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Aris on SFV.

Invincible Salads

Seeker of knowledge
Imo limited defensive options(also an over abundance of anti fireball moves) and a little too much input delay to consistently whiff punish anything other than big buttons, causes the game to be realllllly momentum based after someone gets going. I'd like to see crouch teching come back and some more invincibility on backdashes.

If you get it hit me up we can play, or I can show you some stuff either way.
whats crouch teching, and i've heard that the creators deliberately put a delay in the game to make it hard to react to things, which is incredibly stupid.


also i have the game and i use cammy, not very knowledgeable about stuff yet tho, don't know matchups or anything.
 
whats crouch teching, and i've heard that the creators deliberately put a delay in the game to make it hard to react to things, which is incredibly stupid.


also i have the game and i use cammy, not very knowledgeable about stuff yet tho, don't know matchups or anything.
Crouch teching is when you crouch and input a throw, Other games don't let you do it and instead you get a crouching punch(3rd strike) or kick(sf4). If your opponent tries to throw you you'll tech if they don't your button comes out. However sfv let's you throw while crouching so you'll just stand and throw and probably die.

If they let you crouch tech like in 4 you could guard against a shimmy and a throw with one option. It'd be a nice tool vs characters like cammy/Karin.
 

SwagMountains

Yes we Kahn
You clearly don't know ANYTHING about the game. Crouch teching has never been a thing in sfv. Just like mechanically it's not possible. It's possible that that's why you're getting blown up.

But yes please continue to explain the game.
Delay tech, whatever it's called, chill. Pardon my nomenclature
 

Invincible Salads

Seeker of knowledge
Crouch teching is when you crouch and input a throw, Other games don't let you do it and instead you get a crouching punch(3rd strike) or kick(sf4). If your opponent tries to throw you you'll tech if they don't your button comes out. However sfv let's you throw while crouching so you'll just stand and throw and probably die.

If they let you crouch tech like in 4 you could guard against a shimmy and a throw with one option. It'd be a nice tool vs characters like cammy/Karin.
shimmy is when you move in and out quickly right? how does crouch teching help with this?
 
Delay tech, whatever it's called, chill. Pardon my nomenclature
Well if you're gonna insist that there's only two defensive options in the game you could at least get both of them right. Although you do have other options, you're not wrong they're definitely limited.
 

SwagMountains

Yes we Kahn
Well if you're gonna insist that there's only two defensive options in the game you could at least get both of them right. Although you do have other options, you're not wrong they're definitely limited.
I never experienced 4 in depth when crouch teching was a thing so I mix the two up. DP isn't super viable because it get blown up by shimmy as well, wakeup jab works all the time when you suspect disrespectful meaties. What other options are there defensively?
 

RNLDRGN

RONALD ROGAN
I actually don't think SFV is a bad game. I like that it's simple and I don't have to spend hours in training mode to get 1 frame links to get good damage with half the cast. I also like that characters don't constantly fish for hit confirms with 4 crouch jabs into safe special over and over again.

People act like SF4 was this godsend to fighting games, when in reality it was a slightly above average Street Fighter that came at the perfect time and helped rush in an era of fighting game revival. It (like SFV and pretty much every fighter) had plenty of incredibly boring matchups as well.

Lots of good players hate on SFV not because it's un-fun, but because they can't immediately shine with their crazy execution combos or incredibly tight links vs other above-average players. Which is understandable, but you can't damn the entire game just because you want to spend 8hrs a day in training mode doing 1 frame links and want the respect of the community from that.

If you want to hate on the game, hate on Capcom's greedy DLC structure, lack of support, shoddy online, lack of communication, poor launch--lots of issues that have little to do with the gameplay. The game isn't bad just because it's easier than SF4. Hell I'm thankful for that.

The game has plenty of good, too. The animations are mostly excellent with a few exceptions (Cammy's air grab lol), it's incredibly balanced IMO, the roster is diverse, the stages are beautiful, the soundtrack rocks (rashidooooo), and plenty of characters are very hype to watch (Urien, Gief, Abigail, Alex, Ibuki).

HOWEVER, the game does need some sort of variety in the characters. A second V-trigger and V-reversal for each character would be huge. A 2nd Critical Art would be great as well. They definitely need to expand on the mechanics (and I'm sure they well), but for Aris to call the game horrible is just lazy bandwagon mentality and is pretty unfair IMO.
 

Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
All I know is I really enjoyed watching SF4 at high levels. It was hype and entertaining. Watching SF5 literally puts me to sleep. No clue if it's a good game or not, but it's probably the most boring SF game I've ever watched.
 

UGL Preon

The Casual God
As a person who's not the biggest fan of SFV. That had to do with it being $60 at launch for a game hardly worth 29.99. Mechanics wise it has just as much stupid and zany things in it's gameplay as MKX. From things connecting in one corner and not the other. To weird hit box problems to the 50/50 oppression. Both games checked that box. MKX content wise had infinitely more to offer.

DLC Choices for both games IMO have been suspect. Some home runs like Tremor/Tanya/Triborg for MK & Alex/Urien/Balrog/Akuma(shouldve been in day uno).

Then MKX had the movie characters and SFV has Abigail & butchered Juri.

I think SFV < SFIV (Yes vanilla) as well as MK9 > MKX

I just find SFV boring to play and watch. But that's more to do with the games way of presentation than it is balance.

For me MKX > SFV. But I've always simply liked MK more than sf. SF having a lackluster launch damn sure wasn't going to change that.
 

Linkuei82

Live by the sword, Die by the sword
What's funny is that the certain people that keep saying they enjoyed USFIV more keep forgetting that before it took 5 updates to get to that point, people were complaining about the games balance and mechanics just like they are now for SFV.

Same with Alpha series and SF3, and SF2.
 

Marinjuana

Up rock incoming, ETA 5 minutes
While I don't own the game and know enough to comment on its gameplay I'll just say that this game's release version was a fucking disgrace.
 

Shaka

Tier Whore.
People don't act as if SF4 was a godsend lol... players bitched for years about that game too.
 

Israel

Noob
Ya'll not explaining why people dislike it. First off the priority system is fucked. They made a counterhit system in which a heavier attack beat out a lighter attack when they were both active and touching, meaning a hk would beat a mk. To compliment this poor choice most heavy attacks grant a crush counter, which is a crumple state that grants a giant damaging combo. The implications are that the neutral feels like you're fishing for a crush counter because you can't throw out other buttons in footsie range. Jump back os no longer works, so a great multi-layered defensive tool was done away with. That means that the options defensively are to crouch tech, which gets blown the fuck up by shimmy and just block which gets thrown. Throws often loop back into throws in the corner. There are no deadshot mb wakeups where you get to stand up. Also, whiffed normals don't hang around very lomg so whiff punishing is only done by few players with disgusting reactions like momochi and punk. It's just pretty boring to play. It feels very, very, very flo charty, and the reason that offense is more annoying than an nrs offense is because normals recover so quickly nearly every block string can turn into an unreactable tick throw essentially. Normals probably need to whiff longer, there needs to be more blockstun so people aren't tick throwing everything, the priority system needs a fix and the game needs more depth in general.
Thanks for being the first person ever to actually explain some mechanics of the game..and shed some light of the changes.

I dont play sfv, but no one on earth who plays actually explained to me why they dont like it.
 

Israel

Noob
Ya'll not explaining why people dislike it. First off the priority system is fucked. They made a counterhit system in which a heavier attack beat out a lighter attack when they were both active and touching, meaning a hk would beat a mk. To compliment this poor choice most heavy attacks grant a crush counter, which is a crumple state that grants a giant damaging combo. The implications are that the neutral feels like you're fishing for a crush counter because you can't throw out other buttons in footsie range. Jump back os no longer works, so a great multi-layered defensive tool was done away with. That means that the options defensively are to crouch tech, which gets blown the fuck up by shimmy and just block which gets thrown. Throws often loop back into throws in the corner. There are no deadshot mb wakeups where you get to stand up. Also, whiffed normals don't hang around very lomg so whiff punishing is only done by few players with disgusting reactions like momochi and punk. It's just pretty boring to play. It feels very, very, very flo charty, and the reason that offense is more annoying than an nrs offense is because normals recover so quickly nearly every block string can turn into an unreactable tick throw essentially. Normals probably need to whiff longer, there needs to be more blockstun so people aren't tick throwing everything, the priority system needs a fix and the game needs more depth in general.
care to explain to me what this 'shimmy' is?
 
care to explain to me what this 'shimmy' is?
They attack You on wake up. the attack is on His late active frames so it can't be punished and It's hit confirm able into a full combo. If You do an invincible reversal they can block the reversal wake up in time:DOGE
 

Israel

Noob
Wait a sec... the description you gave me doesnt match with what the video is showing.

What i see is the ken player baiting/wiff punishing the opponents wake up grab/punch? It looks as if the wake up attack..isnt working tho hes right in his face.
What am i missing?
 

NaCl man

Welcome to Akihabara
Wait a sec... the description you gave me doesnt match with what the video is showing.

What i see is the ken player baiting/wiff punishing the opponents wake up grab/punch? It looks as if the wake up attack..isnt working tho hes right in his face.
What am i missing?
where i take the step back is the shimmy. Its good because it allows you to bait and wiff punish throws as shown but you are also blocking wake ups.
 

Israel

Noob
where i take the step back is the shimmy. Its good because it allows you to bait and wiff punish throws as shown but you are also blocking wake ups.
Oh, ok. so its just a simple step back and wait for the punish. Like in all other games i see.
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
every time you guys shit on a game by over simplifying it you're literally not saying anything. the people who just like to hate on the game will agree and those who like the game will disagree. everyone else who knows shit about the game just looks at you like bruh stahp
https://www.eventhubs.com/news/2017/aug/01/every-match-tends-finish-same-style-no-matter-who-playing-and-s-not-exciting-daigo-one-change-he-wants-most-sf5/

Daigo, known hater and oversimplifier :DOGE

P.S. I do think that the commentary in some parts can be a bit extreme -- but when you have some of the best players from multiple generations pointing out similar issues, it's likely that there's some fire behind all the smoke.
 

omooba

fear the moobs
https://www.eventhubs.com/news/2017/aug/01/every-match-tends-finish-same-style-no-matter-who-playing-and-s-not-exciting-daigo-one-change-he-wants-most-sf5/

Daigo, known hater and oversimplifier :DOGE

P.S. I do think that the commentary in some parts can be a bit extreme -- but when you have some of the best players from multiple generations pointing out similar issues, it's likely that there's some fire behind all the smoke.
bruh when he was asked to pick just one problem he literally said "Hm… It’s very difficult to pick one" which is my point. if you just say something like what most of you guys said about mkx "it's all just 50/50's" bruh no that's not how it works