 29, 2017

NeroOps said:
Co-Sonya has worse wake up options then Lao so whats your point her ex arrow kick can be whiffed just by ducking and her ex leg grab can be stopped as well especially when she fight against Mileena and i shouldn't even mention how bad her ex parry is. She has no wake up option against that psychotic bitch. A lot characters ex moves can be stopped if you attack at the right timing during the first frame if thats what you're referring too by not having a good wake up option.
Sonya has a bad J2 i don't see your point in that either. Bad buttons i wouldn't know about because i don't use Lao. Why am i comparing them because i do pretty damn well with Co-Sonya and that variation has many gaps in her setups which means she has fake pressure. Should i also mention people consider it her worse variation.
Everything you mention i just don't see how that makes Lao shit just because he don't do well in a couple of variation match ups which every character has. Like i said i would recommend him before any of the characters i mentioned.

what does this have to do with the patch notes reo posted, Secondly... Sonya has much better armor than lao its granted it not ex push but she can still armor threw gaps and some meatys on wake up lastly why do you keep bringing up Sonya side note she has a bad J2 dafaq you have a auto correcting dive kick and J1

LaidbackOne · Mar 29, 2017

NeroOps said:
Co-Sonya has worse wake up options then Lao so whats your point her ex arrow kick can be whiffed just by ducking and her ex leg grab can be stopped as well especially when she fight against Mileena and i shouldn't even mention how bad her ex parry is. She has no wake up option against that psychotic bitch. A lot characters ex moves can be stopped if you attack at the right timing during the first frame if thats what you're referring too by not having a good wake up option.
Sonya has a bad J2 i don't see your point in that either. Bad buttons i wouldn't know about because i don't use Lao. Why am i comparing them because i do pretty damn well with Co-Sonya and that variation has many gaps in her setups which means she has fake pressure. Should i also mention people consider it her worse variation.
Everything you mention i just don't see how that makes Lao shit just because he don't do well in a couple of variation match ups which every character has. Like i said i would recommend him before any of the characters i mentioned.

You should stop at this point. Unless you want to make even more of a fool of yourself

GOOD DRAGON · Mar 29, 2017

LaidbackOne said:
You should stop at this point. Unless you want to make even more of a fool of yourself

Maybe this is the problem with TYM stop high horsing and creating a band wagon for everyone else to jump on and take the piss. If he genuinely doesn't know better then explain to him why its not so. More productive no?

LaidbackOne · Mar 29, 2017

GOOD DRAGON said:
Maybe this is the problem with TYM stop high horsing and creating a band wagon for everyone else to jump on and take the piss. If he genuinely doesn't know better then explain to him why its not so. More productive no?

You see, the thing here is that the guy is already not listening to arguments which have been given to him.
Normal people don't go to a forum, start posting bullshit about stuff they obviously know nothing about and act like they do.
If he was seeking knowledge, I wouldn't critisise anything about what he wrote, that's what forums like theese are for (IMO) but there is a big difference here.
Anyway, keep blaming TYM.

Eddy Wang · Mar 29, 2017

NeroOps said:
Co-Sonya has worse wake up options then Lao

Not true, besides Sonya has 2 armored wakeups and both are immediate hits with armor, one hits mid and if not respected ensures respect from relentless attackers.

NeroOps said:
so whats your point her ex arrow kick can be whiffed just by ducking and her ex leg grab can be stopped as well especially when she fight against Mileena

Although, Mileena has a very small hitbox which makes her harder to fight against the entire cast, ex bf4 is 100 times better than KL ex tp, which i and many people here have mentioned before that it has a bad tracking and its not an immediate hit with armor as most armored attacks in the game.

NeroOps said:
and i shouldn't even mention how bad her ex parry is. She has no wake up option against that psychotic bitch. A lot characters ex moves can be stopped if you attack at the right timing during the first frame if thats what you're referring too by not having a good wake up option.

Lots of salt against mileena, i don't understand how lao fits into this but okay, i'll play ball, while all wakeup ups are subjective to meaties, lao only wakeup starts with "Down" input which still creates a bigger issue due sharing inputs with the delayed wakeup system.

NeroOps said:
Sonya has a bad J2 i don't see your point in that either. Bad buttons i wouldn't know about because i don't use Lao.

You said yourself, you don't play Lao, so you don't know what you're talking about, Lao J2 has been overnerfed, now it causes issues because the hat hitbox is shorter than the hat, so either the move will not come out and lao will touch the ground without using it, or it will whiff and won't even hit crouching characters, don't believe me? fine, this video speaks for itself.

NeroOps said:
Why am i comparing them because i do pretty damn well with Co-Sonya and that variation has many gaps in her setups which means she has fake pressure. Should i also mention people consider it her worse variation.

Covert Ops is a setup variation, that's new to me. Covert Ops has gaps on her pressure, but its not fake, and not in the slightest her worse variation, i personally think its way better than Special Forces, since it has its own launchers, better neutral game and its effectiveness its not binded to moves that requires to be out (drone) in order to be fearless.

NeroOps said:
Everything you mention i just don't see how that makes Lao shit just because he don't do well in a couple of variation match ups which every character has. Like i said i would recommend him before any of the characters i mentioned.

I said before Lao is weak both in neutral and wakeup, some of these characters are not, and definitely not Sonya who is a monster in neutral with a oh and Low combo starters and still has a better wakeup, walkspeed in general than Lao itself, and i don't remember of myself saying "lets buff Lao's wakeup game" all i said, "if there is a weakness to be eliminated in Lao's game, its to make him get better rewards while playing neutral, his wakeup can stay just the same" in case some ppl are having troubles following.

GOOD DRAGON · Mar 29, 2017

LaidbackOne said:
You see, the thing here is that the guy is already not listening to arguments which have been given to him.
Normal people don't go to a forum, start posting bullshit about stuff they obviously know nothing about and act like they do.
If he was seeking knowledge, I wouldn't critisise anything about what he wrote, that's what forums like theese are for (IMO) but there is a big difference here.
Anyway, keep blaming TYM.

Fair enough.

Who else would i blame apart from tym? Who makes up tym, us no?
We are tym as a collective.... so... ye tym you are to blame..... For putting people off, starting a bang wagon against 1 person which in some cases could be considered bullying (even tho some people don't help their case), thinking you know better, over complainers, childish self entitlement i mean we are all to blame especially if you see it happening and don't say anything so ye just an observation. What was that M.J song about change again..!?

A F0xy Grampa · Mar 29, 2017

id take those Mileena nerfs if she has a mid b12 in piercing

Also any change to make the window larger to punish people mashing back to back play pokes.

Would also make it so pokes aren't special cancellable

@Eddy Wang i wouldn't say Lao is weak in neutral. At least in buzzsaw and tempest he's got some of the best screen and pace control of anybody in the game. It's just that he doesn't have a high reward low risk potato style.
I can't really think of many characters that truly outclass Lao in neutral.

NeroOps · Mar 29, 2017

RequiemOfaVortex said:
what does this have to do with the patch notes reo posted, Secondly... Sonya has much better armor than lao its granted it not ex push but she can still armor threw gaps and some meatys on wake up lastly why do you keep bringing up Sonya side note she has a bad J2 dafaq you have a auto correcting dive kick and J1

I was responding to what eddy wong had mention about Lao faults. I guess you expect me not to answer someone when they reply to me. All you're doing is replying to me to try to get me to shut up because you can't give me agreeable reasoning of anything you have said accept right now about Sonya having better armor than Lao when it comes to her ex leg grab but its still shit like the example i have given if you actually read what i said. His ex spin really isn't that bad as you make it seem to be. I brought up Co-Sonya because she struggles in many match ups and i stated how i can do pretty damn good with her when that variation has many faults but y'all act like Lao is the worse character in the game. You keep saying that hes not but in your mind and the way you describe him as you believe that he is. In your mind if the character isn't high tier broken tier or let me just make it simple for you fucking cheap the character is ass. You put the character in the right hands its been proven many times that a low/mid tier character can do well.

All you keep saying name 5 characters thats worse than Lao overall i gave you 5. Other people in this forum have gave you 5 as well so shut the fuck up already.

LaidbackOne said:
You should stop at this point. Unless you want to make even more of a fool of yourself

I'm not making a fool of myself if i'm stating facts.

CrazyFingers · Mar 29, 2017

GOOD DRAGON said:
Fair enough.

Who else would i blame apart from tym? Who makes up tym, us no?
We are tym as a collective.... so... ye tym you are to blame..... For putting people off, starting a bang wagon against 1 person which in some cases could be considered bullying (even tho some people don't help their case), thinking you know better, over complainers, childish self entitlement i mean we are all to blame especially if you see it happening and don't say anything so ye just an observation. What was that M.J song about change again..!?

Maybe blame the specific people doing it instead of putting the entirety of the site under an umbrella?

GOOD DRAGON · Mar 29, 2017

CrazyFingers said:
Maybe blame the specific people doing it instead of putting the entirety of the site under an umbrella?

Naaaaaaaa mate, don't dodge embrace the blame. You are especially to blame - because i said so

A F0xy Grampa · Mar 29, 2017

Eddy Wang said:
Lao isn't that great either, many other characters have strengths where he has obvious weakness
No wakeup
bad buttons
poor hitbox on spin
poor frame traps
wacky backdash and walkback speed.
bad strings in general
bad J2 which even whiffs on crouching characters, pretty hard to use
uneeded nerf on s1

While Hat Spin and Hat Grinder can mask some of the neutral weakness by ending anything bad with them to make him look good, KL can't defend himself much from characters who approach as fast as Cassie, Kotal etc.
And Hat Trick who can't mask his strings with anything ends up being worse, as a variation only played by a few.

He falls and he is done
Before ex spin was really a god send, since it conditioned ppl to watch out to when or where to press buttons, which in turn would gave him a sort of mental frame advantage, and a good wakeup option.

This is gone, and left a pretty big hole on his gameplay imo, NRS could easily fix this by giving him a better backdash, and a better walkback speed, this would compensate for his lack of defensive armor with being able to be even more mobile while on the ground, and easily space normals, and mixups while he is standing.

Hat Trick since its the weakest and he is even more minus than the rest, reducing 5 frames on all his frame traps would make his combos more easier to pull off, he would be at -1 at the best on neutral instead of -6 at best or worse which makes him wide open anything, it would frame trap 11f mids with a call back or jab, giving him the mental frame trap and his call back should also be reduced to -5 instead of -7 giving him +8 frame traps in the corner

KL doesn't need more special moves or super crazy changes like a new low combo starter or faster overheads starters or safer, in general i think the fewer things he needs is walkback speed buff, and backdash buff, this would buff, tempest and buzzsaw neutral, and hat tricks specific buffs would make him on par with the rest and have 3 competitive and viable variations, along with the things @REO already put as suggestion. Without forcing KL to jump all day to bait moves with dive kicks,, spacing or teleport for random reasons.

So the issue its not really he being free on wakeup, its the work he has to put on to not get knocked down, its just not fair compared to the less risks most of the cast takes to win and many of them still have a reliable wakeup, KL is lacking in both departments which makes him kinda weak and not really worth the effort since mostly everyone even if not as good at least they either need to work less or have a better wakeup...

just my 2cents.

You're ignoring the fact that Lao has a corner game that's arguably as smothering as GM sub zero, and he doesn't need a better wakeup, it's not like ex tele doesn't function.

I don't know why you feel the need to jump with him either. His ground game is as strong as a character like Cage or Cassie.

And where you use characters like Kotal and Cassie coming in on the ground, Lao has moves the same speed as theirs, and a longer range d4, although slower, also orbit hat completely changes the dynamic. It forces people to react in some manner, it's basically like having a moving ice clone, even if people can low profile or attempt to attack straight through it you can punish those options too.

CrazyFingers · Mar 29, 2017

GOOD DRAGON said:
Naaaaaaaa mate, don't dodge embrace the blame. You are especially to blame - because i said so

Uh huh.

CrazyFingers · Mar 29, 2017

I'm happy when @A F0xy Grampa talks Lao.

If there was one more patch...

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