Discussion Is being able to cancel a D4 into a special; too strong?

Braindead said:

Oh @Tweedy you done messed up with that post.

Leave MK9 for MK9 people man.

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Life tip - Don't talk about stuff you know nothing about.

Braindead said:

Also @Zionix you say Scorpion gets mileage off it? Which specials are you talking about with Scorpion?

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I think he's referring to Flame Aura.

Braindead said:

It's a terrible risk/reward in your favor IMO. Not worth it. You're making your semi-safe d4 full combo punishable to get a knockdown and some % of damage.

In general it's not that bad. 50/50s make everyone salty but canceling d4s into specials is not too strong.

Also @Zionix you say Scorpion gets mileage off it? Which specials are you talking about with Scorpion?

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I can't help but do it since d4~db1/2 goes unpunished so much. =P

I can force my opponents to respect my d4 because they know I like to throw a grenade after that. Is this fair?

Tweedy said:

I think people really have a problem with this, because it wasn't as relevant in MK9? It seems like people think that whatever MK9 did is law.

It's only an issue when people can mix off of it imo. Alien, Kung Jin, Kotal, Leatherface to a lesser extent.

Next lets get a thread about how not having player 1 advantage is wack.

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Actually, most characters' D4s had big enough cancel advantage to jail into at least 1 special in MK9. If you wanted to do it, D4~Trance (a 20 something frame move) with Quan was a true blockstring lol. On top of most D4s also being 0 on block by themselves.

So yeah, anyone trying to tell you that pokes into specials on block systematically wasn't a thing in MK9, it's not even up for debate that they're bullshitting you.

STRYKIE said:

Actually, most characters' D4s had big enough cancel advantage to jail into at least 1 special in MK9. If you wanted to do it, D4~Trance (a 20 something frame move) with Quan was a true blockstring lol. On top of most D4s also being 0 on block by themselves.

So yeah, anyone trying to tell you that pokes into specials on block systematically wasn't a thing in MK9, it's not even up for debate that they're bullshitting you.

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Bring back d4 xx Takedown

Scorpion can combo his d4 and d1 poke into takedown and ex takedown. I like to do this online to get a free 11% combo of a naive opponent.

Zionix said:

Question in the title.

Shinnok, Scorpion, Sub-zero, Alien, Kotal and Tremor are the some of biggest culprits.

Its a meta that shouldn't be in the game. 6-10 frame pokes into specials some of which can launch for a full combo really defeats the purpose of pokes being negative.

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The fact is, it's different for everybody ponkss !

D4 xx Hellsparks is a blockstring & u can Meterburn this ( + on block )

Tremor D4 xx db1 is not a blockstring, you can armor or POKE with a lot of char & D4 is 12 frames -11f on block.

If D4 wasnt special cancelable it would be useless :/ and the only safe version of DB1D is with Crystalline, 0 on block. Aftershock & metallic DB1D are -15 on block.

You already know Tremor ( No Mid, no poke ), his best poke is 9f ! D4 xx Special is definitely one of the 3 best tools of Tremor Crystalline.

I won't talk for the other char cuz I dont play them

Pretty much all Kitana players were doing in MK9 was d1 xx cutter. And all I was doing was d4 xx MS.

errormacro7 said:

Pretty much all Kitana players were doing in MK9 was d1 xx cutter. And all I was doing was d4 xx MS.

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D4 xx MS was fucking disgusting... I should've picked up Sonya.

As a Shinnok main I hate this thread #D4SparksBoyz #MakeNetherrealmGreatAgain

Doesn't every fighting now a days have pokes that can get canceled into specials?

u know nrs games arent the only ones to do this right?

lol so using d3 into ex ddp is gimmick then

MK11 is gonna be a super unfun game you guys keep this up.

All I did in mk9 was d4 smokeball

Tweedy said:

I think people really have a problem with this, because it wasn't as relevant in MK9? It seems like people think that whatever MK9 did is law.

It's only an issue when people can mix off of it imo. Alien, Kung Jin, Kotal, Leatherface to a lesser extent.

Next lets get a thread about how not having player 1 advantage is wack.

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MK9 had d1/d4/d3 into specials, i honestly don't see a problem with it.
The poke meta in this game is already dumb, but if you're mashing anything after getting hit by d1, d3 or d4 into specials you deserve to be launched.
Although i agree d1, d3 and d4 into specials shouldn't frame trap, but oh well, a game its a game.

No, but having a d4 that can't be whiff punished and has no hurtbox is too strong.

And inb4 anyone come here and say "in mk9..."

gtfo, There were D4 into specials in MK9 as well and it was practically the same thing as in this game, character dependent.

Zionix said:

TLR D4s; fast, low profiling, far reaching and cancel-able. Is it right?

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Tweedy said:

I think people really have a problem with this, because it wasn't as relevant in MK9?

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Yes it was.

oaoo94 said:

Doesn't every fighting now a days have pokes that can get canceled into specials?

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The "concept" of poking today has been reduced to "down buttonz" as long as "uppercut" doesn't come out when you press them, its called "pokes".

Can't say i'm surprised that Tweedy is saying a bunch of bullshit he doesn't know from MK9

That being said, Smoke's D4 and fast overhead launcher that led to over 70+ damage...yeah that was fair for sure...

Mileena's D4, Reptile's D4, Sub Zero's D4...they were all key pokes to their respective games.

Braindead said:

It's a terrible risk/reward in your favor IMO. Not worth it.

Also @Zionix you say Scorpion gets mileage off it? Which specials are you talking about with Scorpion?

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D4 Hellfire normally to catch a couter poke.

My ultimate point with this whole thing, is when in the neutral, against certain characters you might aswell throw away 80% of your move list and your mids if they aren't true/advancing because the opponent is panic mashing their d4 and buffering a special which leads into a hard knockdown or launches for a combo. It is only these situations that I find utterly soul destroying.

A jax player doing d4 into a projectile or gotcha grab is NOT a problem.

I'm strictly talking about D4's that are jailing into plus frame specials, overhead/low (knockdown or launcher).

Frame data is irrelevant just find a poke and mash boys. If a poke is 6 frames its usually -6 or short reaching because of how good it is. If it being negative is circumnavigated with a special then the whole system is busted.

The issues isn't canceling pokes. The issue is the 5 second neutral game into death by mix up.

Canceling pokes creates an interesting meta as long as its not used for mix up.

If kids were forced to play neutral in this game oh lord would our top 8s look soooo much different. Aside from sonicfox tho, that kid has neutral game.


The reason people praise MK9 so highly on this site is cuz
A) this site was literally created from the mk9 community.
B) mk9 neutral lasted ages longer than mkx
C) mk9 meta for the most part wasn't based around 50/50 guesses. There was some bullshit (I'm looking at you cyrax and kabal) but what game doesn't have bullshit? Mkx is like 95% bullshit 5% neutral. Whereas mk9 was 40% neutral %60 bullshit.

Canceling pokes into specials is FAR from the problem of this game. VERY VERY FAR.