What's new

General/Other - Tremor Tremor General Discussion Thread

Tanno

The Fantasy is the Reality of the Mind
how many hits of armor does crystal interactable have?

Erron loses armor before he shoots the grenade, its happened to me plenty of times when I used to main him.
I see. That's a valuable info you guys got. Will need to deal against those with the X-Ray, except of Cyber and Human Sub Zero, which I wouldn't suggest touching.
 

1man3letters

Alpha Tarkatan - Moderator
Moderator
how many hits of armor does crystal interactable have?

Erron loses armor before he shoots the grenade, its happened to me plenty of times when I used to main him.
Think its 2 within a certain amount of frames like the way normal ex interactables work
 
so, guys, when i play against my mileena buddy it's literally a d1 war because i can't start any pressure without hitting him with a d1 and even then it's 1 blocked string and then we're in the same situation. even after f121 he can trade with my d1 (6f startup.)

how do you actually pressure people? do you constantly have to use 1 bar for flash parry to jail after ONE 3-hitting string to extend pressure?

'cause as far as i can tell, unless i hit them with a d1, i can't actually pressure. hopefully someone will show me the light.
 

21122

Noob
so, guys, when i play against my mileena buddy it's literally a d1 war because i can't start any pressure without hitting him with a d1 and even then it's 1 blocked string and then we're in the same situation. even after f121 he can trade with my d1 (6f startup.)

how do you actually pressure people? do you constantly have to use 1 bar for flash parry to jail after ONE 3-hitting string to extend pressure?

'cause as far as i can tell, unless i hit them with a d1, i can't actually pressure. hopefully someone will show me the light.
Well the problem is.....you see...your facing Mileena with Tremor

You can always DB2 after F121 or delay ex-DB2 to get them to stop pushing buttons.

Backdash?
 

InFlames

dead
so, guys, when i play against my mileena buddy it's literally a d1 war because i can't start any pressure without hitting him with a d1 and even then it's 1 blocked string and then we're in the same situation. even after f121 he can trade with my d1 (6f startup.)

how do you actually pressure people? do you constantly have to use 1 bar for flash parry to jail after ONE 3-hitting string to extend pressure?

'cause as far as i can tell, unless i hit them with a d1, i can't actually pressure. hopefully someone will show me the light.
Use shatter cancels and throws to catch them trying to poke
 
really, that's all? so there are no actual tools you have to deter them from doing it? backdash also won't work because buffer roll will easily catch that on reaction.

i mean if that's the only counterplay there's actually no reason to not mash d1 or buffer roll any time you can as mileena in that MU because at worst you'll take a throw as damage. if there's no actual way to get them to stop hitting buttons that just outright seems like bad design?

she has a 6f d1 so even after f121 you'll trade with her jab at best. i genuinely hope this is me overlooking some drastic design elements and tools/solutions. please tell me this isn't just the way the game works because that would actually disgust me.
 
Last edited:

M2Dave

Zoning Master
really, that's all? so there are no actual tools you have to deter them from doing it? backdash also won't work because buffer roll will easily catch that on reaction.

i mean if that's the only counterplay there's actually no reason to not mash d1 or buffer roll any time you can as mileena in that MU because at worst you'll take a throw as damage. if there's no actual way to get them to stop hitting buttons that just outright seems like bad design?

she has a 6f d1 so even after f121 you'll trade with her jab at best. i genuinely hope this is me overlooking some drastic design elements and tools/solutions. please tell me this isn't just the way the game works because that would actually disgust me.
Tremor's design has always revolved around abusing f+1,2,1 and punishing low pokes. The strategy was simple pre-patch. In Crystalline, you used to take advantage of the armor on EX low stone shatter in order to blow through low pokes. With the armor removed, you have to use a wide variety of strategies. I personally enjoy the design, which kind of reminds me of Steve's in Tekken. Both characters have phenomenal high attacks, yet they can easily be low-profiled so you have to find counter attacks.

If you still use Crystalline, which you should not because Aftershock and Metallic seem to be superior at the moment, f+1,2,1 xx delayed stone shatter trades with low pokes in your favor and leaves your opponent standing for a guaranteed f+1,2,1 follow-up. Your opponent will then resort to blocking, in which case you start doing f+1,2,1 xx stone shatter cancel into throw. Aftershock has the ability to jump back and punish low pokes with EX aerial quake for 30% of damage up close. Metallic has a more difficult time, but Lava stance rewards you with lots of damage and a reset if you make the appropriate read. Universally speaking, nothing is wrong with blocking low pokes as all of them are disadvantageous. You block them and start your own offense.

Again, I think the design is acceptable, but Crystalline was screwed in this version of the game because of the universal changes to armor attacks.
 

ShArp

Dedicated Broly main
What is the argument?
Not the laughable one you have. Crystalline's strenght wasn't about EX Low shatter alone - it was addition to already powerful tool set he had including flash parry, crystallisation, crystall summon for resets and shit. No offense Dave but when I look at myself, or lets say Tournament level players like RZA, Leoholic, KillerXinok - the difference of character understanding and the way you could use his toolsets are NIGHT and DAY between them and you. From all the videos I saw you in, you were doing same shit all over and over again - F121, F121 EX Low Shatter, repeat. Can't remember you doing a single flash parry for armored/safe jailing, mixups, reversals etc, or crystall summon for combo resets and frame traps, OR using crystall armor for letting the block away and then punishing strings after that - nothing. The most basic Tremor to date.

So when you cry about universal changes that were also aplied to Crystalline, while it still has the best tool in his arsenal - flash parry, armor, boulder, safe low regular/ex shatter + NOW faster D1, F1, B1 + on block F4, F2 etc - it makes your point of view completely "Abysmal" as actual Tremor tournament players seem to have radically different opinion on the subject.
 

YUZU_RZA

Aftershock | Crystalline | Metallic
Btw @YUZU_RZA bro, which variation you plan to use in AFK XL tournament? I'll be rooting 4u
Crystalline mainly. Aftershock against good zoning char like pyromancer, mileena ethereal or quan chi summoner. and metallic for Johnny Cage, lao & liu !

btw, dont miss Ketchup & Mustard stream tonight, I got an FT10 versus my bro St9rm at 8:30 CEST.
Let's bring some hype
 

M2Dave

Zoning Master
Not the laughable one you have. Crystalline's strenght wasn't about EX Low shatter alone - it was addition to already powerful tool set he had including flash parry, crystallisation, crystall summon for resets and shit. No offense Dave but when I look at myself, or lets say Tournament level players like RZA, Leoholic, KillerXinok - the difference of character understanding and the way you could use his toolsets are NIGHT and DAY between them and you. From all the videos I saw you in, you were doing same shit all over and over again - F121, F121 EX Low Shatter, repeat. Can't remember you doing a single flash parry for armored/safe jailing, mixups, reversals etc, or crystall summon for combo resets and frame traps, OR using crystall armor for letting the block away and then punishing strings after that - nothing. The most basic Tremor to date.

So when you cry about universal changes that were also aplied to Crystalline, while it still has the best tool in his arsenal - flash parry, armor, boulder, safe low regular/ex shatter + NOW faster D1, F1, B1 + on block F4, F2 etc - it makes your point of view completely "Abysmal" as actual Tremor tournament players seem to have radically different opinion on the subject.
I have already discussed how EX low stone shatter and EX up stone punch combined were superior to flash parry pre-patch. Of course, flash parry still had its place, and I utilized the tool when I had to (i.e., versus Shinnok's hell sparks).

I have fought Denzell, Pig, REO, Scar, Tom Brady, Wound Cowboy, and many, many more pre-patch. Every single one of these players claimed I had the best Crystalline Tremor. Killer Xinok was a close second best. Which prominent tournament players were you fighting offline or online?

As far as popular opinions are concerned, I value BDon's and Killer Xinok's opinion the most. I know these two players are very good. BDon claims Aftershock is currently Tremor's best variation while Killer Xinok has not yet offered an opinion from what I have read.

Also, 80% of the tools that you mentioned for Crystalline ("flash parry, armor, boulder, safe low regular/ex shatter + NOW faster D1, F1, B1 + on block F4, F2 etc.") are also available in other variations so your argument makes no sense.
 

ShArp

Dedicated Broly main
I have already discussed how EX low stone shatter and EX up stone punch combined were superior to flash parry pre-patch.
Except they are not since up stone punch was mostly anti-air tool to get people confirmed for full combo punish if they tried to jump on you, but it was totally unsafe on block against most of the cast. The same armored up-rock punch is still there as you can cancel into it from flash parry to get the same stuff as pre-patch. U can aswel use flash parry to blow people that tries to poke you out as you did with EX Low shatter. I won't even start talking how flash parry is safe on pretty much everything you do as you can end it with F121 or db2 if you don't hit confirm. It costs stamina but it's doesn't matter as you can do most of tremors combos without running by simply applying JI1/2 after successful F121/B33 +DB2D attack.
I have fought Denzell, Pig, REO, Scar, Tom Brady, Wound Cowboy, and many, many more pre-patch. Every single one of these players claimed I had the best Crystalline Tremor.
What they "claimed" looses it's weight as they haven't played RZA's or KillerXinok's Tremors in the first place.
And RZA played Tom Brady, Madzin, st9rm and God knows how many more pro's/tournament level players - not just online but in the actual tournaments + is going into another major EU tournament in few weeks. While all I saw you do is playing online sets and so it makes me value RZA's or KillerXinok's opinion against your's anytime.
Which prominent tournament players
st9rm, RZA, Jupe, Scar, Erronlol, plenty of other some of the best console/PC players there are. But that's not my point - my point is that no matter who you played in the past - you could have done a shitload better if you actually tried to utilize atleast half of the tool set that Crystalline (or Tremor in general) has, not just the basic stuff.

Also, 80% of the tools that you mentioned for Crystalline ("flash parry, armor, boulder, safe low regular/ex shatter + NOW faster D1, F1, B1 + on block F4, F2 etc.") are also available in other variations so your argument makes no sense.
It makes no sense because every variation has it, but when it comes to Crystalline you don't even realize the utility of his own tool set like punishing certain (shitload) strings on block-free armor, frame traps with ex boulder in the corner, regular safe low shatter footsies and shit?

kek
 
Last edited:

M2Dave

Zoning Master
Except they are not since up stone punch was mostly anti-air tool to get people confirmed for full combo punish if they tried to jump on you, but it was totally unsafe on block against most of the cast. The same armored up-rock punch is still there as you can cancel into it from flash parry to get the same stuff as pre-patch. U can aswel use flash parry to blow people that tries to poke you out as you did with EX Low shatter. I won't even start talking how flash parry is safe on pretty much everything you do as you can end it with F121 or db2 if you don't hit confirm. It costs stamina but it's doesn't matter as you can do most of tremors combos without running by simply applying JI1/2 after successful F121/B33 +DB2D attack.
Nobody is talking about randomly spamming EX up stone punch. My point is that EX up stone punch complemented the EX low stone shatter, which opponents attempted to jump in an attempt to bait and punish the move with an aerial attack. EX up stone punch was therefore utilized to punish jumping opponents. This strategy was fundamental to Crystalline Tremor but has been removed.

As far as flash parry versus EX low stone shatter is concerned, EX low stone shatter was better. EX low stone shatter had more range and, unlike the flash parry, did not move Tremor's whole body forward, which means EX low stone shatter's armor was much more difficult to crush with fast jabs. In fact, trades used to occur frequently. Nonetheless, you were able to combo because of the long pop up. The execution was obviously a lot easier too.

I am honestly baffled why I had to explain these basic Crystalline Tremor strategies to a Crystalline Tremor player. You apparently did not even understand the basic meta of the variation.
 
Crystalline mainly. Aftershock against good zoning char like pyromancer, mileena ethereal or quan chi summoner. and metallic for Johnny Cage, lao & liu !

btw, dont miss Ketchup & Mustard stream tonight, I got an FT10 versus my bro St9rm at 8:30 CEST.
Let's bring some hype
Will it be on yt? Storm is so stronk
 

ShArp

Dedicated Broly main
Nobody is talking about randomly spamming EX up stone punch. My point is that EX up stone punch complemented the EX low stone shatter, which opponents attempted to jump in an attempt to bait and punish the move with an aerial attack. EX up stone punch was therefore utilized to punish jumping opponents. This strategy was fundamental to Crystalline Tremor but has been removed.

As far as flash parry versus EX low stone shatter is concerned, EX low stone shatter was better. EX low stone shatter had more range and, unlike the flash parry, did not move Tremor's whole body forward, which means EX low stone shatter's armor was much more difficult to crush with fast jabs. In fact, trades used to occur frequently. Nonetheless, you were able to combo because of the long pop up. The execution was obviously a lot easier too.

I am honestly baffled why I had to explain these basic Crystalline Tremor strategies to a Crystalline Tremor player. You apparently did not even understand the basic meta of the variation.
And I don't see the point explaining same shit over again as you are pretty much the most basic Crystalline Tremor there's is out of all mentioned decent Crstl mains.

So far from all the talking about Crystalline you haven't proved a single time how Crystalline is "screwed" in current meta when, infact, you don't even untilized his whole tool set in the first place. Whether it was pre-patch or in current state of the game. All you do is whine about EX low shatter getting his armor removed as a universal change but completely ignoring the fact that it was the only thing you were doing with that variation from all the rest of the options mentioned above, not even to mention the most basic Tremor's safe armored pressure/jailing/mixup/reversal/wakeup possibilities from flash parry alone.

So yeah, no wonder ppl have a good time laughing from some of these "abysmal" statements of yours when in current meta Crystalline is still strong asf.

P.S. Let me know once you will realise that ex low shatter is there not only for popping people up in neutral, but rather a good/safe mixup tool in your strings aswell.
 
Why would Metallic be good against Johnny Cage and Liu Kang.

or After Shock against a character like Pyromancer who spends much of their time in the air and over the range of Air Quake?
 

BxKeyz

Noob
against pyro you would metalli
Why would Metallic be good against Johnny Cage and Liu Kang.

or After Shock against a character like Pyromancer who spends much of their time in the air and over the range of Air Quake?
against pyromancer you would use metallic for gold launches, it wont guarantee total shut down but its his best option against zoners and characters with strong air mobility. As for lava skin i would use that against characters with annoying wake ups because of re stand.. and usually you would use crystalline for some of the ninjas(reptile and scorpion) because of krystallization taking the one hit reversal/wake like slide and strong punish after..as far for aftershock, that variation comes in handy against sub zero and other characters that don't teleport and are mostly grounded...Oh and this is just my opinion and that's why when picking up tremor i had to pick up all three variations as it comes in handy by giving him a better shot at winning over some of his bad mu...
 
I used him, all 3 variants for months. I just never saw A.S being good against high mobility characters like CSZ or Pyro. Those were ones I generally used Crystal on. I rarely ever used Metallic , particularly against characters with long range punishes.