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Question - Cryomancer cryomancer viable?

Sub-Zero isn't a rush down character so he may not be the best fit. And the clone is used for a lot more than hiding behind.
Hi dankster Morgan, I am beginning to learn gym, I love cryo, I am labing the shit out of him and will do for months, learning the differences for Klone usage of male vs female, open field vs corner and so on, I have notice in forums you are a gm main, I have done a corner kombo and would you tell me if this is viable in play

F33xxdb1+R2~242~f3(f2 will work as well)xxdb2 from this point I either get Klone statue and before the opponent recover from f3 I do bf4 which freezes the opponent horizontally in the air and then I do njp~jip~bf4 for a total of 47% (reset included) or after the bd2 I freeze the opponent horizontally in the air then follow with njp~jip~bf4 for 33%, I can also get the former response with females, but not as frequently, you also have to cancel f3 into the Klone while the opponent is at shoulder level as they are descending from the 242, this works, ant thoughts would be appreciated, thanks
 
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Tanno

The Fantasy is the Reality of the Mind
@blue dragon , I'm, also, a GM mainer. I can imagine the combo you're trying to do. Let me rewrite this string.

F33~EX Burst (this is the Frost Bomb)> 242> F3~Ice Klone> NJP> FJP> Slide.

I don't know where did you find this 47%. As far as I can tell, this combo packs around 35%. If you want, you can pack more than this. Try this:

F33~EX Burst> D1> B12~Ice Klone> NJP> FJP> IA FJP> 1> B12~Burst or 123~Slide or 112 or F12.

If you have Ice Klone as a starter, NEVER do the EX Burst. What you used for starting in the corner is also one of the mixups leading to dangerous and hard as fuck combos.

The most known combo that can get 47% is this:

Ice Klone> FJP> B12~Burst> D1> D1> B12~Ice Klone> NJP> FJP> F12 or 112.

To get 48% switch the KO enders to 123~Slide. To get 55% switch FJP into X-Ray. To get 57% switch the FJP starter into B2> 4~Burst> B12~Ice Klone and then do the X-Ray ender.

Sub Zero has the advantage against them ONLY in the corner.
 
@blue dragon , I'm, also, a GM mainer. I can imagine the combo you're trying to do. Let me rewrite this string.

F33~EX Burst (this is the Frost Bomb)> 242> F3~Ice Klone> NJP> FJP> Slide.

I don't know where did you find this 47%. As far as I can tell, this combo packs around 35%. If you want, you can pack more than this. Try this:

F33~EX Burst> D1> B12~Ice Klone> NJP> FJP> IA FJP> 1> B12~Burst or 123~Slide or 112 or F12.

If you have Ice Klone as a starter, NEVER do the EX Burst. What you used for starting in the corner is also one of the mixups leading to dangerous and hard as fuck combos.

The most known combo that can get 47% is this:

Ice Klone> FJP> B12~Burst> D1> D1> B12~Ice Klone> NJP> FJP> F12 or 112.

To get 48% switch the KO enders to 123~Slide. To get 55% switch FJP into X-Ray. To get 57% switch the FJP starter into B2> 4~Burst> B12~Ice Klone and then do the X-Ray ender.

Sub Zero has the advantage against them ONLY in the corner.
You are correct, but some of the time the f3xxdb2 does not freeze the opponent in the air but instead the db2 releases the klone statue and with the opponent in stun from being hit with the f3(post 242) I then do a bf4~now the opponent hits the klone from the bf4 ~njp~jip~bf4 and the damage is 27 from initial plus reset 20, give it a try, I get both results depending on the height I do f3xxdb2, if I do the f3xxdb2 at below shoulder height the Klone is a whiff, please give it try, but notice you will get two results depending on the height you do f3xxdb2


F3xxdb2 at top of head height you get f33xxdb1+R2~242~f3xxdb2 will freeze opponent horizontally in the air now link frozen opponent to njp~jip~bf4 and you get 33% but if you do f3xxdb2 at shoulder height you get f33xxdb1+R2~242~f3xxdb2(klone statue release)27%now with the klone I front of you and with the opponent in stun from the f3 you do bf4(like above freezes the opponent horizontally in the air)~njp~jip~bf4 for 20% as the reset, I have done both consistently against the CPU on hard practice mode so it does work, the result is the height you perform the f3xxdb2, the former result only on males, the later result I have had it work on females but not as consistently as with males, thanks for your kombos I will practice them for quite a while so as to get them down, please what I described, also works with f2, will not work with 11, 12, f33 and d12, if you use them the Klone is a whiff even if done at head height, will test all basic and basic kombos over the next few days and see if there are others, I personally find f33xxdb1+R2 as the starter very easy(f33 is fast and safe, so I feel it is a win win situation, and the 242 is now realistically safe because it is done with the opponent in a juggle/corner launcher), please lab it and I would like to have your opinion, all input to me is useful and will help me learn, thank you
 
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Tanno

The Fantasy is the Reality of the Mind
You are correct, but some of the time the f3xxdb2 does not freeze the opponent in the air but instead the db2 releases the klone statue and with the opponent in stun from being hit with the f3(post 242) I then do a bf4~now the opponent hits the klone from the bf4 ~njp~jip~bf4 and the damage is 27 from initial plus reset 20, give it a try, I get both results depending on the height I do f3xxdb2
Will test it out when I get my motivation back. This mess in my living room took my motivation away.
 
Will test it out when I get my motivation back. This mess in my living room took my motivation away.
LOL, I love the honesty and straight forward reply, be patient and really concentrate on the timing of the f3xxdb2, worst case senario you just get a whiff and build meter at the same time
 

Tanno

The Fantasy is the Reality of the Mind
LOL, I love the honesty and straight forward reply, be patient and really concentrate on the timing of the f3xxdb2, worst case senario you just get a whiff and build meter at the same time
This worst case scenario is what I hate the most. I can time just fine. Just need to lab it a bit to see how much does it packs by itself. I, also, might do the F3~Burst to do some comparison in DMG.
 

Dankster Morgan

It is better this way
Hi dankster Morgan, I am beginning to learn gym, I love cryo, I am labing the shit out of him and will do for months, learning the differences for Klone usage of male vs female, open field vs corner and so on, I have notice in forums you are a gm main, I have done a corner kombo and would you tell me if this is viable in play

F33xxdb1+R2~242~f3(f2 will work as well)xxdb2 from this point I either get Klone statue and before the opponent recover from f3 I do bf4 which freezes the opponent horizontally in the air and then I do njp~jip~bf4 for a total of 47% (reset included) or after the bd2 I freeze the opponent horizontally in the air then follow with njp~jip~bf4 for 33%, I can also get the former response with females, but not as frequently, you also have to cancel f3 into the Klone while the opponent is at shoulder level as they are descending from the 242, this works, ant thoughts would be appreciated, thanks
I suppose it can work, but it is best to keep it meterless. The combo thread in the SZ forums is a great place to start:)
 

Temp

Salmon. Otters. The Bringer.
Cryo has a lot of 4-6 matchups, but other than Alien and Grandmaster, nobody really dominates him. His only real problem is that he gets nothing free in the neutral. You'll have to work for your anti-airs and whiff punishes. That's not a reason not to use him, though. In a game with a run input, an honest neutral game is a first-world problem, and no matter what character you're fighting, everyone eats a dick if they guess wrong on blocked jump-ins against Cryo. If someone wants to learn the fundamentals of MKX, he's like the best character to play.
 
@blue dragon , I'm, also, a GM mainer. I can imagine the combo you're trying to do. Let me rewrite this string.

F33~EX Burst (this is the Frost Bomb)> 242> F3~Ice Klone> NJP> FJP> Slide.

I don't know where did you find this 47%. As far as I can tell, this combo packs around 35%. If you want, you can pack more than this. Try this:

F33~EX Burst> D1> B12~Ice Klone> NJP> FJP> IA FJP> 1> B12~Burst or 123~Slide or 112 or F12.

If you have Ice Klone as a starter, NEVER do the EX Burst. What you used for starting in the corner is also one of the mixups leading to dangerous and hard as fuck combos.

The most known combo that can get 47% is this:

Ice Klone> FJP> B12~Burst> D1> D1> B12~Ice Klone> NJP> FJP> F12 or 112.

To get 48% switch the KO enders to 123~Slide. To get 55% switch FJP into X-Ray. To get 57% switch the FJP starter into B2> 4~Burst> B12~Ice Klone and then do the X-Ray ender.

Sub Zero has the advantage against them ONLY in the corner.
You mention " the most common combo that can get 47% is this:

Klone~jip~b12xxdb1~d1~d1~b12xxdb2~njp~jip~f12. I will work on this, one question is it db1 or db1+R2, the enhanced makes sense, will also work on the kombo you modified of the f33xxdb1+R2
 

Dankster Morgan

It is better this way
Cryo has a lot of 4-6 matchups, but other than Alien and Grandmaster, nobody really dominates him. His only real problem is that he gets nothing free in the neutral. You'll have to work for your anti-airs and whiff punishes. That's not a reason not to use him, though. In a game with a run input, an honest neutral game is a first-world problem, and no matter what character you're fighting, everyone eats a dick if they guess wrong on blocked jump-ins against Cryo. If someone wants to learn the fundamentals of MKX, he's like the best character to play.
I genuinely think he gets bodied by the same characters Grandmaster does, just as badly. D'Vorah rapes Grandmaster, but he can at least do some shit to her if he gets her in the corner with the close clone because of D'Vorah's collision box being bigger than say- Mileena. Cryo has none of that and he just gets raped in the neutral just as bad, D'Vorah hits harder, safer, and face fucks him in footsies. Basically the same as Grandmaster. Alien and Mileena shit on him but he really brutalizes them in the corner (Alien with close clone), you get where I'm going with this.
Imo Grandmaster's hardest matchups are
1. Swarm Queen D'Vorah
2. Demo Sonya
3. Piercing Mileena
4. Acidic Alien
5. Lasher Takeda
6. Shaolin Kung Jin
7. Mystic Ermac
Where do you think Cryo fares better than Grandmaster here?
 
Cryo has a lot of 4-6 matchups, but other than Alien and Grandmaster, nobody really dominates him. His only real problem is that he gets nothing free in the neutral. You'll have to work for your anti-airs and whiff punishes. That's not a reason not to use him, though. In a game with a run input, an honest neutral game is a first-world problem, and no matter what character you're fighting, everyone eats a dick if they guess wrong on blocked jump-ins against Cryo. If someone wants to learn the fundamentals of MKX, he's like the best character to play.
What kind of dick are you talking about, if it's big floppy donkey dick, then I says that is some mouth full
 

MadeOfMetal

Kenshi Srubtastic,Cyrax, Special Forces Mains
I will look very closely at his normals to discover the confusing aspect that you mentioned, thanks again
Try F412/B1D4

those two are very good mixups and they look wierd, then its a good thing to note: that if you use Deceptive for Invisibility, his B1 tongue attack is one of his fastest moves but it will show up even if you are invisible. Also his Gravity bomb can be stoped with one bar with DB xx BLK: and this tool is great, you can stop it past them after a knockdown, then slide to make them pop up into the stopped bomb, and you can rush in adn use F412(the second hit is an Overhead, the first is a great MID) and that will be a mixup option after Stopped bomb. also you can use B2 and F3 to mix em up. also you should try to Stop the Ball over them while they are laying down with delayed wakeup, so you can use it to break armor with normals + stopped ball, but also its a great way to stop many of there wakeup options.

just some friendly tips for your Reptile journey.
 

Temp

Salmon. Otters. The Bringer.
Let's just get this part out of the way early.

Where do you think Cryo fares better than Grandmaster here?
None. Generally, Cryo is never a better option than grandmaster. The only reason to play Cryo is because it conforms better to your inherent style of play. My only mention of grandmaster was that the Cryo-Grandmaster matchup is virtually unwinnable.

I genuinely think he gets bodied by the same characters Grandmaster does, just as badly. D'Vorah rapes Grandmaster, but he can at least do some shit to her if he gets her in the corner with the close clone because of D'Vorah's collision box being bigger than say- Mileena. Cryo has none of that and he just gets raped in the neutral just as bad, D'Vorah hits harder, safer, and face fucks him in footsies. Basically the same as Grandmaster. Alien and Mileena shit on him but he really brutalizes them in the corner (Alien with close clone), you get where I'm going with this.
Imo Grandmaster's hardest matchups are
I'm not a specialist by any means, and for the most part, I agree that all those characters rough up Cryo. However, most of those are not unwinnable, IMO (except for Demolition; that's probably unwinnable at the highest level). I haven't grinded out those matches by any means, but at the end of the day, a knockdown goes ridiculously far with Cryomancer. The core mechanics of MKX leave almost no one protected from a blocked jump-in or run in D+4, and in many situations, that's all Cryo needs.

But remember, I'm not saying he's good. He needs help (not much, but definitely some help). Fighting Dvorah and Ermac just plain sucks, and I'd be happy if I never had to play that matchup again, but it only takes one proper risk to change the momentum. The MK9 low-tier never had the luxury of "one proper risk," so I think it's important to keep perspective on Cryo.
 

Tanno

The Fantasy is the Reality of the Mind
You mention " the most common combo that can get 47% is this:

Klone~jip~b12xxdb1~d1~d1~b12xxdb2~njp~jip~f12. I will work on this, one question is it db1 or db1+R2, the enhanced makes sense, will also work on the kombo you modified of the f33xxdb1+R2
Use the Enhanced only to get your opponent away from you and force them back in the corner or to prevent their attacks in the corner. Worth one bar in some occasions.

If you start with Ice Klone to prevent him/her from getting near you and you do the Frost Bomb (Not EN) near him/her, it packs 20% DMG. Lab it and see for yourself.
 

Braindead

I want Kronika to step on my face
Cryomancer needs a damage buff to be viable IMO.


Needs to get mid 60s for 1 bar and he'll be ok.