Dink's final detailed Quan MU chart

[Matix218]

I agree with the smoke and ermac matchup being 5-5

 

[zaf]

Punishable or not... -17 forces Ermac to block which = Rune Trap

Which also means that quan has no meter to break.
OR it is possible that quan has no meter already from breaking.
Very situational to TKP up close.
But it is also a conditioning tool.
It might also not always be worth a quan player to use meter to get a rune trap off if he only has 1 meter, or even if he has 2.
The damage from ermac is usually higher then a rune trap sequence.

 

[NKZero]

Quan Chi does not beat Sektor. Sektor can punish trance from ANYWHERE on the screen if whiffed or blocked. The only thing Quan Chi has going for him is his low hit-box to avoid a few of Sektor's high-hitting strings, not to mention easily ducking b+3, 4. Quan Chi is seriously in trouble after knockdowns and in the corner, but Sektor being negative on his wake-ups means that as long as Quan Chi has meter he can go straight into rune trap set-ups.

Sektor has slightly better footsies but as you said he should be wary of throwing anything out in the event he trades with trance. I would say 5-5 but if anyone is winning, it's Sektor.

 

[Konqrr]

Which also means that quan has no meter to break.
OR it is possible that quan has no meter already from breaking.
Very situational to TKP up close.
But it is also a conditioning tool.
It might also not always be worth a quan player to use meter to get a rune trap off if he only has 1 meter, or even if he has 2.
The damage from ermac is usually higher then a rune trap sequence.

You can't count out that Quan with meter presents a threat and doing a TKP in range where he can get in and initiate is a problem... especially at the end of a round. Ermac doesn't get 40-50% from a naked lift.

Discussing the metagame makes me miss MK9 hardcore ;_;

 

[Death]

I think KL beats Quan 7-3 and Mileena beats Quan 6-4 IMO

 

[YOMI MITYEAP]

Reptile beats Quan 6 4. nuff said.

 

[zaf]

You can't count out that Quan with meter presents a threat and doing a TKP in range where he can get in and initiate is a problem... especially at the end of a round. Ermac doesn't get 40-50% from a naked lift.

Discussing the metagame makes me miss MK9 hardcore ;_;

He does present a threat, but using TKP up close is a training tool for them to sit there. Do it a couple times and you have a sitting duck.
Depending on how close it is done, you can always attempt to jump back to make whatever string quan uses whiff. At sweep range, you can usually TKP.... then jump back and iafb.
Or at a little outside of sweep range after a TKP, when quan rushes in, you can attempt to hit him in the face with a standing 1 before he gets something else out.

I never said ermac gets 40-50% off a naked lift. Most of the time the punishes to quan come from a string.
Any time a skydrop is blocked, that is 50% free. no meter.


Edit: It seems that most of the talking points is the rune trap for quan vs ermac. That tool is not enough for him to win the match up. If rune trap was so powerful quan would be a top 10 character. This tool is so situational

 

[DevilMaySpy]

Kitana is the MU i think ive played most over the last 3 years. I honestly think its 5-5. I see the argument for 6-4 but definitely not 7-3. Dont make me do a kitana gauntlet

Run it at SCR with @GGA 16 Bit

 

[16 Bit]

I've played him and Insuperable in casuals and tournament. It's a winning match for her.

 

[RM AtK!]

I agree with the smoke and ermac matchup being 5-5

you're on crack .. im a smoke main also, but i know smoke beats quan 6-4 i dont think its like 8-2 or something rediculous like most ppl say. it's def winning for smoke though slight adv 6-4. Quan has to take risk by going to smoke because quan cant zone with his skulls and he has no other long range attacks besides a teleport thats punishable.

 

[xKhaoTik]

Kitana is the MU i think ive played most over the last 3 years. I honestly think its 5-5. I see the argument for 6-4 but definitely not 7-3. Dont make me do a kitana gauntlet

OMG please do it. PLEASE



But how can you see this as 5-5? All you said was Quan can uppercut cutter on whiff. EVERYBODY can uppercut/punish cutter on whiff, so I guess everyone goes 5-5 with her huh?

You also said this is detailed but there is really No detail about this MU being discussed at all. Kitana has way better speed, footsies, damage, pokes, range, etc than Quan, which is why Kitana beats him upclose with no problem. From afar, she can play defense with iafs, not to zone, but to bait out sky drop and trance, which will be punished on block AND whiff. Skulls aren't anything to worry about in this match, so I don't see why that was even mentioned.

Then comes the rune trap. Quan is gonna have a hard time landing the rune trap on Kitana due to the fact that she does insane damage without meter. Two bnbs are Quan is dead, so he will have No choice but to break. Also, Kitana is going to have a lot of meter to spare in this match because she doesn't need to spend it at all unless she's punishing trance from outside f21 range, which means she's breaking the rune trap for free.


7-3 Man. It's baaaddddd lol.

 

[STB Shujinkydink]

OMG please do it. PLEASE



But how can you see this as 5-5? All you said was Quan can uppercut cutter on whiff. EVERYBODY can uppercut/punish cutter on whiff, so I guess everyone goes 5-5 with her huh?

You also said this is detailed but there is really No detail about this MU being discussed at all. Kitana has way better speed, footsies, damage, pokes, range, etc than Quan, which is why Kitana beats him upclose with no problem. From afar, she can play defense with iafs, not to zone, but to bait out sky drop and trance, which will be punished on block AND whiff. Skulls aren't anything to worry about in this match, so I don't see why that was even mentioned.

Then comes the rune trap. Quan is gonna have a hard time landing the rune trap on Kitana due to the fact that she does insane damage without meter. Two bnbs are Quan is dead, so he will have No choice but to break. Also, Kitana is going to have a lot of meter to spare in this match because she doesn't need to spend it at all unless she's punishing trance from outside f21 range, which means she's breaking the rune trap for free.


7-3 Man. It's baaaddddd lol.

There's no way it's 7-3. 6-4 would be the worst because of her meter less damage but she doesn't beat him that badly. And there's no way kl beats him 7-3 either lol that's ridiculous

 

[zaf]

Then comes the rune trap. Quan is gonna have a hard time landing the rune trap on Kitana due to the fact that she does insane damage without meter. Two bnbs are Quan is dead, so he will have No choice but to break. Also, Kitana is going to have a lot of meter to spare in this match because she doesn't need to spend it at all unless she's punishing trance from outside f21 range, which means she's breaking the rune trap for free.

this is the exact point I was making with ermac,

 

[Matix218]

you're on crack .. im a smoke main also, but i know smoke beats quan 6-4 i dont think its like 8-2 or something rediculous like most ppl say. it's def winning for smoke though slight adv 6-4. Quan has to take risk by going to smoke because quan cant zone with his skulls and he has no other long range attacks besides a teleport thats punishable.

So because quan cant zone its in smokes favor? No one can zone smoke. And quan can get in how everyone else gets in. Sb does no chip so he can take his time. Its not like he is forced to teleport

Edit: at absolute worst its 6-4 smoke only because of damage output for smoke but I dont see how it is clearly in smokes favor

 

[THTB]

Saw Reptile...

Smh.

 

[MKF30]

Nice list, that is one reason why I like using Scorp, Ermac against QC the past year or so. I noticed good Quans tend to give Sektor a rough time.

To the guy who said QC doesn't beat sektor, I disagree...Sektor may be faster and have better footsies but the trance has priority over EVERY Sektor move be it missle trades or even his teleport, thus giving QC a huge edge in this match up. And his shower missles don't always counter QC's tp due to QC's speed and ability to move him anywhere Unlike say KL's tp where he can only go one direction.

 

[STB Shujinkydink]

Reptile beats Quan 6 4. nuff said.

Saw Reptile...

Smh.

wheres the argument here?

 

[NKZero]

Nice list, that is one reason why I like using Scorp, Ermac against QC the past year or so. I noticed good Quans tend to give Sektor a rough time.

To the guy who said QC doesn't beat sektor, I disagree...Sektor may be faster and have better footsies but the trance has priority over EVERY Sektor move be it missle trades or even his teleport, thus giving QC a huge edge in this match up. And his shower missles don't always counter QC's tp due to QC's speed and ability to move him anywhere Unlike say KL's tp where he can only go one direction.

Sektor doesn't need to take risks. If Quan Chi throws out a trance he's as good as dead. Just stay outside trance range and zone, or just get in and use quicker strings to pressure Quan. Also, what is a shower missile? I agree if Quan gets the trance trade it obviously works to his advantage but Sektor doesn't need to risk throwing out missiles or flame burner etc. Not to mention, Sektor has a huge advantage on knockdown situations, considering he is one of the best set-up characters in the game on top of Quan Chi having one of the weakest wake-up games.

 

[TwiztidOne]

So because quan cant zone its in smokes favor? No one can zone smoke. And quan can get in how everyone else gets in. Sb does no chip so he can take his time. Its not like he is forced to teleport

Edit: at absolute worst its 6-4 smoke only because of damage output for smoke but I dont see how it is clearly in smokes favor

I think it's 7-3 at worst 6-4 at best(smoke's advantage) Quan chi has a tough time getting in on smoke because his best spacing string f12 is rather slow and very easy to whiff punish, also smoke's smoke bomb sucks quan chi right out of his teleport. Smoke can just smoke away all day and throw smoke bombs without having to worry about much, all quan can do is try to dash in and even when he does smoke can space him out with b2/d4. Quan can't really throw out trances either because smoke bomb punishes it full screen. Another thing to take into account is both of the characters damage. They're both capable of doing high damage but the difference between the two is smoke only needs 1 bar to get his 80%+ while quan has to use all 3 bars to get his full rune going for 90%+. This makes it harder for quan because when he is hit by smoke he is either force to break(and lose bar for his oh so needed rune trap) or take a lot of damage.

Overall i think this matchup is really bad for Quan Chi, smoke can just run away and build meter all day making getting in hell for Quan Chi, smoke also makes Quan chi break a lot which takes away the threat of quan's rune trap which is undoubtedly Quan's best tool. As of now I think this matchup is 7-3 smoke, but i can see it being 6-4 for sure. There is just no way I could ever see Quan chi going 5-5 with smoke.

 

[Matix218]

I think it's 7-3 at worst 6-4 at best(smoke's advantage) Quan chi has a tough time getting in on smoke because his best spacing string f12 is rather slow and very easy to whiff punish, also smoke's smoke bomb sucks quan chi right out of his teleport. Smoke can just smoke away all day and throw smoke bombs without having to worry about much, all quan can do is try to dash in and even when he does smoke can space him out with b2/d4. Quan can't really throw out trances either because smoke bomb punishes it full screen. Another thing to take into account is both of the characters damage. They're both capable of doing high damage but the difference between the two is smoke only needs 1 bar to get his 80%+ while quan has to use all 3 bars to get his full rune going for 90%+. This makes it harder for quan because when he is hit by smoke he is either force to break(and lose bar for his oh so needed rune trap) or take a lot of damage.

Overall i think this matchup is really bad for Quan Chi, smoke can just run away and build meter all day making getting in hell for Quan Chi, smoke also makes Quan chi break a lot which takes away the threat of quan's rune trap which is undoubtedly Quan's best tool. As of now I think this matchup is 7-3 smoke, but i can see it being 6-4 for sure. There is just no way I could ever see Quan chi going 5-5 with smoke.

Alright maybe you and the other poster are correct. I might not have played the matchup enough and may still be getting beat by some quan gimmicks enough to fool me into thinking 5-5. It appears you may know more than me in this matchup

 

[RM AtK!]

So because quan cant zone its in smokes favor? No one can zone smoke. And quan can get in how everyone else gets in. Sb does no chip so he can take his time. Its not like he is forced to teleport

Edit: at absolute worst its 6-4 smoke only because of damage output for smoke but I dont see how it is clearly in smokes favor

u can punish quan on blocked trance from any range... ur normals are way better then his. i can put a quan chi in pressure way longer then he can keep me in pressure if he doesnt have full meter. his mixups are slow and ez to block... if he jumps thats an ez instant anti air. his wakeups are pretty shitty.

im tellin u dood its def in smokes favor, but like i said its not a COMPLETE blowup like quans still viable in the matchup, but i have to admit it is in smoke favor

 

[RM AtK!]

Alright maybe you and the other poster are correct. I might not have played the matchup enough and may still be getting beat by some quan gimmicks enough to fool me into thinking 5-5. It appears you may know more than me in this matchup

btw i wasn't trying to be a dick or anything.. or try to put you on blast sorry. Quan chi is hard for anyone who doesnt know the matchup well, but once u learn his strings and gimmick and how he works you'll see that u can beat him fairly easily

 

[STB Shujinkydink]

u can punish quan on blocked trance from any range... ur normals are way better then his. i can put a quan chi in pressure way longer then he can keep me in pressure if he doesnt have full meter. his mixups are slow and ez to block... if he jumps thats an ez instant anti air. his wakeups are pretty shitty.

im tellin u dood its def in smokes favor, but like i said its not a COMPLETE blowup like quans still viable in the matchup, but i have to admit it is in smoke favor

Im curious as to which quans youve played. If it wasnt me or soup arguments will be invalid

 

[RM AtK!]

Im curious as to which quans youve played. If it wasnt me or soup arguments will be invalid

sorry ive never played you or him but my friend has played sup and he thinks the match is actually more along 7-3 @xSMoKEx and why would my arguement be invalid.. we arent talkin about players or tournaments etc etc.. we are talkin about matchups between characters.

 

[RM_Gamer]

Because of walk speed? Lol. Ok smoke has way better footsies, has way more meter adv which means quan's whole rune trap game is irrelevant. Blocked trance or tele = 80%
Blocked trance at max distance = sb punish for 31 or more with reset. His mix ups r ass and can be reacted easily offline. Better footsies, anti zoning, more meter, better normals, great meterless damage and resets which force u to break and if u don't then it's ur funeral. Now please tell me something other than walk speed that could at least make this match up 7-3 smoke cuz it looks like 8-2. Quan has NOTHING on smoke