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Official UMK3:TE Changelog and Discussion Thread

dubson

Noob
That's every fg in history. I don't care about him getting a damage nerf and having to force more mistakes, but his PLAY style is what I'm concerned about. He's simply fun to play. Remember, I mained Scorpion in MK2, and he's terrible! I think nerfing his damage would be the best so that he has to work MORE to get the job done.
What do you mean that is every FG in history? Make a point when making a point.

What I am saying is. If your going to be that guy who wants to main the best character in the game, be prepared when he gets nerfed. That's all there is too it.

Fun to play? Play something else, this version is directed, dedicated and focused on balanced kompetitive play which the serious and tournament level players want.
 
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dubson

Noob
Bro, characters have had changes to moves so drastic you may as well consider them "lost".

Go play MK3 then play UMK3 for example, its almost a completely different game.

And let's be clear, there is only one character in this version of UMK3 that I would consider could lose a move or be fine with being drastically nerfed, and that is Human Smoke.
 
It is a huge Nerf bro…

I am going to be completely honest, I think his infinite was the only thing that made him competitive… He just cannot hang without it.

Great Kung Lao players that lack the ability to infinite or generate decent corner combo damage off a spin with him lack any chance against even some of the worst characters in the game IMO.

I honestly think the infinite is the only reason he is as good as he is. I think he is almost Horrible without its potential.

@nwo
 

9.95

Noob
What is every FG in history? Make a point when making a point.

Fun to play? Play something else, this version is directed and focused on balanced kompetitive play which the serious and tournament level players want.
SLOW IT DOWN. I'm not attacking you and I'd appreciate it if you don't attack me.

Every single fighting game has OP characters. When Ryu was nerfed from Vanilla SF4 to SSF4, he lost his ability to trade anything into his Ultra, but they didn't take away his DP or his ultra. They balanced it. There is no reason to make HSmoke a DIFFERENT character than he currently is, only to make what he does less damaging and possibly change some options. Something like double Damage Protection off of a teleport in combo would immediately make his easy 50%+ BnB less damaging, plus an overall damage nerf to him, AND decreased walk speed, and bingo, you have the same character who has to work harder to do the same things he used to do, and has to do it more times as well. That's balancing.
 
Bro, characters have had changes to moves so drastic you may as well consider them "lost".

Go play MK3 then play UMK3 for example, its almost a completely different game.

And let's be clear, there is only one character in this version of UMK3 that I would consider could lose a move or be fine with being drastically nerfed, and that is Human Smoke.
Dubson's 2014 Tier List

1. Kabal
2. Kung Lao
...
23. Human Smoke.

lol much love bro
 

dubson

Noob
Are you asking for his opinion?

I've been playing this game since day 1, I have yet to bow down to a Kung player who cannot infinite me. Take that away and he is basic as fuck. I have yet to see a Kung player, who cannot infinite, make me say damn… thats why he is number 3 in the game.

It won't happen.

Again, make points when trying to make points or when asking for others to make points for you.
 
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9.95

Noob
In case anyone thinks I'm being biased, I also think it's a terrible idea to remove Reptile's volleys. They take an enormous amount of skill, and setting it up can be difficult against good players. Again, maybe some minor changes so that they can't always lead to 100%, but that's about it.
 
Are you asking for his opinion?

I've been playing this game since day 1, I have yet to bow down to a Kung player who cannot infinite me. Take that away and he is basic as fuck. I have yet to see a Kung player, who cannot infinite, make me say damn… thats why he is number 3 in the game.

It won't happen.

Again, make points when trying to make points or ask for others to make points for you.
whoah, easy now.

I thought it would be pertinent for him to weigh in, that's all. I don't think anyone believed that everyone would stay where they were on the tier list when this came out.

KL doesn't NEED an infinite to be good. to be #3? Maybe. To be viable? no. jump start into 7 hit autocombo is over 40% damage. can't duck his hat and anything anti air almost automatically get an extra hit with the dive kick.
 

dubson

Noob
SLOW IT DOWN. I'm not attacking you and I'd appreciate it if you don't attack me.

Every single fighting game has OP characters. When Ryu was nerfed from Vanilla SF4 to SSF4, he lost his ability to trade anything into his Ultra, but they didn't take away his DP or his ultra. They balanced it. There is no reason to make HSmoke a DIFFERENT character than he currently is, only to make what he does less damaging and possibly change some options. Something like double Damage Protection off of a teleport in combo would immediately make his easy 50%+ BnB less damaging, plus an overall damage nerf to him, AND decreased walk speed, and bingo, you have the same character who has to work harder to do the same things he used to do, and has to do it more times as well. That's balancing.
Bro, I didn't attack you. I simply responded to you in the tone you responded to me in.

Removing a move that had barely anything to do with him being over the top? This is what has gone too far, seriously, removing his air throw. I can't even believe were debating about this.

Reducing damage doesn't acknowledge how easy his combos are to execute and land. It comes down to options that he simply has wayy to many. Dude already has a freakin Teleport. You guys aren't looking at the Whole Picture, only looking at Him.
 

dubson

Noob
whoah, easy now.

I thought it would be pertinent for him to weigh in, that's all. I don't think anyone believed that everyone would stay where they were on the tier list when this came out.

KL doesn't NEED an infinite to be good. to be #3? Maybe. To be viable? no. jump start into 7 hit autocombo is over 40% damage. can't duck his hat and anything anti air almost automatically get an extra hit with the dive kick.
Sorry, but agree to disagree. He Needs it to be Viable. He is out of the Top 10 without it. (In this current version of UMK3 assuming no other characters have been changed) No question.
 
Sorry, but agree to disagree. He Needs it to be Viable. He is out of the Top 10 without it. (In this current version of UMK3 assuming no other characters have been changed) No question.
see now i want to get some matches in with you on my lunch break. lol
 

9.95

Noob
Bro, I didn't attack you. I simply responded to you in the tone you responded to me in.

Removing a move that had barely anything to do with him being over the top? This is what has gone too far, seriously, removing his air throw. I can't even believe were debating about this.

Reducing damage doesn't acknowledge how easy his combos are to execute and land. It comes down to options that he simply has wayy to many. Dude already has a freakin Teleport. You guys aren't looking at the Whole Picture, only looking at Him.
If it came across like that, it certainly wasn't intended. Anyway, his air throw is a HUGE part of his game. Option select jumps are huge for him. Again, all fg's have characters with easy combos. Scorpion has a TP and airthrow, but I don't think that's over the top. Take a look at New USub. He's a MONSTER. How is HSmoke going to compete with a character that can lock you down like that unless he can do decent damage? It's not just that one character needs change, it's how each character will fit with all the other characters and their changes as well. Does he NEED it? Maybe not. Does he NEED to lose it? No, he does not.
 

dubson

Noob
If it came across like that, it certainly wasn't intended. Anyway, his air throw is a HUGE part of his game. Option select jumps are huge for him. Again, all fg's have characters with easy combos. Scorpion has a TP and airthrow, but I don't think that's over the top. Take a look at New USub. He's a MONSTER. How is HSmoke going to compete with a character that can lock you down like that unless he can do decent damage? It's not just that one character needs change, it's how each character will fit with all the other characters and their changes as well. Does he NEED it? Maybe not. Does he NEED to lose it? No, he does not.
You said it yourself, it is a huge part of his game. Option select jumps are huge for him. He has simply too much, sorry. My reference to the teleport was nothing more than it is one of the best moves if not the best move to have in the game. And guess who has one... H Smoke.

Your right, it isn't about one character being changed, it IS how each character will fit with all the other character and changes as well. Noone needs more attention than this guy.

I am SICK of seeing H Smoke vs H Smoke finals and kompetive play bro. 8 out of top 10 H smoke, other 2 are Kabal. Sorry.
 

RiBBz22

TYM's Confirmed Prophet/Time-Traveler
Taking away Smoke's air throw would be a really bad decision IMO. It is really a move that helps define the character in MK.
 

Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
How can people complain about H Smoke losing Air Throw or being Nerfed? He is way too fucking good.

Fastest walk speed, mind numbingly easy 50% combo, and you people Main him. LOL.

Try maining a character like Nightwolf or Kitana and come back. People want to Main the Easiest and Best character in the game, ridiculous.

As is he rapes basically every character in the game without even barely breaking a sweat, would you people prefer a more balanced game. He needs to be dealt with. Dude is practically Noob Saibot…

Get him out….
I don't think anyone is complaining about him being nerfed, at least I'm not. Him getting nerfed is obviously warranted, him and Kabal are miles away from the rest of the cast, no question. My point is in a game where every character already has few options at their disposal, removing their existing ones isn't the way to go when nerfing them.

His walk speed has already been nerfed. His damage has already been nerfed. Removing options isn't the way to go, it will only ever be the way to go when something is too good. His airthrow isn't the problem and isn't too good.

Also, Nightwolf and Kitana are top 5 characters, imo. I use both but I'm good with Nightwolf, I'd even say he's my best character aside from H.Smoke. I don't understand what that has to do with anything but hey, felt like I needed to throw that out there.


It is a huge Nerf bro…

I am going to be completely honest, I think his infinite was the only thing that made him competitive… He just cannot hang without it.

Great Kung Lao players that lack the ability to infinite or generate decent corner combo damage off a spin with him lack any chance against even some of the worst characters in the game IMO.

I honestly think the infinite is the only reason he is as good as he is. I think he is almost Horrible without its potential.
His infinite in regular UMK3 is hardly ever going to even happen in a real match against a top player. It's easy as pie to do, and you can do it basically anywhere, but you need that first hit to initiate it. In the current high level play of regular UMK3, it's not going to happen very often. The threat of the infinite is more deadly than the infinite itself.

In UMK3:TE, however, with Glitch Jabs going bye bye, his infinite now is more viable and more deadly. With all the other changes, his infinite being untouched would be a mistake. He still can do solid damage, and can carry you wall to wall, it's just not a touch of death infinite.

And yeah, his infinite has little to do with why he's good. I never believed he was a top 5 character, and a lot of people agree with that. Top 10 maybe, idk where he'd stand honestly. But his infinite isn't really a factor, not with glitch jabs in the picture.

Reducing damage doesn't acknowledge how easy his combos are to execute and land. It comes down to options that he simply has wayy to many. Dude already has a freakin Teleport. You guys aren't looking at the Whole Picture, only looking at Him.
Everyone's combos are easy to execute, with a few exceptions. They are the easiest to initiate, however, with his knee 2 hit starter that he shares with Ermac. But, he has a teleport, spear, and an airthrow. His air throw isn't what makes him good. That's not to say his airthrow isn't good, it's grrrrreeeaaaaat! But removing it entirely isn't what should be done here, if it even warrants a nerf at all. With all his other nerfs already applied, it's unnecessary to also remove 1 of 3 specials that he has.

And to be clear, I'm not defending H.Smoke because I main him. I hardly ever use him outside of tournament. I would say the same for every character, and did so. The mission here is to make every character able to compete, bring down top tier, bring up bottom tier. Not make top tier now bottom, and bottom tier now top. But a middle ground, I believe that is achievable to some extent.
 

9.95

Noob
You said it yourself, it is a huge part of his game. Option select jumps are huge for him. He has simply too much, sorry. My reference to the teleport was nothing more than it is one of the best moves if not the best move to have in the game. And guess who has one... H Smoke.

Your right, it isn't about one character being changed, it IS how each character will fit with all the other character and changes as well. Noone needs more attention than this guy.

I am SICK of seeing H Smoke vs H Smoke finals and kompetive play bro. 8 out of top 10 H smoke, other 2 are Kabal. Sorry.
So am I, but with the new buffs to Scorpion and Sub, the nerfs to Kabal, and various other changes to the rest of the cast, I sincerely believe that removing is the wrong option vs. scaling it back. Against the newly buffed characters, it's quite possible that his ONLY option (with a damage nerf, and nerfed walk speed) will be that he has other options.

With Sub's new clone proximity and the ability to throw ice blasts, Smoke simply can't get in on him. Take away that air throw and now Sub can jump at him for free because an aaHP too close to the clone and Smoke is frozen.

Reptile, free jump ins on forceballs

Kung Lao, free divekicks air to air...Smoke will barely be able to move.

My point is that the air throw doesn't break Smoke. If it does, then it also breaks Scorpion for the same reason.
 

dubson

Noob
Also, Nightwolf and Kitana are top 5 characters, imo. I use both but I'm good with Nightwolf, I'd even say he's my best character aside from H.Smoke. I don't understand what that has to do with anything but hey, felt like I needed to throw that out there.
Maybe Nightwolf, but Kitana is Not Top 5. Not even Crazy' Dominicans… He is the Only player to make her that good, maybe 1-2 others, but even then, she isn't Top 5. Sorry. Huge exaggeration. Top 10 for sure, not 5, no way. This comment wasn't for you anyways. Your a very high level player with over 10+ years experience. This comment was for those who play this game for Human Smoke, and vice versa. When they play this game at high level, they play H Smoke. Or maybe even exclusively. Those people need to know what a real match is like. Playing a character like Nightwolf or Kitana at high level play takes much more work done than playing with H Smoke. Takes much more skill to be kompetitive and a top player with them. Things like that. That's what it "has to do with anything". Some of the people in here complaining ONLY play H Smoke. Look at it from that angle please.

His infinite in regular UMK3 is hardly ever going to even happen in a real match against a top player. It's easy as pie to do, and you can do it basically anywhere, but you need that first hit to initiate it. In the current high level play of regular UMK3, it's not going to happen very often. The threat of the infinite is more deadly than the infinite itself.
Who are you playing against? Play against Miss Spin or some of these Kung Lao players on PSN. Imagine if Crazy Dominican's Go To character was Kung Lao, you think it would hit very often then? Please look at it from this angle. IDK who your playing, but it lands a lot. One spin could mean death. That is absurd. That is why he is good.

In UMK3:TE, however, with Glitch Jabs going bye bye, his infinite now is more viable and more deadly. With all the other changes, his infinite being untouched would be a mistake. He still can do solid damage, and can carry you wall to wall, it's just not a touch of death infinite.
agreed, removal of glitch jabs makes him much more dangerous and it must be dealt with

And yeah, his infinite has little to do with why he's good. I never believed he was a top 5 character, and a lot of people agree with that. Top 10 maybe, idk where he'd stand honestly. But his infinite isn't really a factor, not with glitch jabs in the picture.
IDC if you believe it or not, Kung Lao is number 3 behind H Smoke. And if he isn't in your Top 5, something is severely wrong. IDK who your playing man. Some of these Kung's on PSN will kill you if they land one spin anywhere on the screen, let alone the corner. This isn't even counting punished teleports/moves, anti-airs. The possibilities are ridiculous.


Everyone's combos are easy to execute, with a few exceptions. They are the easiest to initiate, however, with his knee 2 hit starter that he shares with Ermac. But, he has a teleport, spear, and an airthrow.
it's obvious all combos are "easy to execute" i was referring to his practicality of landing his and how easy his are for being 50%. Please be realistic. 2 hit starter is exactly what I am referring to, though.
 
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dubson

Noob
So am I, but with the new buffs to Scorpion and Sub, the nerfs to Kabal, and various other changes to the rest of the cast, I sincerely believe that removing is the wrong option vs. scaling it back. Against the newly buffed characters, it's quite possible that his ONLY option (with a damage nerf, and nerfed walk speed) will be that he has other options.

With Sub's new clone proximity and the ability to throw ice blasts, Smoke simply can't get in on him. Take away that air throw and now Sub can jump at him for free because an aaHP too close to the clone and Smoke is frozen.

Reptile, free jump ins on forceballs

Kung Lao, free divekicks air to air...Smoke will barely be able to move.

My point is that the air throw doesn't break Smoke. If it does, then it also breaks Scorpion for the same reason.
You go through times you say he "doesn't need it" then say "it is a huge part of his game"

It comes down to options, and he has too many. Noone said anything about the move itself being broken. It comes down to the character and his options. Scorpion's damage and combo potential is nothing near that of Smoke. His footsies. Re-launch potential. Nothing man. He isn't comparable to H Smoke at all. Ermac is more comparable. They simply share an air throw and teleport so stop trying to compare them.

His walk speed has been reduced to Normal I assume, which isn't REALLY a nerf. His combo's and damage are now what I consider more Normal. Does "More Normal" H Smoke need a air throw? Maybe, but one thing is for damn sure, this Current H Smoke does Not need it at all.

Regardless, riddle me this Riddler;

If he doesn't Need it, then why should he be able to Do it?
 

GetSpookd

#1 Enemy : Rust.
How can people complain about H Smoke losing Air Throw or being Nerfed? He is way too fucking good.
Haven't seen any real bitching about his nerfs tbh. Only thing that its going a little bit too far is removing a move, which I would go against for any other char aswell. With less moves the game becomes more dull and I guess everyone wants as much variation as it gets, if its fairly balanced ofc.
Fastest walk speed, mind numbingly easy 50% combo, and you people Main him. LOL.
Again, totally ok with nerfed walk speed, damage and all.
As is he rapes basically every character in the game without even barely breaking a sweat.
Thats Kabal for you mate.
Dude is practically Noob Saibot
 

dubson

Noob
Haven't seen any real bitching about his nerfs tbh. Only thing that its going a little bit too far is removing a move, which I would go against for any other char aswell. With less moves the game becomes more dull and I guess everyone wants as much variation as it gets, if its fairly balanced ofc.

Again, totally ok with nerfed walk speed, damage and all.

Thats Kabal for you mate.

Listen pal, idk who you are, but its H Smoke as well.

Add me if you want me to show you.
 

Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
Maybe Nightwolf, but Kitana is Not Top 5. Not even Crazy' Dominicans… He is the Only player to make her that good, maybe 1-2 others, but even then, she isn't Top 5. Sorry. Huge exaggeration. Top 10 for sure, not 5, no way.
I disagree. Back in the day, I wouldn't even consider her top 10. After playing people like @R.E.O. and @NoDoubt who have BETTER Kitanas than Crazy Dominican, it's obvious how good she really is. Her instant air fan alone is the 2nd best special in the entire game, hands down.

Who are you playing against? Play against Miss Spin or some of these Kung Lao players on PSN. Imagine if Crazy Dominican's Go To character was Kung Lao, you think it would hit very often then? Please look at it from this angle. IDK who your playing, but it lands a lot. One spin could mean death. That is absurd. That is why he is good.
In regards to Kungs infinite, I'm speaking objectively, it has little to do with who I've played. His infinite requires you to jump, or requires some sort of mistake while applying pressure. With Kara and Glitch Jabs, however, there's almost zero reason to ever jump unless it's a safe jump, especially against a character who can literally kill you for jumping.