General/Other - Cyrax Suggested Cyrax Changes for Patch

MadeOfMetal · Sep 20, 2016

Wigy said:
Her regular roll can be used on wakeup and certain characters have to hold it cause it goes under like all their mids except their pokes. That needs adjusted. Her tele into sai needs adjusted as its very inconsistent to punish if at all.
She should build a little less meter also.

i agree on roll, but the Tele into sai, i have no problem punishing. i Crouch on the sai and im able to Uppercut just fine.

Back on the Roll ive been saying this for a long time, that Roll Goes through to many Moves, and its because her Hurt Box(the one you have to hiut to win the trade) is this small ass Circle inside of her Ball while rolling, and her Hitbox(the one that hits you) is around her Body protecting her.

and thats the problem, but it also makes for a great AA. but she has B1/1/B34/B3 and all of those are just as good as roll for anti air if not better in certain situations. like JIP can be stopped by B34 just as good as roll. hur hurtbox is on the ground and her Legs up in air become her hitbox, Shielding her from damage and JIP's/JIK's so if they adjust Ball Roll hitbox/Hurtbox Properties then she will still have plenty of AA's

Other than that i do not think Mileena needs any more nerfs, but one can argue if you are trying to armor break a move that clearly goes through Mids/Highs/and Lows. you are at fault and not the Move. since its common knowledge that the move takes priority.

I am guilty of trying to stuff it as well, cuz i do it so much wagainst other characters, like Armor breaks and so on. but damn Mileena and that Roll. im down lets Alter the Hurtbox to be bigger so we can stuff it, if we time right read right, and use the correct move to stuff it, we should be rewarded, i feel other characters should have OKI setup against Mileena.

as of know No character has OKI vs Mileena because of the Hit-box/Hurt-box Properties of her Ball Roll(BD4).

Wigy · Sep 20, 2016

MadeOfMetal said:
i agree on roll, but the Tele into sai, i have no problem punishing. i Crouch on the sai and im able to Uppercut just fine.

Back on the Roll ive been saying this for a long time, that Roll Goes through to many Moves, and its because her Hurt Box(the one you have to hiut to win the trade) is this small ass Circle inside of her Ball while rolling, and her Hitbox(the one that hits you) is around her Body protecting her.

and thats the problem, but it also makes for a great AA. but she has B1/1/B34/B3 and all of those are just as good as roll for anti air if not better in certain situations. like JIP can be stopped by B34 just as good as roll. hur hurtbox is on the ground and her Legs up in air become her hitbox, Shielding her from damage and JIP's/JIK's so if they adjust Ball Roll hitbox/Hurtbox Properties then she will still have plenty of AA's

Other than that i do not think Mileena needs any more nerfs, but one can argue if you are trying to armor break a move that clearly goes through Mids/Highs/and Lows. you are at fault and not the Move. since its common knowledge that the move takes priority.

I am guilty of trying to stuff it as well, cuz i do it so much wagainst other characters, like Armor breaks and so on. but damn Mileena and that Roll. im down lets Alter the Hurtbox to be bigger so we can stuff it, if we time right read right, and use the correct move to stuff it, we should be rewarded, i feel other characters should have OKI setup against Mileena.

as of know No character has OKI vs Mileena because of the Hit-box/Hurt-box Properties of her Ball Roll(BD4).

Teleport should be properly punishable, not a character dependet uppercut,

MadeOfMetal · Sep 20, 2016

Wigy said:
Teleport should be properly punishable, not a character dependet uppercut,

i dont agree, its a shit teleport. and needs help, argue with @PND_Mustard cuz they the ones that asked for it i just agree with it

Wigy · Sep 20, 2016

MadeOfMetal said:
i dont agree, its a shit teleport. and needs help, argue with @PND_Mustard cuz they the ones that asked for it i just agree with it

She gets a full combo if she catches you jumping or ex's it. It punishes projectiles pretty much on reaction. It should be full punish. Most fast advancing moves are. Shadow kick etc

MadeOfMetal · Sep 21, 2016

Wigy said:
She gets a full combo if she catches you jumping or ex's it. It punishes projectiles pretty much on reaction. It should be full punish. Most fast advancing moves are. Shadow kick etc

are we talking about Cyrax? cuz he is a he and your saying She? i think we talking about different moves cuz Cyrax dont punish shit with Tele he love taps them and most the time gets punished for doing it. and if Cyrax launches with it after patch it will still be punishable on block.

EDIT ohh your talking about Mileena lol, nevermind, Her Teleport is punishable on block, just crounch it, you can standing one with most characters into full combo. i guess there might be a hand full that cant punish but even with sai its full combo punishable by most of the cast. just practice it. even Kitana Punishes it

hkriderz · Sep 21, 2016

Can't we just make it so sai or EX sai doesn't come out on block and only on hit and appease all? Reasonable nerf don't you think? @Wigy @MadeOfMetal

Oh and BTW, some characters just have to guess. And there should be no guessing on a move that is -20 on block and is a teleport. As @Wigy said, it has all the advantages it needs. It doesn't need to stay a pseudo mixup.

You can D2? Why the fuck would I get 14% for a punish when I could be getting 35?

MadeOfMetal · Sep 21, 2016

hkriderz said:
Can't we just make it so sai or EX sai doesn't come out on block and only on hit and appease all? Reasonable nerf don't you think? @Wigy @MadeOfMetal

Oh and BTW, some characters just have to guess. And there should be no guessing on a move that is -20 on block and is a teleport. As @Wigy said, it has all the advantages it needs. It doesn't need to stay a pseudo mixup.

You can D2? Why the fuck would I get 14% for a punish when I could be getting 35?

like i said you can do alot more than just D2 with most. if people just choose to do D2 then they will only get 14-19%

What happends most of the time is Mileenas do TeleKick into immediate sai so they can combo if hit, its not hit confirmable so its very easy to punish with so much more than D2.

Example in my case with Cyrax i can just use 3/4 with standing 4 i can get meterless damage up to 32% and with 3 i can get Metered damage up to 32% with 3 xx EXbuzzsaw.

and if Mileena does Tele Kick into Delayed Sai to try to make herself safe just use D1 with almost any character into a follow up advancing move and almost every character has a fast enough one, if not they have a Metered Special that will follow the D1.

thats just Cyrax, what about Kenshi EX Rising Karma Works, how about Kung Lao Spin? or Reptile how about his F412 string. depending on who you are the response is different just try different responses. i mean i guess i can put a video together but im sure you can figure out how to punish it. there is a huge gap, and thank god Her Teleport into sai is not how it was on MK9 right, then sai could make it safe, that is not the case now, there is a Gap.

And here is the video:

as i said it does not need to be nerfed its punishable as is. @Wigy , @hkriderz

Wigy · Sep 21, 2016

MadeOfMetal said:
are we talking about Cyrax? cuz he is a he and your saying She? i think we talking about different moves cuz Cyrax dont punish shit with Tele he love taps them and most the time gets punished for doing it. and if Cyrax launches with it after patch it will still be punishable on block.

EDIT ohh your talking about Mileena lol, nevermind, Her Teleport is punishable on block, just crounch it, you can standing one with most characters into full combo. i guess there might be a hand full that cant punish but even with sai its full combo punishable by most of the cast. just practice it. even Kitana Punishes it

If done properly you basically gotta guess the timing on ths punish. Brady did a video about it.

MadeOfMetal · Sep 21, 2016

Wigy said:
If done properly you basically gotta guess the timing on ths punish. Brady did a video about it

like i said, they dont do that, they want to do Tele kick when they think you wont block and its not hit confirmable, they always di immediate sai after to combo, and even if delayed all the way possible its still punishable and you just punish where it looks its at the right spot, when you get used to it its easy. just practice it. i have no problem punishing it, neither should you. and i have done it in practice as many different ways i can possibly do and im still able to punish it.

and brady has been wrong about alot. and how long he make the video because her air sai and tele kick was changed to be more punishable on block.

Wigy · Sep 21, 2016

MadeOfMetal said:
like i said, they dont do that, they want to do Tele kick when they think you wont block and its not hit confirmable, they always di immediate sai after to combo, and even if delayed all the way possible its still punishable and you just punish where it looks its at the right spot, when you get used to it its easy. just practice it. i have no problem punishing it, neither should you. and i have done it in practice as many different ways i can possibly do and im still able to punish it.

and brady has been wrong about alot. and how long he make the video because her air sai and tele kick was changed to be more punishable on block.

Foxygrandpa agreed when i said that telesai was messed up. You need to adjust the timing on your punish depending on what she does.

Are you playing mileenas who are good, cause i punish it fine with online rands too.

Go and watch bradys video man. Hes wrong about a lot but this he isnt.

hkriderz · Sep 21, 2016

@MadeOfMetal you can't judge a nerf based on the random mileenas. I can tell you from personal experience that mileenas have made the punish hard for me, making me guess on the timing. It's not hard to do with practice. I even made a thread asking for a solution to tele Sai as sub zero and got no answers. And it's true, sub has to hold that. Among other characters of there are any idk. You either guess or just block and don't get a punish.

Also there is this weird glitch where if you block the telekick from standing and mileena choses not to Sai, she randomly lands slightly farther from you and your d2 whiffs in her face, since d2 is the consensus for the semi consistent punish. This has happened against KL's spin as well, which always punishes it no matter what.

The nerf addresses all the issues.

PND_Ketchup · Sep 21, 2016

If Cyrax's teleport is designed to be punishable, but it's super inconsistent when people try to punish it, it makes sense to adjust it. Especially if they were to make it launch again.

It's not like Cyrax tele being punishable is even the issue. Of course every Cyrax player would prefer launching armour at all times, even if they make it so teleport is consistently punishable. Everyone else has a super punishable teleport.

I'll say what I've always said. Just give him a good mid off F4 and let teleport launch on MB, then he'd be gravy.

MadeOfMetal · Sep 21, 2016

hkriderz said:
@MadeOfMetal you can't judge a nerf based on the random mileenas. I can tell you from personal experience that mileenas have made the punish hard for me, making me guess on the timing. It's not hard to do with practice. I even made a thread asking for a solution to tele Sai as sub zero and got no answers. And it's true, sub has to hold that. Among other characters of there are any idk. You either guess or just block and don't get a punish.

Also there is this weird glitch where if you block the telekick from standing and mileena choses not to Sai, she randomly lands slightly farther from you and your d2 whiffs in her face, since d2 is the consensus for the semi consistent punish. This has happened against KL's spin as well, which always punishes it no matter what.

The nerf addresses all the issues.

ok even though i don't have the problem, what can it hurt, sorry man i don't know why im even arguing with it, as long as its not hella super punishable why not. make it like -12 on Tele Sai even make her float there for a while, and then id say make her Ball Roll different Hurtbox/Hitbox like i said before, so it doesn't go through other moves, and make B12 -7/-5 on Block then make wiff have an additional 8 frames of recovery and she is 100% fair.

none of the things i asked are hard to do so i don't see a problem for NRS, and nothing ruines Mileena at all, she will still be able to use B12 in Neutral and even Cancel off it, but she won't be able to use it over and over in a row which is dumb and its dumb you can't punish the wiffed B12.

Back to Cyrax i wan't Decent Mid and Launching Teleport and im Peachy. i have said other things but i can get by with that. at least he won't be total shit in the Neutral and he won't have so many damn bad Matchups and i just want to actually use Teleport. so far it randomly Glitches and adds Recovery frames so im afraid to use it ever. so if it had a purpose more than 11% then fuck id take the risk and get punished when they block it.

TY @PND_Ketchup i think its awesome that its not even your character and you defend it(I fully believe you are 100% capable of understanding what Cyrax needs and feel you know the matchup very well). i do the same for my older brother. he playes Mileena and Reptile and even though he annoys the shit out of me with them, ill defend them to the end. because they are good honest characters, like i said mileena only has 3 remotely broken things that are easily fixed.

PND_Ketchup · Sep 21, 2016

MadeOfMetal said:
ok even though i don't have the problem, what can it hurt, sorry man i don't know why im even arguing with it, as long as its not hella super punishable why not. make it like -12 on Tele Sai even make her float there for a while, and then id say make her Ball Roll different Hurtbox/Hitbox like i said before, so it doesn't go through other moves, and make B12 -7/-5 on Block then make wiff have an additional 8 frames of recovery and she is 100% fair.

none of the things i asked are hard to do so i don't see a problem for NRS, and nothing ruines Mileena at all, she will still be able to use B12 in Neutral and even Cancel off it, but she won't be able to use it over and over in a row which is dumb and its dumb you can't punish the wiffed B12.

Back to Cyrax i wan't Decent Mid and Launching Teleport and im Peachy. i have said other things but i can get by with that. at least he won't be total shit in the Neutral and he won't have so many damn bad Matchups and i just want to actually use Teleport. so far it randomly Glitches and adds Recovery frames so im afraid to use it ever. so if it had a purpose more than 11% then fuck id take the risk and get punished when they block it.

TY @PND_Ketchup i think its awesome that its not even your haracter and you defend it. i do the same for my older brother. he playes Mileena and Reptile and even though he annoys the shit out of me with them, ill defend them to the end. because they are good honest characters, like i said mileena only has 3 remotely broken things that are easily fixed.

I see and play against Cyrax a lot, I'm well aware about what the character can do etc.

MadeOfMetal · Sep 21, 2016

PND_Ketchup said:
I see and play against Cyrax a lot, I'm well aware about what the character can do etc.

i never said you didn't know, i actually thin you might know more about Cyrax than many of us mains. i was just telling you that i thought it was cool that you stick up for him even though you do not main him. that in a sense its like sticking up for your brother, which i do as well and understand.

We all should know that you are competent enough to understand Cyrax Moves and toolset.

PND_Mustard · Sep 21, 2016

MadeOfMetal said:
i dont agree, its a shit teleport. and needs help, argue with @PND_Mustard cuz they the ones that asked for it i just agree with it

Good lord man you like to name drop.

I said tele needs to launch again, that's all. I'd love to see the inconsistencies fixed sure and if they make it more consitently punshable then so be it.

All i've said on the matter is I want MB tele to launch, that's all.

MadeOfMetal · Sep 21, 2016

PND_Mustard said:
Good lord man you like to name drop.

I said tele needs to launch again, that's all. I'd love to see the inconsistencies fixed sure and if they make it more consitently punshable then so be it.

All i've said on the matter is I want MB tele to launch, that's all.

wtf do you mean name drop? what ev just being nice i guess that a crime here at TYM. have a good day. was just expressing that i agree, and to be honest ive never cared about the so called Pro players i played almost 20 years without Internet, EVo's and all that shit and played MK and have plenty of fun. do i think its cool that its become Popular yes. do i hope on pro players dicks nope. couldn't care less, what i said i liked about you was not that you are considered pro but that you are a nice guy that is relatively intelligent. if it bothers you that i talked to you in this thread im sorry. though i was just having a conversation.

PND_Mustard · Sep 21, 2016

MadeOfMetal said:
wtf do you mean name drop? what ev just being nice i guess that a crime here at TYM. have a good day. was just expressing that i agree, and to be honest ive never cared about the so called Pro players i played almost 20 years without Internet, EVo's and all that shit and played MK and have plenty of fun. do i think its cool that its become Popular yes. do i hope on pro players dicks nope. couldn't care less, what i said i liked about you was not that you are considered pro but that you are a nice guy that is relatively intelligent. if it bothers you that i talked to you in this thread im sorry. though i was just having a conversation.

You're looking too far into this lol, you literally just told someone to argue with me because I said something that I didn't actually say..

MadeOfMetal · Sep 21, 2016

PND_Mustard said:
You're looking too far into this lol, you literally just told someone to argue with me because I said something that I didn't actually say..

you actually did, you said you would like for Teleport to launch and thats all i said you said, you even said it here. I never said anything else except i seen you and Ketchup ask for a mid.

if you think i said anything else then you misread my post or i typed it wrong.

there is a small handful of members on this site that don't like me so they like to start drama, feel free to PM me and ill clear anything up, im not a bad guy. keep up the Good work man, and bring Triborg to Victory

just_2swift · Sep 21, 2016

Lol at 21 looking like mid mid instead of high mid. Pre release Nerf?

PND_Mustard · Sep 22, 2016

MadeOfMetal said:
you actually did, you said you would like for Teleport to launch and thats all i said you said, you even said it here. I never said anything else except i seen you and Ketchup ask for a mid.

if you think i said anything else then you misread my post or i typed it wrong.

probably just miscommunication, nevermind!

MadeOfMetal · Sep 22, 2016

PND_Mustard said:
probably just miscommunication, nevermind!

sorry man, don't mean to be snappy, i am in pain every day and i take alot of pain pills and it makes me snappy sometimes, anyways sorry bro.

Keep up the Cyrax work. and if you gonna do a tournament id like to watch, just post on TYM that you are attending and id like to lend my support.

iAteUrLife · Sep 27, 2016

just_2swift said:
Lol at 21 looking like mid mid instead of high mid. Pre release Nerf?

I think so if they gave the borgs atleast that I think we might be set since it armor breaks maybe it will stuff ex slides?

Invincible Salads · Sep 27, 2016

dunno why they took away the launching move.

and why are people arguing about mileena being able to cancel into air sai on block? reducing the block stun is a much more fair fix than removing the ability to toss sais on block.

Bruno-NeoSpace · Sep 27, 2016

Invincible Salads said:
and why are people arguing about mileena being able to cancel into air sai on block? reducing the block stun is a much more fair fix than removing the ability to toss sais on block.

It would be the same thing as she being not able to toss sais. lol

Edit: or WORSE because the same blockstun that she would have, her opponent would also have... so... it would be a buff for her. :confused:

General/Other - Cyrax Suggested Cyrax Changes for Patch

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