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in depth Jax Breakdown all 3 variation, changes wish list

freerf245

11 11 11 11
you dont compete or play againts high level player , you said yourself. so you to be honest your opinion is irrelevant.
Lmao shitty logic as always. We can play if youd like.
Are you one of those people who think every character can go 5-5? Jax has the worst MUps in the game besides shao. I know for a fact you must have never played Jax against a Decent player using any of those characters mentioned.

Those matchups are 8-2 because Jax is one of the only characters who can't really fight back when he's fullscreen, he has to inch his way in so he has to outplay his opponent mentally just to even get a chance to start his offense
I've played those matchups hundreds of times. They are not fun, maybe 7-3, but an 8-2? Do you guys even know what an 8-2 is like? I'm not even sure an 8-2 exists in this game. I'd hate to see you play a game with actual shitty matchups lol.
 
Lmao shitty logic as always. We can play if youd like.

I've played those matchups hundreds of times. They are not fun, maybe 7-3, but an 8-2? Do you guys even know what an 8-2 is like? I'm not even sure an 8-2 exists in this game. I'd hate to see you play a game with actual shitty matchups lol.
sure ill pm you my psn or you play on pc.

how is my logic shitty when you said it yourself.
 
Lmao shitty logic as always. We can play if youd like.

I've played those matchups hundreds of times. They are not fun, maybe 7-3, but an 8-2? Do you guys even know what an 8-2 is like? I'm not even sure an 8-2 exists in this game. I'd hate to see you play a game with actual shitty matchups lol.
Tomato Tomato. 7-3 is still bad. You essentially can't jump in against most of those characters or move freely. Only way to win those MU is to make correct reads more than the opponent.

Example: Avanlache subzero can basically do the trap for free at any time when you approach him, which forces you not to attack/jump at him which then let's him dash cancel f2 or slide to you which is unreactable. And no, you can not try to reactively do thumper when you see the startup of his trap animation, because it is not any different from his normal ice ball animation which makes it a read. And trying to zone sub is a net loss when he gets a free combo. 8-2, 7-3 is still ass and no character should have this many bad matchups it's not fair.
 
Lmao shitty logic as always. We can play if youd like.

I've played those matchups hundreds of times. They are not fun, maybe 7-3, but an 8-2? Do you guys even know what an 8-2 is like? I'm not even sure an 8-2 exists in this game. I'd hate to see you play a game with actual shitty matchups lol.
Jax v Cetrion is actually a 9-1, and unwinnable if the cetrion player is good imo mainly because of wall and her air flames.you won't be able to take ur turn 90% of the match
 

thlityoursloat

kick kick
Tomato Tomato. 7-3 is still bad. You essentially can't jump in against most of those characters or move freely. Only way to win those MU is to make correct reads more than the opponent.

Example: Avanlache subzero can basically do the trap for free at any time when you approach him, which forces you not to attack/jump at him which then let's him dash cancel f2 or slide to you which is unreactable. And no, you can not try to reactively do thumper when you see the startup of his trap animation, because it is not any different from his normal ice ball animation which makes it a read. And trying to zone sub is a net loss when he gets a free combo. 8-2, 7-3 is still ass and no character should have this many bad matchups it's not fair.
I mean, maybe he has a point in that we're exaggerating how bad it is, but it's still bad, like really really bad. Too many characters like avalanche as you mentioned just own Jax the whole game, and I mean own in the most literal sense, if they want you to just sit there the whole game and take their bullshit they will.
That's not even the problem FFS, the biggest problem is that his offense SUCKS, it's not good enough to justify his bottom 1 screen presence. What fucking good is it to work my ass off against Cetrion just to get 11 11 11 11 11'd? or to work my way against outtake's slime spam just to get destroyed by a +6 shimmy string.
why is this character that's the 2nd closest to a true rushdown archetype, fucking terrible at rushdown compared to other characters with big buttons and fast projectiles? Not right.
 
I mean, maybe he has a point in that we're exaggerating how bad it is, but it's still bad, like really really bad. Too many characters like avalanche as you mentioned just own Jax the whole game, and I mean own in the most literal sense, if they want you to just sit there the whole game and take their bullshit they will.
That's not even the problem FFS, the biggest problem is that his offense SUCKS, it's not good enough to justify his bottom 1 screen presence. What fucking good is it to work my ass off against Cetrion just to get 11 11 11 11 11'd? or to work my way against outtake's slime spam just to get destroyed by a +6 shimmy string
why is this character that's the 2nd closest to a true rushdown archetype, fucking terrible at rushdown compared to other characters with big buttons and fast projectiles? Not right.
Makes me shed a tear. I feel Jax needs a +6 shimmy string. That is something you think a rushdown character like Jax should have
 

thlityoursloat

kick kick
I think we're all supposed to be using GB at this point.
HD fucking sucks because the command grab is unreliable without a proper tick, and the KB nerf made that unreliable too. Never mind that it's the hardest special to get out if you want to keep sides because it's FOUR directional inputs. Losing the command OHs sucks but it's more than made up for with actual combos. Losing stiff arm sucks majorly and that's probably the biggest loss.
Using it for basic strike/throw mixups is best, the 9f mid shits on crouch attempts and even micro ducks, so it's really top tier in that department. In the corner the missile KB really shines too because it nets you over 40%. Never use any of the bf2 "mixups", never use the -20 low that's equally horrendous on hit, never cancel bf2 to be -20.
 
I think we're all supposed to be using GB at this point.
HD fucking sucks because the command grab is unreliable without a proper tick, and the KB nerf made that unreliable too. Never mind that it's the hardest special to get out if you want to keep sides because it's FOUR directional inputs. Losing the command OHs sucks but it's more than made up for with actual combos. Losing stiff arm sucks majorly and that's probably the biggest loss.
Using it for basic strike/throw mixups is best, the 9f mid shits on crouch attempts and even micro ducks, so it's really top tier in that department. In the corner the missile KB really shines too because it nets you over 40%. Never use any of the bf2 "mixups", never use the -20 low that's equally horrendous on hit, never cancel bf2 to be -20.
i tried couple times and recently, my friend just poke out of every single "mix". but during KL my opponents didn't know so they were guessing. This variation imo is god like if you dont know that there is no mix then its shit. cause you wont just open everyone with f33 alone or 12 to hit confirm the launcher. The only good thing i can see from this variation is that at least it force your opponent to use his meter to breakaway making the oki game less a nightmare for jax.
 

thlityoursloat

kick kick
i tried couple times and recently, my friend just poke out of every single "mix". but during KL my opponents didn't know so they were guessing. This variation imo is god like if you dont know that there is no mix then its shit. cause you wont just open everyone with f33 alone or 12 to hit confirm the launcher. The only good thing i can see from this variation is that at least it force your opponent to use his meter to breakaway making the oki game less a nightmare for jax.
Don't mix. Grab or f33. That's it. If they eat the f33 it's 30% easy. Once you've established that then you can start using gimmicks like b2 and b3 ripped.
The other really good thing you forgot is that people don't mash as much or neutral crouch because your mid will HURT. When I play HD I have to shart every time I attempt a stagger or quad grab because everyone just fucking mashes cause WHY NOT 15% combos.
You can use bf2 on block to fish for flawless blocks too, and it's one of Jax's very very few moves with pushback so you can actually walk back and breathe sometiems if you want to.
Tbh if they made 12 combo this variation could be top tier. A faster bf2 amp and maybe maybe faster bf2 or bf2 low would really make it shine.
 

freerf245

11 11 11 11
Also like to add his fake 50/50 after a throw. Both throws leave him in perfect range for dash up B3 or just a db4. Totally reactable but people get hit by it all the time.
 

freerf245

11 11 11 11
I know it's painfully obvious, but as someone who played HD for so long, combos that actually damage has become such a foreign concept to me.
You're telling me I don't have to settle for 15% after blocking slide??? Woahhh.
I'm just fucking around. most on this discussion seems to think Grinnin Barret is automatically trash just because his bf2 mixup is nonexistent.
 

thlityoursloat

kick kick
I'm just fucking around. most on this discussion seems to think Grinnin Barret is automatically trash just because his bf2 mixup is nonexistent.
I thought that at first tbh. I see the gimmicks as something that just compliment the variation, instead of being what it's based on now.
 
Don't mix. Grab or f33. That's it. If they eat the f33 it's 30% easy. Once you've established that then you can start using gimmicks like b2 and b3 ripped.
The other really good thing you forgot is that people don't mash as much or neutral crouch because your mid will HURT. When I play HD I have to shart every time I attempt a stagger or quad grab because everyone just fucking mashes cause WHY NOT 15% combos.
You can use bf2 on block to fish for flawless blocks too, and it's one of Jax's very very few moves with pushback so you can actually walk back and breathe sometiems if you want to.
Tbh if they made 12 combo this variation could be top tier. A faster bf2 amp and maybe maybe faster bf2 or bf2 low would really make it shine.
but its kinda the same as hd risk reward, either you block the f33 overhead or you get thrown looped right ? if you block its your turn and if you neutral duck jax explode and if you get hit by the f33 you get launched but you can breakaway early for small dmg taken. i think its better than nothing but there is no way in hell that GB is high tier imo.
 

thlityoursloat

kick kick
but its kinda the same as hd risk reward, either you block the f33 overhead or you get thrown looped right ? if you block its your turn and if you neutral duck jax explode and if you get hit by the f33 you get launched but you can breakaway early for small dmg taken. i think its better than nothing but there is no way in hell that GB is high tier imo.
It's the same risk reward when they breakaway, yeah, but afterwards you can just really bully your opponent, no one's going to mash if they're at risk of eating 30-40%. I don't think GB is high tier now, not at all, but I think it can be if they made 12 combo. He'd pretty much be Cassie up close lol.
 
It's the same risk reward when they breakaway, yeah, but afterwards you can just really bully your opponent, no one's going to mash if they're at risk of eating 30-40%. I don't think GB is high tier now, not at all, but I think it can be if they made 12 combo. He'd pretty much be Cassie up close lol.
alright you convinced me , ill give GB another try but chill 12 of jax isnt gona be what 111 is to Cassie. i truly believe Cassie is a top tier sleeper like kotal and noob saibot. Cassie auto shimmy does everything for her and if the opponent breakaway he still hit tons of damage plus she as insane neutral.
 

thlityoursloat

kick kick
alright you convinced me , ill give GB another try but chill 12 of jax isnt gona be what 111 is to Cassie. i truly believe Cassie is a top tier sleeper like kotal and noob saibot. Cassie auto shimmy does everything for her and if the opponent breakaway he still hit tons of damage plus she as insane neutral.
Just please don't use the bf2 low. Or anything besides bf2 itself. You'll hate yourself and the variation.
Maybe he won't be top tier, but he'll actually be a rushdown character that plays MK11. They already buffed ripped on hit so there's hope. Everyone plays HD and is convinced it's already top tier so we can forget that ever getting buffs.
 

LaidbackOne

Scrubby nice guy
i tried couple times and recently, my friend just poke out of every single "mix". but during KL my opponents didn't know so they were guessing. This variation imo is god like if you dont know that there is no mix then its shit. cause you wont just open everyone with f33 alone or 12 to hit confirm the launcher. The only good thing i can see from this variation is that at least it force your opponent to use his meter to breakaway making the oki game less a nightmare for jax.
12 doesn't link into the launcher.
f2 also doesn't.
These are the biggest problems of this variation imo. It has way better corner game than HD since you build throw kb heat with one midscreen bnb
This variation has potential to be really good, just needs a few adjustments. Give it a shot.
 
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