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General/Other - Kung Lao NRS pls... Kung Lao needs help.

N00B

N00B

Noob
Kung Lao is a rushdown pressure character with bad up close game(normals for up close game are too slow and low effective), no real mix ups, no real pressure, many useless, low effective, useless, slow normals and strings, but he has good defense and has only one fine normal for neutra footsie game and has one good poke, and it's not enough for being complete, strong character in MKX. Kung Lao should change. Kung Lao needs buffs.
Kung Lao needs these changes to become complete, strong character in MKX.



General buffs
This changes would improve hes bad up close game:

1) 6 fr s1 (now s1 is 8 fr) - He needs 6 fr jab for improving hes bad up close game.

2) 9-10 fr (11) (now (11) is 11 fr) - 11 frames is too slow for this string, 9-10 fr is perfect for (11) string, not too fast and not too slow.

3) 8 fr B1 -4 on block (now B1 is 12 fr -11 on block) - B1 is a short range not true mid, desighned for up close game, and 8 fr B1 -4 also would improve hes bad up close game. 8 fr B1 -4 would be usefull for up close game and its would diversifies the gameplay. And Lao being a pressure, rushdown character desighn withoght mix ups, being a freaking Kung Fu Master should have more options up close, and being comfortable up close vs characters like kitana, jacquie e.t.c.

4) 7 fr D1 -9 on block (now D1 is 8 fr -6 on block) - he needs 7 fr D1 for covering 8 fr B1 which is not true mid. -9 on block would be balanced.

These changes would a little bit improve hes neutral and cover hes slow walkspeed (more usefull normals for neutral, footsies game would cover hes slow walkspeed, yes. don't ask why.) and also would diversifies the gameplay and Kung Lao would be more fun to play:

5) 13 fr B3 (now B3 is 15 fr) - 15 fr is too slow even for true mid and now with ex hat being +7 no one respect B3 anymore. 13 fr B3 would make respect B3 in general and cover F2 which is not true mid. 13 frames is a fair for true mid, not too slow and not too fast.

6) 15 fr F3 +10 on hit ( now F3 is 19 fr and -1 on hit) - this normal should be usefull too. 15 fr F3 would cover hes slow walkspeed because F3 has a good range and...

7) (F34) +5 on block withoght gaps - ...and F34 being +5 withought gaps would be used like a big leg, F34 should be +5 because F34 has slow recovery and pushback.

8) 13 fr F4 -6 on block (now F4 is 18 fr -13 on block) - this overhead normal not a launcher and its being 13 fr -6 on block its fair.

Hat Trick buffs:

9) Regular hat call back 0 on block (now it's -7) - first of all for pressuring with hat in HT variation Kung Lao should set up a hat and thats why 0 on block would be fair.

10) Regular hat trap setup -3 on block by High starting normals and -6 on block by Mid starting normals() (now its punishable from all normals) - its should be negative, but it's should'nt be punishible.

11) Hat not dissapear anymore when its comes back(Hat-a-rang) if Kung Lao gets hit (now if Lao gets hit hat ghost throw the opponent when its comes back ) - this problem needs to be fixed.


Nerfs (All nerfs would makes sense with all of these suggested buffs)

General:

1) Reduce J3 hitbox

Tempest:

2) Reg orb hat -4 or -5 on block (now it's -3)

Hat Trick:

3) EX hat call back +7 or +8 maybe on block (now it's +13) - TBH i'm not sure about this one, for pressuring you should set up hat first, but +13 would jail tho.



Kung Fu Master Kung Lao needs all these buffs. Kung Lao needs fast normals for up close game and more usefull normals and strings, because he is rushdown, pressure character withought mix ups and he is a freaking Kung Fu master its enough reasons for making all these changes. IMO all of these changes are fair and balanced. And last patch is the last chance.

NRS pls...





P.s. Sorry for my english. I hope everything is written clearly. )))
 
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Eddy Wang

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
At this point NRS has decided what to give another buff thread close a week of patch release won't change a thing, and honestly Hat Trick doesn't need anymore nerfs, the +13 advantage call back his its his only tool to do everything if NRS nerfs it, it will just add another hole on his pressure game and he has plenty and needs closing.

Besides those buffs won't address the real issues as hat whiffs, major big holes on his pressure game, slow walkspeed, horrible backdash, strings with no purpose, slow punishable projectile.
Kung Lao has no mixups with oh/low so he has to mix with button/no button with the aid of stagger, what he needs in general is better walkspeed, backdash, and better frame data on his normals in order to apply said stagger, NRS did a good job giving this to scorpion.

I'm sorry to the thread starter, but i suggest a mod to close this thread.
 
MadeOfMetal

MadeOfMetal

Kenshi Srubtastic,Cyrax, Special Forces Mains
TQT1995 said:
Buff Unbreakable
Click to expand...
Yes we all know sub zero needs a plethora of buffs, but coming in a thread and acting like an ass, telling other characters dont need buffs because you want your character buffs is idiotic and rude. im just saying something because it kinda pissed me off. not mad at you and wont hold a grudge.

just wanna say that mentality of only help my character, is why there has been so many balance issues threw this games life. the constand greedy persona that most of the community has. only help my character fuck everyone elses. it never works and in fact, works badly for you. when shit comes round, those people who get there characters nerfed like the 20 you complaine about(not you the unbreakable and lesser character community) take it out on you next patch, they remember Those sub zero players asked for my character to get nerfed and well you know hoe Sub got in this mess now.


but i do agree Sub zero does need buffs bad, but lets not go in the Who needs them more speach, Hat trick needs buffs really bad and i also feel the other two could benift from a few adjustments as well.


1 i would suggest is making Kung Lao's F13 have no gap. so he has a true low starter. and obviously he needs many more.
 
MadeOfMetal

MadeOfMetal

Kenshi Srubtastic,Cyrax, Special Forces Mains
EDIT: in red Green i agree

@Eddy Wang


N00B said:
Kung Lao is a rushdown pressure character with bad up close game(normals for up close game are too slow and low effective), no real mix ups, no real pressure, many useless, low effective, useless, slow normals and strings, but he has good defense and has only one fine normal for neutra footsie game and has one good poke, and it's not enough for being complete, strong character in MKX. Kung Lao should change. Kung Lao needs buffs.
Kung Lao needs these changes to become complete, strong character in MKX.



General buffs
This changes would improve hes bad up close game:

1) 7 frame S1

2) 9-10(11 frames is fine) frame (1,1) (now (1,1) is 11 frames) - 11 frames is too slow for this string, 9-10 fr is perfect for (1,1) string, not too fast and not too slow. (if his standing 1 was changed it wouldn't matter what his second hit speed was on that string.)

3) 8 frame B1 -4 on block Umm no no way should any character get a 8 frame Mid starter string with that negative on block.,(now B1 is 12 frame -11 on block) - B1 is a short range not true mid, desighned for up close game, and 8 fr B1 -4 also would improve hes bad up close game. 8 fr B1 -4 would be usefull for up close game and its would diversifies the gameplay. And Lao being a pressure, rushdown character desighn withoght mix ups, being a freaking Kung Fu Master should have more options up close, and being comfortable up close vs characters like kitana, jacquie e.t.c. 10 frames is more like it for B1 thats more fair startup for a mid in this game, considering the rest of the cast, and it will help him being 2 frames quicker. and make it -7 on block.

4) 7 fr D1 -9 on block (now D1 is 8 fr -6 on block) - he needs 7 fr D1 for covering 8 fr B1 which is not true mid. -9 on block would be balanced.

These changes would a little bit improve hes neutral and cover hes slow walkspeed (more usefull normals for neutral, footsies game would cover hes slow walkspeed, yes. don't ask why.) and also would diversifies the gameplay and Kung Lao would be more fun to play:

5) 13 frame B3 (now B3 is 15 fr) - 15 fr is too slow even for true mid and now with ex hat being +7 no one respect B3 anymore. 13 fr B3 would make respect B3 in general and cover F2 which is not true mid. 13 frames is a fair for true mid, not too slow and not too fast.

6) 15 frame F3 +10 on hit ( now F3 is 19 fr and -1 on hit) - this normal should be usefull too. 15 fr F3 would cover hes slow walkspeed because F3 has a good range and...

7) (F34) +5 on block withoght gaps - ...and F34 being +5 withought gaps would be used like a big leg, F34 should be +5 because F34 has slow recovery and pushback. If you are gonna make it Plus on block make it Plus 2-3 and keep it 18 startup

8) 13 fr F4 -6 on block (now F4 is 18 fr -13 on block) - this overhead normal not a launcher and its being 13 fr -6 on block its fair. Not really its a Knock down and an armor break move, its very strong. its negative for a reason, but to make it better id say -8 on block, some characters could not punish that but the top 10 could if they where on a good read.

Hat Trick buffs:

9) Regular hat call back 0 on block (now it's -7) - first of all for pressuring with hat in HT variation Kung Lao should set up a hat and thats why 0 on block would be fair. Not really cus if he has faster frames that his opponent then he would have advantage id say - 1 would be good all the way to -6.

10) Regular hat trap setup -3 on block by High starting normals and -6 on block by Mid starting normals() (now its punishable from all normals) - its should be negative, but it's should'nt be punishible. Agree on regular hat but metered should be somewhat positive and not wiff, but i don't think it should be different if you use mids or highs.

11) Hat not dissapear anymore when its comes back(Hat-a-rang) if Kung Lao gets hit (now if Lao gets hit hat ghost throw the opponent when its comes back ) - this problem needs to be fixed. Yeah it should not dissapere on hit. if the hat went out before he gets hit it should remain in route.


Nerfs (All nerfs would makes sense with all of these suggested buffs)

General:

1) Reduce J3 hitbox

Tempest:

2) Reg orb hat -4 or -5 on block (now it's -3)

Hat Trick:

3) EX hat call back +7 or +8 maybe on block (now it's +13) - TBH i'm not sure about this one, for pressuring you should set up hat first, but +13 would jail tho. He needs this to be +13 you would be surprised how hard it would be to use +7 to jail for pressure, anbd thats what the whole Hat trick is supposed to be about, the problem is it wiffs currently so its useless untill they fix wiffing issues.
Click to expand...
 
N00B

N00B

Noob
Eddy Wang said:
At this point NRS has decided what to give another buff thread close a week of patch release won't change a thing, and honestly Hat Trick doesn't need anymore nerfs, the +13 advantage call back his its his only tool to do everything if NRS nerfs it, it will just add another hole on his pressure game and he has plenty and needs closing.

Besides those buffs won't address the real issues as hat whiffs, major big holes on his pressure game, slow walkspeed, horrible backdash, strings with no purpose, slow punishable projectile.
Kung Lao has no mixups with oh/low so he has to mix with button/no button with the aid of stagger, what he needs in general is better walkspeed, backdash, and better frame data on his normals in order to apply said stagger, NRS did a good job giving this to scorpion.

I'm sorry to the thread starter, but i suggest a mod to close this thread.
Click to expand...

What is wrong with you?

P.S. i didn't know patch comes tomorrow i didn't play mkx like 5 month since march or april.

And also i wanted post tread about buff suggestions for Raiden and Lao every month and i finally posted. I just wanted to do it and i did it.
 
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N00B

N00B

Noob
TheGangstaFace said:
I completely agree with a 6f s1. With the way Lao is designed I don't understand why he doesn't have a faster s1 and I also 100% agree on f2
Click to expand...
Yea exaxtly. With the way Lao is desighned, i don't understand too why he doesn't have more options for up close offense and more usefull normals and strings?
He should't have a good zoning, good backdash, fast walkspeed, no it's not important for him, he should have weaknesses like all characters BUT he should have fast normals for better up close offense and better neutral and more usefull normals and strings, thats more important for Lao it would cover the lack of mix ups, fast walkspeed, good backdash, good zoning.
 
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MadeOfMetal

MadeOfMetal

Kenshi Srubtastic,Cyrax, Special Forces Mains
N00B said:
Yea exaxtly. With the way Lao is desighned why he doesn't have more options for up close offense and more usefull normals and strings? I don't understand too.
He should't have a good zoning, good backdash, fast walkspeed, no, he should have weaknesses like all characters BUT he should has fast normals for better up close offense and better neutral and more usefull normals and strings, thats more important for Lao it would cover the lack of mix ups, fast walkspeed, good backdash.
Click to expand...
yeah he needs fast strings, when it comes to fighters there are categories. Lao falls under Rushdown and rushdowns need fast strings and or movement with solid normals. and in this meta 90% has safe mixups and multiple great solid 10 frame mids with 7 frames averag starters and an invetory of launchers. He needs his F13 to not have a gap, they made it that way way back in the start of the game when they thought to many characters had mixups and it was to strong on him well news flash almost Every character has safe mixups and or a way to make them safe. because of his low has a gap he can not make it safe or relay on it whatso ever.

he needs that fixed, and his strings need to be updated to this stage in the meta and meta calls for 7 frame highs, and 10 frame advancing mids, depending on your toolset is what decides - on block or frames of recovery of said normals but damn he needs LOVE now or never.
 
JerzeyReign

JerzeyReign

PSN: JerzeyReign
Lao still has some juice. I understand Foxy is Foxy but he's grabbing a lot of other "pros" by the neck with Lao like we're in Summer 15.
 
hkriderz

hkriderz

Lin Kuei Scum, yellow robot enthusiast
Guys guys we should take all opinions into consideration, even though they sound very stupid and dumb and kind of trolly and should never ever be considered:DOGE

My personal wishlist (mainly a tempest main)

Universal

112124 hitbox fixes (no more random gaps in that string)
F2 and b3 true mids
F23 gap removed
7f d1 and 7f s1
Teleport 2 fixed hitbox
Jump in 2 hitbox fixed so it doesn't ghost sometimes
WHY THE FUCK DOES B12 have a gap and B1 is -11 on block??????
General more safety on his other useless strings and gaps removed (forgot the inputs lol)

Tempest

(WISHFUL BUFF) Ex orbiting hat plus 12 again - it has pushback already so no blockstrings a but it would massively help his pressure of he has the d4 jail mixup again.

112124 orbiting hat works on males midscreen

11212 orbiting hat into 44 works on females midscreen.

(A personal hopeful buff)- orbiting hat hit adv increased by 3 frames for easier 44 follow up. But that's just me lol.

Buzz saw and HT- I'll let the other experts handle this but one buff I think they both need is Ex spin relaunches for a combo after regular spin like tempest. It would help their damage a lot.

HT call back hitbox massively fixed
Hatarang is a mid on the way back and doesn't ghost when Lao is hit
 
GAV

GAV

Resolution through knowledge and resolve.
N00B said:
Kung Lao is a rushdown pressure character with bad up close game(normals for up close game are too slow and low effective), no real mix ups, no real pressure, many useless, low effective, useless, slow normals and strings, but he has good defense and has only one fine normal for neutra footsie game and has one good poke, and it's not enough for being complete, strong character in MKX. Kung Lao should change. Kung Lao needs buffs.
Kung Lao needs these changes to become complete, strong character in MKX.



General buffs
This changes would improve hes bad up close game:

1) 6 fr s1 (now s1 is 8 fr) - He needs 6 fr jab for improving hes bad up close game.

2) 9-10 fr (11) (now (11) is 11 fr) - 11 frames is too slow for this string, 9-10 fr is perfect for (11) string, not too fast and not too slow.

3) 8 fr B1 -4 on block (now B1 is 12 fr -11 on block) - B1 is a short range not true mid, desighned for up close game, and 8 fr B1 -4 also would improve hes bad up close game. 8 fr B1 -4 would be usefull for up close game and its would diversifies the gameplay. And Lao being a pressure, rushdown character desighn withoght mix ups, being a freaking Kung Fu Master should have more options up close, and being comfortable up close vs characters like kitana, jacquie e.t.c.

4) 7 fr D1 -9 on block (now D1 is 8 fr -6 on block) - he needs 7 fr D1 for covering 8 fr B1 which is not true mid. -9 on block would be balanced.

These changes would a little bit improve hes neutral and cover hes slow walkspeed (more usefull normals for neutral, footsies game would cover hes slow walkspeed, yes. don't ask why.) and also would diversifies the gameplay and Kung Lao would be more fun to play:

5) 13 fr B3 (now B3 is 15 fr) - 15 fr is too slow even for true mid and now with ex hat being +7 no one respect B3 anymore. 13 fr B3 would make respect B3 in general and cover F2 which is not true mid. 13 frames is a fair for true mid, not too slow and not too fast.

6) 15 fr F3 +10 on hit ( now F3 is 19 fr and -1 on hit) - this normal should be usefull too. 15 fr F3 would cover hes slow walkspeed because F3 has a good range and...

7) (F34) +5 on block withoght gaps - ...and F34 being +5 withought gaps would be used like a big leg, F34 should be +5 because F34 has slow recovery and pushback.

8) 13 fr F4 -6 on block (now F4 is 18 fr -13 on block) - this overhead normal not a launcher and its being 13 fr -6 on block its fair.

Hat Trick buffs:

9) Regular hat call back 0 on block (now it's -7) - first of all for pressuring with hat in HT variation Kung Lao should set up a hat and thats why 0 on block would be fair.

10) Regular hat trap setup -3 on block by High starting normals and -6 on block by Mid starting normals() (now its punishable from all normals) - its should be negative, but it's should'nt be punishible.

11) Hat not dissapear anymore when its comes back(Hat-a-rang) if Kung Lao gets hit (now if Lao gets hit hat ghost throw the opponent when its comes back ) - this problem needs to be fixed.


Nerfs (All nerfs would makes sense with all of these suggested buffs)

General:

1) Reduce J3 hitbox

Tempest:

2) Reg orb hat -4 or -5 on block (now it's -3)

Hat Trick:

3) EX hat call back +7 or +8 maybe on block (now it's +13) - TBH i'm not sure about this one, for pressuring you should set up hat first, but +13 would jail tho.



Kung Fu Master Kung Lao needs all these buffs. Kung Lao needs fast normals for up close game and more usefull normals and strings, because he is rushdown, pressure character withought mix ups and he is a freaking Kung Fu master its enough reasons for making all these changes. IMO all of these changes are fair and balanced. And last patch is the last chance.

NRS pls...





P.s. Sorry for my english. I hope everything is written clearly. )))
Click to expand...
 
N00B

N00B

Noob
hkriderz said:
Guys guys we should take all opinions into consideration, even though they sound very stupid and dumb and kind of trolly and should never ever be considered:DOGE

My personal wishlist (mainly a tempest main)

Universal

112124 hitbox fixes (no more random gaps in that string)
F2 and b3 true mids
F23 gap removed
7f d1 and 7f s1
Teleport 2 fixed hitbox
Jump in 2 hitbox fixed so it doesn't ghost sometimes
WHY THE FUCK DOES B12 have a gap and B1 is -11 on block??????
General more safety on his other useless strings and gaps removed (forgot the inputs lol)

Tempest

(WISHFUL BUFF) Ex orbiting hat plus 12 again - it has pushback already so no blockstrings a but it would massively help his pressure of he has the d4 jail mixup again.

112124 orbiting hat works on males midscreen

11212 orbiting hat into 44 works on females midscreen.

(A personal hopeful buff)- orbiting hat hit adv increased by 3 frames for easier 44 follow up. But that's just me lol.

Buzz saw and HT- I'll let the other experts handle this but one buff I think they both need is Ex spin relaunches for a combo after regular spin like tempest. It would help their damage a lot.

HT call back hitbox massively fixed
Hatarang is a mid on the way back and doesn't ghost when Lao is hit
Click to expand...

Where the fuck you see "very stupid and dumb and kind of trolly and should never ever be considered" changes in my balance suggestions?
it is you sounds very stupid and dumb and trolly and provoking. All of those changes are fair and balanced, i'm not writen something ridicilous, unbalanced that would break the game, rewrite and think again.
 
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