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Why does Sonic Fox win everything?

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First of all, you can take that condescending last paragraph and eat it. I an not some random internet moron who uses "buzzwords" and pretends to have problems, and I will not be spoken to as such. Secondly, explain to me how a blanket statement of "top players just don't work hard enough, that's why Sonic wins everything," isn't blatantly untrue. Do you know something I don't? Is that really what it is? Foxy and Irish Mantis and Scar are just lazy? Because I'm under the impression that that they do all grind and practice constantly, just like Sonic, just like those other players I mentioned. Feel free to correct me if that isn't the case.
So you think not working hard enough isn't their excuse? If you asked them I'm pretty sure it would be along those lines.They'd probably say something like "i need to hit the lab more" or "I need to practice this match up more." Something along those lines. I mean do you seriously believe they are just going to say "sonic fox is just better than me" ?
 

The_Tile

Your hole is mine!
I don't get why some people are being so arsey and pissy about this post. To me it seems like a genuine post which was mostly thought out and has incited some good conversation between the people who aren't just blindly disagreeing and getting offended by something which doesn't even pertain to them.

The guy is just inciting a bit of conversation about why the best player is the best and why noone has really caught up yet, why is that so bad?

Maybe it could have been worded a little better but it doesn't matter whether he says "Sonic Fox practices more than everyone else" or "Everyone else practices less than Sonic Fox" cause if you read between the lines it's the same thing at the end of the day.
 

Youphemism

Gunslinger since pre patch (sh/out to The Farmer)
First of all, you can take that condescending last paragraph and eat it. I an not some random internet moron who uses "buzzwords" and pretends to have problems, and I will not be spoken to as such. Secondly, explain to me how a blanket statement of "top players just don't work hard enough, that's why Sonic wins everything," isn't blatantly untrue. Do you know something I don't? Is that really what it is? Foxy and Irish Mantis and Scar are just lazy? Because I'm under the impression that that they do all grind and practice constantly, just like Sonic, just like those other players I mentioned. Feel free to correct me if that isn't the case.
I'm just pointing out a contradiction, if I happen to come across consdescending doing that then....well....ok lol.

I've already given multiple examples of why top players not working hard enough is true, go back and look at my first post for a few examples (although you should have already seen it but since you're insinuating that statement isn't true you must not have looked at it. If you have then....reread it I guess).
I didn't say they were lazy so that question is irrelevant. They might grind certain matchups, they might learn/lab certain things but if they're losing then yeah it's partly because they haven't put in the effort to really deal with what they're losing to and figure out their best counteroptions. Look at what happened at KiT for example, F0xy got put in losers by a Lasher Takeda. He's not a terrible player by any means, one of the best in the world, but after 10 months of the game he still didn't know the matchup for one of the vanilla variations. Not the Lasher player or anyone else's fault he didn't know the matchup is it?
 

cambros22

Stand Back I'm a Doctor!!!!!!
Natural talent is such a loose term. I'm going to guess when you say natural talent what you mean is that if I were to sit sonic fox down with Hungrybox (the melee evo champion) at a game they have never played and had absolutely no experience with, the one with the "natural talent" would win. That's what you mean right? Well after two years "natural talent" doesn't matter anymore. Mew2king, one of the gods of melee, used to never place first. He lost to Ken, the old melee champ, all the time. But he has now put more work in than ken, and if they face each other today it's not even close. Mew2king destroys him. Along with mostly everyone else. It's obviously about how much work you put in. That is the key factor.
Natural talent is just having an innate ability to be more skilled at something(usually in the early stages of learning) which allows them to advance or produce better results much easier and or faster than others. Having Talent isnt enough to make that person great. They have train to be really see their full potential. There are many reasons why alot of us do not reach our full potential in things. Saying people arent smart is disrespectful to everyone here and in any FGC that posts tech, matchup info and helps others to learn the game in the name of leveling each other up so that the competition can grow as a whole.

Everyone that competes in MKXL works hard by practicing, labing tech, discussing the information they learn about their characters and the relationship between them and the roster/ game mechanics and much more. There are many great and talented players now and more to be in the future. Everyone learns at different paces.

Also to add on to what Youphemism has stated before, sometimes people dont train appropriately and that can be a factor that stunts their growth and or success.
 

ChoseDeath

Seriously Casual Player.
So you think not working hard enough isn't their excuse? If you asked them I'm pretty sure it would be along those lines.They'd probably say something like "i need to hit the lab more" or "I need to practice this match up more." Something along those lines. I mean do you seriously believe they are just going to say "sonic fox is just better than me" ?
Is that really what it is? Yes, I think that is not their excuse. If I'm wrong, then that's my mistake. But it has been my experience that lack of effort and practice is not the defining factor in why top players lose matches. That's two of you telling me the same thing. Ok, I'll ask some of them.
 

ChoseDeath

Seriously Casual Player.
I'm just pointing out a contradiction, if I happen to come across consdescending doing that then....well....ok lol.

I've already given multiple examples of why top players not working hard enough is true, go back and look at my first post for a few examples (although you should have already seen it but since you're insinuating that statement isn't true you must not have looked at it. If you have then....reread it I guess).
I didn't say they were lazy so that question is irrelevant. They might grind certain matchups, they might learn/lab certain things but if they're losing then yeah it's partly because they haven't put in the effort to really deal with what they're losing to and figure out their best counteroptions. Look at what happened at KiT for example, F0xy got put in losers by a Lasher Takeda. He's not a terrible player by any means, one of the best in the world, but after 10 months of the game he still didn't know the matchup for one of the vanilla variations. Not the Lasher player or anyone else's fault he didn't know the matchup is it?
Sir, you just said you had heard top players say that, you have given no evidence. This is the place for it, if you find me these top players saying that's why they lose, I will immediately alter my position. Ask them on here. I don't know how to tag people.
 

Asodimazze

https://twitter.com/AlfioZacco
SonicFox is just the best, there isn't much to explain. He has that clutch factor that almost no one else has
 
@A F0xy Grampa Would you say that your losses are your own fault and that if you could go back and work harder at learning the match ups and learn everything you should of learned before your losses, that you would of won? In other words, is the fact that you didn't work as hard as sonic fox the reason you didn't win evo? I believe that is the case. This seems like common sense to me but other people here seem to strongly disagree.
 

ChoseDeath

Seriously Casual Player.
@A F0xy Grampa Would you say that your losses are your own fault and that if you could go back and work harder at learning the match ups and learn everything you should of learned before your losses, that you would of won? In other words, is the fact that you didn't work as hard as sonic fox the reason you didn't win evo? I believe that is the case. This seems like common sense to me but other people here seem to strongly disagree.
That's a great start, thank you sir.
 

ABACABB

End Of Humanity
Its just pure talent thats why. As ppl said before ,you can practice 24/7 and you will never get as good as sonic. Its same with other things in life, lets say skating or bodybuildding. Some dudes can spent hours per day learning tricks or working out and they will never get to the pro level like some of the best out there .

The time you spent on learning one trick on skateboard ,a guy with talent will learn 3 new tricks, Its same with sonic . He will master 3 characters when you just one in the same time :D
 
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Tanno

The Fantasy is the Reality of the Mind
The question set to you would be:

Why don't you ask @SonicFox5000 about this? You might have a good idea about his skills as a NRS player.
 
The question set to you would be:

Why don't you ask @SonicFox5000 about this? You might have a good idea about his skills as a NRS player.
Well because the post really isn't directed toward him. It's directed toward the players under him. His answer will probably be something predictable like "im just amazing" or something funny like that. My concern is with why no one is putting up a good fight. And those people under him will be able to answer me more accurately. Which will most likely be them agreeing with me in one way or another about how they need to put more work in.
 

Johnny Based Cage

The Shangest of Tsungs
It's clearly more than just dedication with Sonic Fox. If it was one game or two in the same vein it would be one thing, but he's able to juggle so many different ones, and types even.

He's got some kind of savant syndrome thing going on like Rainman except instead of being able to count toothpicks at light speed he's able to breakdown fighters, make reads on the fly, and execute at a speed and capability other humans just can't seem to match.
 

Tanno

The Fantasy is the Reality of the Mind
Well because the post really isn't directed toward him. It's directed toward the players under him. His answer will probably be something predictable like "im just amazing" or something funny like that. My concern is with why no one is putting up a good fight. And those people under him will be able to answer me more accurately. Which will most likely be them agreeing with me in one way or another about how they need to put more work in.
I don't know him personally, but I think that if he's humble, he will reveal his secret to you. Every best player shares his knowledge to let everybody get better on the progress. ;)

The opinion of the others are a bit irrelevant at a point. They might have lost to him and say whatever, but do they know his secret of being the best NRS player? If they knew his secret, they would know how to beat him in the past years.

IMO, there are a ton of people training to be the best in every sport, but only a selected few who know the rules and the tricks of every sport can be the best. It's a matter of practice, knowledge and reaction.

;)
 

Youphemism

Gunslinger since pre patch (sh/out to The Farmer)
Sir, you just said you had heard top players say that, you have given no evidence. This is the place for it, if you find me these top players saying that's why they lose, I will immediately alter my position. Ask them on here. I don't know how to tag people.
No I didn't say I heard them say that, I watched both of those conversations unfold. Considering I was a part of both of those conversations as they happened they most definitely are valid examples and evidence of a lack of knowledge in some areas. I'm not the kind of person to call out people like that which is why I didn't name them in the first place. They're not going to admit to "not working hard enough" or "being lazy" anyway, who would? I'm not saying anyone is lazy by the way so let's not turn this conversation into people being too lazy because that's not the case.
 
It' because he plays in such an unpredictable way. You just cant read what the kid is going to do next. Sonic Fox and aFoxyg are the Messi and Ronaldo of MKX, both light years ahead of the competition but one will go down as the GOAT and one will go down as one of the best players ever
 
I don't know him personally, but I think that if he's humble, he will reveal his secret to you. Every best player shares his knowledge to let everybody get better on the progress. ;)

The opinion of the others are a bit irrelevant at a point. They might have lost to him and say whatever, but do they know his secret of being the best NRS player? If they knew his secret, they would know how to beat him in the past years.

IMO, there are a ton of people training to be the best in every sport, but only a selected few who know the rules and the tricks of every sport can be the best. It's a matter of practice, knowledge and reaction.

;)
That's just not true. I'm completely sure that Foxy grampa knows exactly why he lost evo and that he knows exactly why sonic fox won. It's not so much a secret as it is just what I've been saying countless times in this thread. He is simply putting in the time and getting out what he puts in.
 

ChoseDeath

Seriously Casual Player.
No I didn't say I heard them say that, I watched both of those conversations unfold. Considering I was a part of both of those conversations as they happened they most definitely are valid examples and evidence of a lack of knowledge in some areas. I'm not the kind of person to call out people like that which is why I didn't name them in the first place. They're not going to admit to "not working hard enough" or "being lazy" anyway, who would? I'm not saying anyone is lazy by the way so let's not turn this conversation into people being too lazy because that's not the case.
That's fair of you. But for all I know you are just making those secret conversations up. Or maybe you're telling the truth entirely. I do not know. But, even if it is honest of you and for a good reason, not showing any hard evidence to support your point will not change my mind.

And OK, I will absolutely agree with your point that you have not, neither directly nor implied, called anyone lazy, and I further agree that is not what we're talking about.

However, I still find it incredibly hard to believe that people aren't beating Sonic due to incorrect training methods or not enough match up knowledge. I would have believed that last year but now? I remain unconvinced.

However, the man who started this thread has been kind enough to start this line of questioning, so we'll see where it goes.
 
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