Discussion Patches overwhelmingly help NRS games not hurt them

[xWildx]

NRS games have been at EVO for 5 years straight. Mr wizard literally stated that the patches saved Injustice for EVO. We have heard that our games will die off every single time and the only times they die is when a new one comes to take their place. Please stop spreading this propaganda about how our game will die when history has proven it wont.

The only reason NRS games haven't died is BECAUSE of the hype for the newest game coming down the line. Please think about that before you go posting nonsensical rhetoric about the longevity of the these games that die off as soon as the shiny, new model reveals itself to the crowd.

It's simply not the same as SF4 and the like that continue to be supported years later of their own volition.

 

[Smarrgasm]

The only reason NRS games haven't died is BECAUSE of the hype for the newest game coming down the line. Please think about that before you go posting nonsensical rhetoric about the longevity of the these games that die off as soon as the shiny, new model reveals itself to the crowd.

It's simply not the same as SF4 and the like that continue to be supported years later of their own volition.

I disagree. The EVO where injustice was released MK9 still had a strong showing and was heavily supported. Dont assume the game would have died. People were still supporting MK9 at majors for some time after injustices release.

 

[coolwhip]

.

I respect that you went into so much detail but quick two things to dispute the two main points of contention:

1- In the "data" gathered for this thread, we're not saying "oh this is a good patch because X character is broke so this helps the game" right after a patch is made. We're discussing Injustice with the benefit of hindsight, after playing the game for two years. So these assessments are taking place after the game is fleshed out. Now, you can say MKX is not fleshed out and is only a 3 months old game, and you'd be right, but I think the point is that since NRS were so on point (for the most part) with their Injustice patches, that maybe they know what they're doing and generally have an understanding about what needs to be buffed/toned down.

2- You say you're quitting after EVO due to all the patches. Obviously that's your prerogative, but if the main complaint is patching, it's odd to quit after said frequent patching more or less stops, or at least, decreases significantly.

 

[Undeadjim]

That was all fine and dandy but MMH could end combos with them for a free 20% damage increase. That was why they were broken.

Without going into detail of other characters great uses of interactables (A small change to MMH could of resolved this particular issue) I'm more using them as an example to discuss this whole patch early vs wait argument. We let some of this stuff stew over the two years when people were bringing up quite early on about how good some characters could make use of them. However it could of been the two years of Injustices lifespan that lead to the more balanced MKX interactables.

 

[Sage Leviathan]

If I were to give my opinion on the matter, it would only be a verbatim retelling of the thread title.

 

[Big Pampering]

And he was dropping alot of things because of the chanages & it cost him rounds. Also fucking congrats , you enjoy the game & patching style, that's great, but it doesn't invalidate those who like the game but do not like the patching schedule.

I'm sorry NRS had to keep a huge group of players instead of the handful of players that might stick with the game for a year.

 

[Hellbringer]

lol this thread was a good read. Interesting that usually the ppl who start insulting and are the loudest are the ones who probably arent good at the game. Just my 2 cents

 

[50 Shades of Shut Up]

Oh, i wonder what those players that dropped the game were thinking?

"NRS is actively trying to improve your experience with this game by fixing and balancing out some things. That's unacceptable. I'm dropping this shit for good."

So stupid. You don't have to actually "re-learn" this game from scratch after every patch. Taking some notes to adjust your game plan is enough. Solid characters remained solid and some garbage characters became ok-ish.

There were very few times where i looked at patch notes and thought "I disagree with this changes, that is bullshit". #F34NeverForget

You can blow up NRS for dozens of reasons, but i don't feel like patching is one of them.

 

[Rude]

Theyre spouting bullshit for job security. People should understand that before entering into an argument with them.

Slips doesn't work for NRS.

And Chicago hasn't stopped playing MK X, or do you not pay attention to GBS?

PPJ and 16 Bit don't compete because they're not allowed to.

Quit scare mongering. We get it, you wanted MK X to be like MK9. It isn't. Get over it and quit spreading bullshit.

 

[BillStickers]

NRS games have been at EVO for 5 years straight. Mr wizard literally stated that the patches saved Injustice for EVO. We have heard that our games will die off every single time and the only times they die is when a new one comes to take their place. Please stop spreading this propaganda about how our game will die when history has proven it wont.

You're leaving out how Injustice wasn't even announced at Evo year one, then NRS threatened a boycott/smear campaign on the tournament, which forced them to go back and include it.

 

[Sh1nkobi]

Guys we cant have it both ways. Make up your mind. Were injustice or mk9 ruined by not patching, which is an example of why patches should happen, or are the games still played, as an argument they were never ruined in the first place. A lot of you keep using two opposing arguments within 3 posts of eachother when its convenient. Long term patching works, short term rapid patching does not, if you agree with this then you agree with everyone who is complaining about it in this thread.

 

[rev0lver]

And he was dropping alot of things because of the chanages & it cost him rounds. Also fucking congrats , you enjoy the game & patching style, that's great, but it doesn't invalidate those who like the game but do not like the patching schedule.

He's referring to the earlier June patch, not the one that made her combos harder. And he's referring to Floe, who's just complaining instead of making slight adjustments that the other Dvorah players do.

Something else I want to say, I'm sorry if it sounds offensive to him but I really don't give a fuck if Viscant and Floe stop playing our game if it means the game itself is better for it. The only reason any of us care is the twitter mudslinging. I think one of the main things getting lost here is that if this game was more like day 1 right now, this game would be ass. Evo would be ass. I'll take a few people leaving, who aren't dedicated to the game enough to make small adjustments, than having to play a broken game.

 

[rev0lver]

You're leaving out how Injustice wasn't even announced at Evo year one, then NRS threatened a boycott/smear campaign on the tournament, which forced them to go back and include it.

What are you talking about? Are you using Jamessmk conspiracy theories now?

 

[Vilén]

Still laughing that almost 30 pages deep in this cesspit and people still haven't admitted that both sides of this argument are valid.

Because this is TYM where opinions follow the rules of Highlander.

Seriously people, lighten the fuck up. All fighting game developers are huge assholes about all things related to their game. You have a company like NRS (who at this point I'm starting to wonder if they don't intentionally make shitty games just to justify the patch schedule) that actually incorporates player feedback into the game code in real time for free. Then you have a developer like Capcom that ignores EVERYTHING and releases a new iteration for 40 bucks that ignores basically goddamn everything anybody disliked about the last game because it's a whole new game with whole new issues.

It's up to people to choose what they like better, the developer that lets you dance on broken glass until it's all powdery and doesn't really hurt anymore before they put new broken glass in there, or the developer that lets you dance on broken glass, tries to sweep out the sharpest pieces, and then next game instead of broken glass, it's rusty nails, but they'll try to sweep those out too.

Also, not to be mistaken for a Capcom fan but the reason Capcom can get away with not patching shit constantly is because they straight up don't need to because their game is objectively more stable and thought out from square one. Whether or not it's fun to play is a different discussion, but they are better balanced just from the get go.

Patching = good, like, objectively good. People who act like it's a bad thing are either a) total assholes or b) really complaining about the frequency of patching. Complaints about the frequency of patching are misguided because the real complaint is that "even the fanbase hates the way this fuckin' game plays, I'mma go back to my STABLE game"

Let's not pretend any of these patches were unnecessary. That's the point. People are leaving the game because it needed life support at launch. It's like betting on a horse named Mr. MaGlue.

I don't even play the game anymore because it's a huge piece of shit that NEEDED all this patching just to get halfway okay. The only reason I'm still posting here is because TYM and these discussions are infinitely more fun than MKX could ever be.

Of course, it's all a joke because if they spent half the time patching the netcode as they do converting twitterbitching into lines of code, I'd have absolutely NEVER stopped playing.

 

[rev0lver]

"We're making an executive decision - we have decided you aren't allowed to work on this game because we don't want it to be good and make us more money, at the cost of literally nothing on our end"

This literally makes no sense. Your post is very wrong. If there is no patching after 6 months, it's because NRS has decided they no longer care.

Tbh this doesn't make sense. The number of copies a fighting game sells from becoming balanced 6 months down the line is insignificant. The people who actually care or even understand that kind of stuff is such a small percentage of their sales. They make a lot more money putting out new games, which is why they stop, put out an ultimate edition type thing, and work full-time on the next game.

Paulo and John spend a ton of time watching tournaments, browsing TYM, and interacting with us. I'm sure they'd like to perfect their games, but it's not up to them.

 

[buyacushun]

Made a good point that others have already stated.

No one is saying some patches don't work out. It's just some people would like a chance to try and make it work before it gets changed. And when you do that you HAVE to make changes to whatever strategy you were using. Whether it was how to play your character or how to play against another character. The quick patching of obvious exploits and the like should go. Meter glitches and infinites get all those out. But there something to say about giving a character +24 after something and realizing later how plain and straightforward that makes things. I'm not saying NRS needs to patch like Capcom but they can definitely do a better job before release and after. When someone feels wronged it's not really easy to just accept "Don't worry the thing you don't like is only gonna happen for like 6 months. So just stay." Especially with the quantity of good fighters out there now.

I think that's the thread we should have. Not that the patches work or don't work. But that there are obvious issues with it that if we brought to NRS maybe we wouldn't even have this discussion.

Also, if you change a character's frames or give them one new move that can drastically change a MU. Everyone as seen it before. Which could also be why some players feel like they have to learn everything all over. What was once safe to do might not be any longer and your opponent might gain new tactics.

 

[Slips]

Since Viscant is too good to address me personally, even after welcoming him to this site and to the friendly little debate we have here, I guess I'll talk to him in the 3rd person as well.

1. Viscant says Tanya might not have been 'broke' (A term we do use loosely, but I think he's taking too literal) because Grandmaster Sub seemed to do well against her. I know back in the MvC2 days this would be a valid argument because she'd have a counter and that is his sense of balance. But to us, that is batshit crazy. The entire community shouldn't have to learn Grandmaster Sub because Tanya is out of control. That is not balance. Balance is being able to pick whatever character you want and have a reasonable chance to beat any character picked against you. To us, the standards are higher these days.

2. I'm not sure how or why Viscant can say the patching strategy failed at CEO. Yea, Tanya was nerfed previously before CEO and she still dominated the tournament. So we should've left Tanya the way she was? Even MORE broke and that would've proven patches are fine? Wouldn't she have just dominated even more? I don't even understand how that argument makes sense.

3. Viscant mentions how Fisticuffs Johnny got nerfed and he believes the reason was because NRS didn't want people to laugh at their game. Or, maybe it was nerfed because it really was too powerful. It was looked into. Some characters who didn't have good armor, slow pokes and had a beefy hitbox could do next to nothing to get out of his b12121 in the corner. Characters like Quan Chi, Erron Black, Takeda, ect. literally had to block about ten b12's and at any point Cage could stagger them, reset the spacing to do 10 more, an overhead that launches or a low that would also reset the b1212 guessing game. There are only so many options. There is this thing called training mode where we can record how to deal with these types of things and explore your options and for some characters the guessing game was not reasonable to get out of.

But maybe Viscant is right. Maybe 3 years from now we'll find a glitch where you can use a just frame block breaker with no meter on the 13th frame of block stun that the devs didn't know about and it'll all be ok. Lets wait and see! rollseyes:

4. Injustice and MK9 didn't die because they were awful games. They died because new ones came out. Actually, MK9 still had a decent following deep into Injustice's lifespan, but please continue to tell us about our own communty's history. It's not condescending at all. Yes, UMvC3 and SFIV are still being played. They are still going. Why? Because there aren't any sequels to them released yet. Does anyone think SFIV is gonna have 3000 entrants when SFV drops? Does anyone think UMvC3 will have 800 entrants if MvC4 dropped? Hell no. 3rd Strike, MvC2 and ST are considered to be some of Capcom's masterpieces. So why aren't we seeing 3000 entrees for these games? Because they are old and there are newer versions. This argument is a cheap shot. We don't play MK9 and Injustice anymore because they aren't good or because they patched too much. We don't play because we're supporting NRS's new game.


5. Viscant next goes into how his matchup strategy versus D'Vorah has changed because D'Vorah's f1 changed on block. The thing is, this change happened in Sonya's favor and he's acting like it's a BAD thing. Viscant says he tries and keep her at the tip of Sonya's f2 range because if she got in range of D'Vorah's f1 she'd be in trouble. How has that changed? D'Vorah still gets the advantage after f1 on block, we still have to guess. It's still not in anyone's favor to just sit back and block D'Vorah's pressure and mixups all day. The patch allows us to armor out of the overhead to make it more risky for HER to do and he's acting like his world has turned upside down. This stuff isn't hard to understand. Are NRS players just smarter than Viscant? Like seriously wtf.

I love how he says he saw a Quan Chi uppercut in between KL's mb hat into a string and asked, 'Can Sonya do that? I don't know,' like it's gonna be the next segment on Robert Stack's Unsolved Mysteries. Well that's what training mode is for dude. It will literally take 3 minutes or less to answer that question. But I guess it's easier to never look into it, lose to someone in a tournament and blame NRS for patching something that actually made it easier on you. For someone who says they are trying to play our game seriously, that's incredibly lazy and is evidence he's clearly not.

6. Viscant self proclaimed himself to better at assessing character balance better than most, but can't read some basic changes in the patch notes and not understand what they mean and how they change things? These are the Capcom players we all look up to and strive to become? I understand the slightest change can change things dramatically, but most of these changes it's pretty obvious what the designer is looking for. He doesn't want D'Vorah to be able to f1 and get 40% on hit and on block jail into a 50/50. He doesn't want Kung Lao or Shinnok to meterburn their moves to give them +20 something to create ridiculous pressure and guessing games. He doesn't want Scorpion to loop his 214 into more block pressure of 50/50. I could go on, but you all know what I mean.

I am grateful for these changes. That stupid broke- *ahem* I mean "Top Tier meta" is not fun to play against and is the type of stuff that makes people not want to play because of how insane it is. We should be THANKING Paulo for making these changes. Not crucifying him. The game is better, more fun and more balanced because of them.

And finally, Viscant comes down from the clouds to preach his heavenly wisdom about what it takes to be a top player at a game. Because you know, we as NRS players don't REALLY know what it's like to be top players. For some reason we NRS players don't mind adjusting a couple of our strategy's with our character or against one every few weeks when a patch comes out. But it is for him. For some reason we have a higher work ethic than the great Viscant. Why is that? Because this is our main game. This is our passion project. We love Mortal Kombat. We love the character we play with and we want to represent them. But if we know our favorite character's are useless in tournament play we would stop playing. And that's why we love the patches. And that's why other community's need to stfu about them. Sorry our standard for balance is higher than theirs.

And I would like to take a moment to defend NRS players and their skill level. I came from Tekken. Throughout my career in Tekken I won 7 majors from TTT1 through TTT2. (5 straight in TTT1) I have either won or placed top 8 in 20 other Tekken tournaments that were either on the regional level or higher. I've made top 8 at Evo 3x. I went to Japan during the peak of T5: Dark Resurrection and beat everyone I played except the #1 player in Japan and barely lost. I've won regionals in Soul Caliber and Mortal Kombat 9 and have been respectable in other games. NRS players are as good as they come. They're just as smart and talented as anyone I've played. I think I, and all the NRS players deserve a little more respect than to come in here and assume we don't know how the meta of fighting games work and what it takes to be a top player.

UltraDavid wants to act like there isn't a scent of arrogance that Capcom players hold over us. I don't know about you guys, but it stinks in here.

 

[The Highlander]

Because this is TYM where opinions follow the rules of Highlander.

Damn right they do.

 

[GAV]

 

[juicepouch]

Theyre spouting bullshit for job security. People should understand that before entering into an argument with them.

jesus take off your tinfoil hat please

 

[sinosleep]

I think NRS having a substantially faster sequel cycle than capcom has a FAR bigger affect on who comes and goes than patch cycles do.

 

[Juggs]

making Shinnok's hellsparks MB on block to be +24, only to change it within weeks to +14, is at least sloppy. Right, but sloppy. They need to put more thought in these things.

Shinnok's MB Hellsparks being +24 on block wasn't "too good" until he got the other buffs. Or rather, if that was the only buff he got, it would be fine. That buff itself wasn't a mistake, it was just made too good by the other buffs he got.

 

[BillStickers]

Since Viscant is too good to address me personally, even after welcoming him to this site and friendly little debate we have here, so I guess I'll talk to him in the 3rd person as well.

1. Viscant says Tanya might not have been 'broke' (A term we do use loosely, but I think he's taking too literal) because Grandmaster Sub seemed to do well against her. I know back in the MvC2 days this would be a valid argument because she'd have a counter and that is his sense of balance. But to us, that is batshit crazy. The entire community shouldn't have to learn Grandmaster Sub because Tanya is out of control. That is not balance. Balance is being able to pick whatever character you want and have a reasonable chance to beat any character picked against you. To us, the standards are higher these days.

2. I'm not sure how or why Viscant can say the patching strategy failed at CEO. Yea, Tanya was nerfed previously before CEO and she still dominated the tournament. So we should've left Tanya the way she was? Even MORE broke and that would've proven patches are fine? Wouldn't she have just dominated even more? I don't even understand how that argument makes sense.

3. Viscant mentions how Fisticuffs Johnny got nerfed and he believes the reason was because NRS didn't want people to laugh at their game. Or, maybe it was nerfed because it really was too powerful. It was looked into. Some characters who didn't have good armor, slow pokes and had a beefy hitbox could do next to nothing to get out of his b12121 in the corner. Characters like Quan Chi, Erron Black, Takeda, ect. literally had to block about ten b12's and at any point Cage could stagger them, reset the spacing to do 10 more, an overhead that launches or a low that would also reset the b1212 guessing game. There are only so many options. There is this thing called training mode where we can record how to deal with these types of things and explore your options and for some characters the guessing game was not reasonable to get out of.

But maybe Viscant is right. Maybe 3 years from now we'll find a glitch where you can use a just frame block breaker with no meter on the 13th frame of block stun that the devs didn't know about and it'll all be ok. Lets wait and see! rollseyes:

4. Injustice and MK9 didn't die because they were awful games. They died because new ones came out. Actually, MK9 still had a decent following deep into Injustice's lifespan, but please continue to tell us about our own communty's history. It's not condescending at all. Yes, UMvC3 and SFIV are still being played. They are still going. Why? Because there aren't any sequels to them released yet. Does anyone think SFIV is gonna have 3000 entrants when SFV drops? Does anyone think UMvC3 will have 800 entrants if MvC4 dropped? Hell no. 3rd Strike, MvC2 and ST are considered to be some of Capcom's masterpieces. So why aren't we seeing 3000 entrees for these games? Because they are old and there are newer versions. This argument is a cheap shot. We don't play MK9 and Injustice anymore because they aren't good or because they patched too much. We don't play because we're supporting NRS's new game.


5. Viscant next goes into how his matchup strategy versus D'Vorah has changed because D'Vorah's f1 changed on block. The thing is, this change happened in Sonya's favor and he's acting like it's a BAD thing. Viscant says he tries and keep her at the tip of your f2 range because if Sonya got in range of D'Vorah's f1 she'd be in trouble. How has that changed? D'Vorah still gets the advantage after f1 on block, we still have to guess. It's still not in anyone's favor to just sit back and block D'Vorah's pressure and mixups all day. The patch allows us to armor out of the overhead to make it more risky for HER to do and he's acting like his world has turned upside down. This stuff isn't hard to understand. Are NRS players just smarter than Viscant? Like seriously wtf.

I love how says he saw a Quan Chi uppercut in between KL's mb hat into a string and asked, 'Can Sonya do that? I don't know,' like it's gonna be the next segment on Robert Stack's Unsolved Mysteries. Well that's what training mode is for dude. It will literally take 3 minutes or less to answer that question. But I guess it's easier to never look into it, lose to someone in a tournament and blame NRS for patching something that actually made it easier on you. For someone who says they are trying to play our game seriously, that's incredibly lazy and is evidence he's clearly not.

6. Viscant self proclaimed himself to better at assessing character balance better than most, but can't read some basic changes in the patch notes and not understand what they mean and how they change things? These are the Capcom players we all look up to and strive to become? I understand the slightest change can things dramatically, but most of these changes it's pretty obvious why they were changed and what the designer is looking for. He doesn't want D'Vorah to be able to f1 and get 40% on hit and on block jail into a 50/50. He doesn't want Kung Lao or Shinnok to meterburn their moves to give them +20 something to create ridiculous pressure and guessing games. He doesn't want Scorpion to loop his 214 into more block pressure of 50/50. I could go on, but you all know what I mean.

I am grateful for these changes. That stupid broke- *ahem* I mean "Top Tier meta" is not fun to play against and is the type of stuff that makes people not want to play because of how insane it is. We should be THANKING Paulo for making these changes. Not crucifying him. The game is better, more fun and more balanced because of them.

And finally, Viscant comes down from the clouds to preach his heavenly wisdom about what it takes to be a top player at a game. Because you know, we as NRS players don't REALLY know what it's like to be top players. For some reason we NRS players don't mind adjusting a couple of our strategy's with our character or against one every few weeks when a patch comes out. But it is for him. For some reason we have a higher work ethic than the great Viscant. Why is that? Because this is our main game. This is our passion project. We love Mortal Kombat. We love the character we play with and we want to represent them. But if we know our favorite character's are useless in tournament play we would stop playing. And that's why we love the patches. And that's why other community's need to stfu about them. Sorry our standard for balance is higher than theirs.

And I would like to take a moment to defend NRS players and their skill level. I came from Tekken. Throughout my career in Tekken I won 7 majors from TTT1 through TTT2. (5 straight in TTT1) I have either won or placed top 8 in 20 other Tekken tournaments that were either on the regional level or higher. I've made top 8 at Evo 3x. I went to Japan during the peak of T5: Dark Resurrection and beat everyone I played except the #1 player in Japan and barely lost. I've won regionals in Soul Caliber and Mortal Kombat 9 and have been respectable in other games. NRS players are as good as they come. They're just as smart and talented as anyone I've played. I think I, and all the NRS players deserve a little more respect than to come in here and assume we don't know how the meta of fighting games work and what it takes to be a top player.

UltraDavid wants to act like there isn't a scent of arrogance that Capcom players hold over us. I don't know about you guys, but it stinks in here.

See, fisticuffs cage would have been fine if only Quan and erron were the problems, but because takeda is such a poorly designed character, we have to make a massive nerf like having all hits of b121 being -3. Even for shit tier Mileena, learning how to deal with fisticuffs took about 2 seconds. My issue with the patches is that they're all about removing the dynamism from the game and focusing waaaaay more on nerfs than buffing the low tiers, which is the exact argument of what Ed Boon himself said he'd do.

Which brings us to the bigger point: why is NRS nerfing the fundamental tools of these characters? The frame data is available to them; they ostensibly understand the game they're making, so why is it that Liu Kang keeps swinging up and down the tier list with every patch? why wasn't Tanya's potential broken movelist caught early on? why was swarm queen deemed "too good" after 2 months when that's literally how they designed the game?

I think the very base issue is that this game was very poorly planned and executed and focused way more on business opportunities (microtransactions, preorder characters, country themed DLC costumes, etc.) than actual gameplay. The sales potential of keeping the game on Unreal Engine 3 and porting to previous-gen totally backfired as well, so we have a game that is literally so monkey patched to death that it can't be ported easily and also suffers from last gen issues like horrific netcode.

The rapid patching is merely symptomatic of a much deeper illness, and it's not worth investing time into a game that might end up being completely different 6 months from now. It's also not worth investing time in a game where the developers seem so clueless and/or cash driven that the actual game itself comes secondary to how much cruft they can get people to purchase.

P.S. I would feel genuinely bad for any player who thought reading the patch notes was all they needed to do. Multiple characters have been stealth buffed and nerfed majorly to the point where you're forced to lab every character again.

 

[Juggs]

Still laughing that almost 30 pages deep in this cesspit and people still haven't admitted that both sides of this argument are valid.

I did, and made a relatively long post about it. Not drama orientated enough I guess.

http://testyourmight.com/threads/patches-overwhelmingly-help-nrs-games-not-hurt-them.51268/page-22#post-1803792

Both side of the argument have their merit. One thing that needs to be understood is how different NRS is from other companies, Capcom in particular. The business model itself is different, which is the key reason (imo) that the patching is different.

NRS games have around 2+ years of a life span. This is because a new NRS game usually comes out by this time, and also NRS have stopped supporting the current game. You can blame the community if you want, but they only play a small part in the current NRS game dying. Since NRS stops supporting their game(s) in order to focus their time and money on the new one, they patch early and often because they know once they get past the 2 year threshold, they will have put the game out of their sight.

While as a competitor I don't like this approach, it makes sense. Both as a business decision and logically reasonable decision. Instead of building on a game and making a "UMK9" for instance, they just make a new game.

The "problem" with patching early and often in regards to the health of the game, is that we can't know with any amount of certainty if the nerfs and/or buffs were actually warranted. Now there are exceptions to this, and I'm not talking about things that are obviously broken such as bugs and infinites. But the way they patch the game now, they aren't giving themselves the best opportunity to "get it right". We've experienced before things getting changed early and finding out later on that maybe those things should have never changed to begin with.

The other problem is, the "shut up and level up" mentality is no longer the best option. Unfortunately the best options is to "cry until nerf/buff". Complaining actually has an effect, and the more complaining the more you're going to be heard. Now there's some people in the community that deny we have any impact at all on the patches, but that's just silly. It's no coincidence that whatever is cried about the most and loudest changes in the very next patch.

At the same time though, NRS does make mistakes. There's things that are so obviously too good or not good enough that we don't need half a year to figure it out. But in this day and age, I'd rather suffer through the game changing (for the better) a bunch of times, than the game staying the same when there are things that obviously need to change.

@UltraDavid @Slips @coolwhip @Scoot Magee

 

[haketh]

Did Viscant get banned? Because he's getting the You do not have permission message & if he did that is some weak shit.

Also lol at the claims of arrogance, God this is why so many people just dodge on TYM. Buncha donkeys