The sad state of UMK3, and the re-emergence of MK2

[MKK hanzo]

WOW

I swear, most of the time I spent reading this thread, I felt like I was at old shoryuken forums, except for the ignorance. You guys indeed know the game, but...

"the sad state of umk3"? you mean the sad state of most of UMK3 players, right?
I'm happy I'm not there, and watch UMK3 goes to hell 'cause the players won't adapt and whine over a tactic that doesn't ruin the game at all. Is it broken? oh hell yes and that's the fun part because everyone can use it (but they won't). Is that some sort of moral code or something? "I wanna win playing the right way"?

I know most of people at the start say "this is stupid!" some others (like myself, at the beggining) say "pfff I see no advantage in that, who would fall for that?" but when you actually try it, it's hilarious, who doesn't love raping someone with something they don't understand? JAJA

BUT, the real fun starts when EVERYONE starts using it, you can't just do the same shit to a GJabber (but you can against a non GJabber, and that's what makes the game boring to watch). Players start fighting over territory, you don't need "BASIC" spacing knowledge JAJAJAJA you have to master spacing, zoning, baiting, speed, reaction, execution and that takes practice and discipline. I understand if someone doesn't have that much time to put into the game. But hey, at least try it!

And about that MK2 "hype" moment? make no mistake, I'm not dissing/bashing on Summoning, I know he's a fine player (I love his UMK3 kung lao!) but... why in the hell would someone be that over confident to throw some random tele kicks on a NINJA? those RH are golden! I know that and I'm not a good MK2 player... props to Summoning for this timing and his reactions, but that tele kicks were a stupid mistake and THAT doesn't make MK2 better than UMK3.

I guess you guys are gonna go your own way anyways so I won't waste anymore time in this, do what you gotta do, like I said I'm happy here in Colombia the people who are still playing UMK3 are ADAPTING.

Grinder this is why I love you (no homo). But well I guess this is good bye then to my dream of a worldwide umk3 tourney and traveling to the US...

Chile and Colombia there I go!

Umk3 is life! as Shock will proudly say!

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[ded]

"all you need to win in umk3 are karajabs" - thats the most stupid thing i've heard about this game.

edit: i have cool sig btw ^_^

 

[AREZ God of War]

"all you need to win in umk3 are karajabs" - thats the most stupid thing i've heard about this game.

edit: i have cool sig btw ^_^

But uhm........*leans closer*

(whispers) It's true

 

[9.95]

NinjaGrinder I think the point here is that the game has changed DRASTICALLY from where it was a year and a half ago. The game that I love is not the same game played today, and adapting to the NEW UMK3 means playing a different game with the same characters.

Think about this for a second. Lets say you never played UMK3 before and someone approached you and presented you with a fighting game and gave you two ways to play:

1. Multiple options available, combos mean something, footsies, spacing, baits, reads, necessary to understand frame data, punishing on recovery frames, using just frames moves, zoning, specials mean something.

2. Using only 3 of the available 6 buttons available to perform an overwhelmingly dominant and repetitive tactic, no need to use specials in the game, ability to attack and defend AT THE SAME TIME.


If I was ever approached with the two options above, I'd smack the person just for insulting my intelligence by presenting me with option #2.

I also have attempted to learn the kara-jab game, and it bored me to tears, just as it did REO and AC1984.


The problem I have is two-fold:

1. Only the Kara-Jabbers think UMK3 is fun anymore... and there's like what, 8 of you worldwide?

2. I respect the "playing to win" mindset so I would never stop someone from doing them...

 

[ded]

but... an year ago, you said that about blocking punches? thats weird... time heals i guess (to Arez)

 

[Panque]

The Kara jabs ARE stupid and it's something that kills the hype of the game. Do you think that someone would watch UFC if all they did was jab each other to death? If players adapt, it means the game gets even more boring. Don't get me wrong, I love umk3, i can say even that this was the first fighting game that ever got me salty or really happy for my wins, but these jabs turn streams into shitfests. Might be fun for who is playing, but it definitively isn't that fun to watch, no matter how much skill is involved.

 

[9.95]

but... an year ago, you said that about blocking punches? thats weird... time heals i guess

I'm pretty much done with this argument.

Zaq pretty much put it right when he said:

Any fastest universal normal that allows movement, allows you to block and give damage and nullifies the majority of the special attacks is mathematically broken no matter how you justify it. You can argue that the game is still playable or that it is fun for you personally, but you CANNOT argue that it makes it a better game than if the specials were useful unless you felt that having specials in a fighter breaks the game. Armor shouldn't be accessible during 98% of the game.

Though the Kara-Jabbers want to defend the tactic by saying all the right things:

"Players have to learn to adapt"
"Players have to level up"
"Play to win"
"Can't blame us for being better"

Your argument falls flat because you're trying to defend a broken mechanic. NO FIGHTING GAME SHOULD EVER HAVE THE ABILITY TO ATTACK AND DEFEND AT THE SAME TIME. It is inherently flawed, and the argument for it is inherently flawed as well.

That said, continue to play UMK3 the way you want, I will never argue against that. I will support it by running it at tournaments, streaming it and playing it casually, but I am officially retired from the UMKJ3 tournament scene.

 

[ded]

i dont want to interfere in usa point of view and how most of you guys see the game, but i'm telling you guys, there is a level above kara-jabbing in this game.

 

[AREZ God of War]

i dont want to interfere in usa point of view and how most of you guys see the game, but i'm telling you guys, there is a level above kara-jabbing in this game.

Which would be............????

 

[summoning]

I just think its harder to win at high level mk2, umk3 is alot about the jab pressure , so if you have good jabbers , be it kara jabs or run jabs , those people have a clear advantage over a player like me . I simply dont do them ,thats probably why i lose alot

to me it takes away from the game, most people will trap me in the corner to win. Im pretty good at this game when im not smothered with cheapness as i call it , the 2 button salute

 

[MKK hanzo]

Isnt mvc3 vanilla broken? Arcade edition vanilla? Well not broken but with op aspects. Dark Phoenix killing 3 chars in 8 seconds with almost no chance of retaliation...

What did the players? Not the forum dwellers, the REAL PLAYERS. Viscant, Wong, Prrog, Combofiend etc?

I.did not.see them quit.

Well as Ded says, this dont discourage me in any way. Ill keep playin umk3


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[AREZ God of War]

Isnt mvc3 vanilla broken? Arcade edition vanilla? Well not broken but with op aspects. Dark Phoenix killing 3 chars in 8 seconds with almost no chance of retaliation...

What did the players? Not the forum dwellers, the REAL PLAYERS. Viscant, Wong, Prrog, Combofiend etc?

I.did not.see them quit.

Well as Ded says, this dont discourage me in any way. Ill keep playin umk3


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LOL Dude, that's a horrible example from a cross-over game w/ a history of alot of broken and not-good for much besides casual fun. I will NEVER understand how those POS games made their way into being taken serious enough to play at a competitive level. I'd rather play MvC1 LOL

 

[ded]

Arez, play to see man ;]

 

[Vulcan Hades]

I'm sorry, but since when are kara-jabs considered like a cheap tactic? I used to play this game at high level and every good player used kara-jabs back then. No one complained because it was just a smart thing to do.

To me someone complaining about kara jabs is like people complaining about Ryu spamming hadokens or the option-selects in sf4. In other words people who don't want to adapt to the combat system but still want to win.

Are you guys sure that kara-jabs are the real problem and not the fact that Noob has 50% more health and faster movement? Or Kabal/Smoke being a little too good for every other character?

Anyway, I agree that UMK3 tournaments are not too exiting to watch. Especially for 90% of people who don't even understand what's going on. Most of them just see people running and jabbing like they have no idea how to play fighting games. Very fun game to play though.

 

[AREZ God of War]

Arez, play to see man ;]

LOL let's P2P then, damn you i can beat Simon to an extent...i won't be totally boring to you, man.....plus I can use everyone.

I'm sorry, but since when are kara-jabs considered like a cheap tactic? I used to play this game at high level and every good player used kara-jabs back then. No one complained because it was just a smart thing to do.

Play me then, I want to see your idea of "high-level" UMK3 even though I never heard of you.

 

[Panque]

Maybe if it was a 17 yo game with a small tournament scene without the perspective of any possible fix for the broken stuff in the future, they would drop it? They could easily just ban Dark Phoenix too, while you can ban jabs in UMK3 lol

 

[MKK hanzo]

LOL Dude, that's a horrible example from a cross-over game w/ a history of alot of broken and not-good for much besides casual fun. I will NEVER understand how those POS games made their way into being taken serious enough to play at a competitive level. I'd rather play MvC1 LOL

Those games are pos yes, but see how much play they get. See the level of the players. That is what count imo.

Vulcan: exactly my thoughts.

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[ded]

LOL let's P2P then, damn you i can beat Simon to an extent...i won't be totally boring to you, man.....plus I can use everyone.

I dont think playing with huge delay will change your opinion man. And who said it will be boring? It will be pleasure to play against you guys some day, but UMK3 is very VERY capricious game, and everything above 5ms makes me playing the game like its for first time lol

 

[AREZ God of War]

Maybe if it was a 17 yo game with a small tournament scene without the perspective of any possible fix for the broken stuff in the future, they would drop it? They could easily just ban Dark Phoenix too, while you can ban jabs in UMK3 lol

That's the problem, we can't ban them. Best we can do is a soft-ban since there is no real way to enforce it. This is why it needs an HDR. I'm about to make a poll for "Soft-banning" any type of block-jabs, cuz I don't see how anyone in their right-mind could justify attacking while blocking high AND low all at once.

 

[AREZ God of War]

I dont think playing with huge delay will change your opinion man. And who said it will be boring? It will be pleasure to play against you guys some day, but UMK3 is very VERY capricious game, and everything above 5ms makes me playing the game like its for first time lol

it's ok man, I just want the experience of playing Ded. You're a legend to us lowly American players HAHA

 

[NinjaGrinder]

Phil says 8 people in the WORLD? come on, no need to make false statement just to "prove" your point.

And I said "yes, it is broken" didn't I? but that doesn't bore me or make me wanna quit the game. Do you feel that way? fine but man, you're a community leader, you're supposed to help/support/show sutff to players, don't let your personal experience affect the game's live. I know what its like, I'm am too some sort of a leader here, I promote the game, I teach people everything I know, I run tournaments and I don't want just more people playing the game. I want more people playing it WELL. It's a shame that you Phil, are doing this. Remember when Shock made a thread about glitch jabs counters? he was helping people, "calming" them down, he was saying "don't sweat, we can beat this" because he truly LOVES the game. I don't know his position right now, but when that kid igotbass rape his win to the tournament, Shock didn't give up and mostly, he didn't talk so much shit about UMK3 like you're doing now.

Then again, your tournaments, your scene, your players, your way. Happily here no one thinks that way (at least noone good at the game -the point most of the times)

 

[THTB]

I don't even see how kara jabbing is being defended at this point. I can't even begin to understand why the thought of being capable of attacking with an amazing pressure option while blocking at the same time is even something considered deep.

AE may have had OP characters, but the game isn't dull because of a single dominating option the entire cast has access to. That's the difference.

 

[REO]

Why is Noob broken? He has no specials and gets owned by zoning. All he has are block jabs and faster walking speed than Human Smoke.

 

[9.95]

Arez, no need to waste your time on a poll... you can't enforce it no matter what.

Also, let me clear something up:

I am not on a crusade to ban kara jabs.
I am not on a crusade to change the way the game is played now.

What I am doing, is letting people know the current state of the game, and what they would be getting themselves into if they were to choose to play this game. Before buying into the hype of UMK3, people have the right to know that at the highest level this game breaks down to jabbing and spacing. I have archived proof of it.

Players deserve an honest and fair look at a game before choosing to play it. Now they have it.

Play whatever you want whatever way you want...I will NEVER argue against that.

 

[MKK hanzo]

I don't even see how kara jabbing is being defended at this point. I can't even begin to understand why the thought of being capable of attacking with an amazing pressure option while blocking at the same time is even something considered deep.

AE may have had OP characters, but the game isn't dull because of a single dominating option the entire cast has access to. That's the difference.

All guilty gear games have hundreds of attacking options, few defensive ones. You have to be GOOD to deal with all the bs gg has.

Same applies in umk.

Btw off topic. Im seriously thinking that mk9 did have the same effect on players that sf4 had. This may be the cause of all this ruckus about gjabs.

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