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Myths and bills: You've been deputized

rev0lver

Come On Die Young
Time for the realest of real talk I'll give as far as bills go since this is free speech zone. I'm sorry if someone takes something personally ;_;. I'm only trying to state what I think

Bill: Bane is super top tier
I think 16bit upplays Bane and with his influence in this community it's caused everyone else to start upplaying him. I think he upplays him mainly because he has the perspective of one character that gets bodied by him, so he sees him in the tier list as more dominant than he is. I had the same mentality with Sinestro for a while, but then I started thinking about him more from the perspective of those who have good options against him and started changing my mind.

Myth: Shazam is a bottom tier yolo character
I think Wonderchef has the best understanding of Shazam and the other top players of him don't have the right mindset/playstyle required to play him.

Myth: Nightwing is good
I think Nightwing is a good character with all the right tools that aren't adjusted right for this game. Nothing fast enough that rewards enough, nothing to give him mobility without a lot of weaknesses, nothing strong enough to control airspace, weak against interactables, nothing great to push him over the edge like a strong trait or a useful super. He just feels super mediocre. A good player could still do decently with him, but your strong point being good footsies doesn't mean much compared to what characters like Sinestro, Aquaman, Bane, or even Catwoman can do with them, especially considering how little some characters care about having good range.

Bill: Multihitting things make Lex's trait useless
This is super annoying. Having quick, multihitting moves means it can sometimes be more difficult to get my trait out, but using it is the same as playing a regular neutral game with the bonus that you can take an armor hit whenever you want. This more means I know people are going to try certain moves more, which I can still blow up.

Bill: Black Adam is still top 10
Black Adam went from a strong spacing/keepaway character to a character that just has decent footsies. He has some good corner stuff, but I haven't heard any good arguments for why he's more than upper-mid tier.

Bill: Zatanna is a super complex character that takes a literal genius to win with
I think Zatanna is definitely one of the more complex characters in the game. That being said, I think it more takes a right mindset and playstyle than a master of fundamentals and tech to do well with. She still has room for improvement for sure, and I doubt everything good about her has been found, but I don't think just her having an unorthodox playstyle and a lot of special moves makes her that much higher than the rest. I don't think people should be so intimidated to pick her up.

Myth: Joker never stood a chance
I think Joker's metagame and execution requirements make him a way more complex character than he's usually made out to be. I don't think all the right people are playing him, and the ones that are haven't developed him to what his potential might be.

Myth: Grundy is bad
I think a lot of Grundy players gave up on the character too soon because of throw invincibility. There's a lot more to the character than getting free walking corpses, imo. Tyrant still doing well despite not really focusing much on the game anymore shows that the character can still do well. And I know there's others who have developed some stuff that might make people eventually have a better opinion of him when combined with a solid use of his metagame.
 

16 Bit

Mash d+1~Cat Claws
Premium Supporter
NetherRealm Studios
Even Max is talking about Bane having losing MU's against Batman, Sinestro and Zod along with Flash and Zatanna, what have you to say to this?

I say we need to have a chat at Tony's. :coffee:

Seriously, he could lose those matches and still be top 5. Like I said, that spot is a big grey area.
 
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Tbh, sometimes ppl who main a character aren't playing a matchup at the highest current level, hell I feel me and DJTs backups play matchups better than the many ppl who main a character (for example, DJTs Green arrow is up to par with players like 7L IMO, and my backup wowo plays some matchups better than other wowo mains do and etc.) #YEEEAAAPPP
 

GGA Max

Well-Known Member
What Shazam do you play and could you links me a vid please :)
Here is ppj's, its a pretty long set

Otherwise you can search for "max vs heroic legacy" on youtube and there should be like 5 of our sets showing up.

I can't find the set vs digit at ufgt.

I am not sure if indecisive plays more "lame" than these guys. They seem to focus on spacing more than keep away iirc.
 

cR Biohazard

Team Torr
Here is ppj's, its a pretty long set

Otherwise you can search for "max vs heroic legacy" on youtube and there should be like 5 of our sets showing up.

I can't find the set vs digit at ufgt.

I am not sure if indecisive plays more "lame" than these guys. They seem to focus on spacing more than keep away iirc.
He plays hella lame, it's perfect imo
 

cR Biohazard

Team Torr
I say we need to have a chat at Tony's. :coffee:

Seriously, he could lose those matches and still be top 5. Like I said, that spot is a big grey area.
By my count Bane is losing MU's to nearly a third of the cast. I know that that must make me the biggest Bane downplayer but surely Flash, Wonder Woman and Doomsday aren't losing that many MU's not saying that Wonder Woman and Doomsday are top 5, Flash is...
 

16 Bit

Mash d+1~Cat Claws
Premium Supporter
NetherRealm Studios
By my count Bane is losing MU's to nearly a third of the cast. I know that that must make me the biggest Bane downplayer but surely Flash, Wonder Woman and Doomsday aren't losing that many MU's not saying that Wonder Woman and Doomsday are top 5, Flash is...

The tier list isn't entirely based on losing matchups. One character could have 5 losing matchups but hella winning matchups and be better than a character with only 2 losing matchups.

I also think the MU charts for those characters are possible bills.
 
I really fucking hate this mentality. Like ok, Sonic Fox is the best Batgirl bar none, but this is just relegating that other players don't know jack shit about their character. I don't disagree that you should go for the most experienced person but I can't agree that you can't listen to another player rep, it's always possible you can learn something new from playing a different player.
lol you know i had something typed up but then i thought to myself...."who cares" so i deleted it. So yeah that's just your opinion man :D
 

cR Biohazard

Team Torr
Here is ppj's, its a pretty long set

Otherwise you can search for "max vs heroic legacy" on youtube and there should be like 5 of our sets showing up.

I can't find the set vs digit at ufgt.

I am not sure if indecisive plays more "lame" than these guys. They seem to focus on spacing more than keep away iirc.
From what I saw, PPJ needed more lame. A lot of your hits came from him whiffing moves in the neutral game and you got a free DP. Also after some teleports away if you did a charge he would try to punish you when the charge whiffed upon making contact with the tele. Inde would continue to teleport away, building meter and waiting for the right moment to get a dash up command grab in or torpedo Bane's dash attempts. I would really love to see you fight him offline and see what happens. You guys should come to CECC 2 whenever that is (sometime November I think) :)
 
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16 Bit

Mash d+1~Cat Claws
Premium Supporter
NetherRealm Studios
I mean, the best Hawkgirl in the world thinks HG beats Flash but no one cares and Flash is auto top 5. We're assuming Bane's MU chart is worst case scenario and these Flash/WW MU chart with like zero losing MU are fact.
 

cR Biohazard

Team Torr
The tier list isn't entirely based on losing matchups. One character could have 5 losing matchups but hella winning matchups and be better than a character with only 2 losing matchups.

I also think the MU charts for those characters are possible bills.
But Bane doesn't have hella winning matchups. He has a decent amount of even and 6-4's. I think it's just against catwoman that he supposedly hella wins. ;)
 

rev0lver

Come On Die Young
I mean, the best Hawkgirl in the world thinks HG beats Flash but no one cares and Flash is auto top 5. We're assuming Bane's MU chart is worst case scenario and these Flash/WW MU chart with like zero losing MU are fact.
I think Hawkgirl could definitely beat Flash and trust that. I still think Flash could be top 5 though haha
 

Doombawkz

Trust me, I'm a doctor
By my count Bane is losing MU's to nearly a third of the cast. I know that that must make me the biggest Bane downplayer but surely Flash, Wonder Woman and Doomsday aren't losing that many MU's not saying that Wonder Woman and Doomsday are top 5, Flash is...
You have to understand that while he may be "losing" to 1/3 the cast, he only really loses hard to 1 or 2 people. One of them is Zatanna, and the other one is Honeybee.
Meanwhile, his 7-3s have to be counted on your whole hand.

Lobo (supposedly), Grundy (could be an 8-2), GA, Catwoman, hell I'm tempted to say Black Adam because honestly he is like Batgirl without the mix-ups or vortex.

Most of our 4-6s and 5-5s are based around the opponent knowing everything we are capable of. We win MUs off of knowledge alone in some circumstances.
Honestly its mostly in the air, but Bane being "super top tier" is possible. He has everything he needs to be in that position, or at least contend for it.
I'm willing to say he is as much in the discussion for top 5 as say... Flash or WW are.

But Bane doesn't have hella winning matchups. He has a decent amount of even and 6-4's. I think it's just against catwoman that he supposedly hella wins. ;)
Typical Grundy player, downplaying Bane.

oh yeah and lex beats bane
Yeah probably. Shame the only Lex getting out of pools is a HG/MMH player.
 
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cR Biohazard

Team Torr
I mean, the best Hawkgirl in the world thinks HG beats Flash but no one cares and Flash is auto top 5. We're assuming Bane's MU chart is worst case scenario and these Flash/WW MU chart with like zero losing MU are fact.
Why does PPJ think HG beats Flash when his set with HoneyBee was even and from what I heard PPJ was the only HG that stood a chance?
 

16 Bit

Mash d+1~Cat Claws
Premium Supporter
NetherRealm Studios
But Bane doesn't have hella winning matchups. He has a decent amount of even and 6-4's. I think it's just against catwoman that he supposedly hella wins. ;)

He has a bunch of MU that might be 7-3. Lantern, Black Adam, Green Arrow, Solomon Grundy.
 

cR Biohazard

Team Torr
You have to understand that while he may be "losing" to 1/3 the cast, he only really loses hard to 1 or 2 people. One of them is Zatanna, and the other one is Honeybee.
Meanwhile, his 7-3s have to be counted on your whole hand.

Lobo (supposedly), Grundy (could be an 8-2), GA, Catwoman, hell I'm tempted to say Black Adam because honestly he is like Batgirl without the mix-ups or vortex.

Most of our 4-6s and 5-5s are based around the opponent knowing everything we are capable of. We win MUs off of knowledge alone in some circumstances.
Honestly its mostly in the air, but Bane being "super top tier" is possible. He has everything he needs to be in that position, or at least contend for it.
I'm willing to say he is as much in the discussion for top 5 as say... Flash or WW are.



Typical Grundy player, downplaying Bane.


Yeah probably. Shame the only Lex getting out of pools is a HG/MMH player.
Why are you calling me a Grundy Player?