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Jax Question and Answer thread

Alright, just got my ass handed to me by Expert AI Jax, and I'm curious: what is the universal punish starter for a ground pound that is cancelled post-pound?
Timing it so it passes over him after the Ground Pound already whiffed, but before he starts recovering... I was just letting Jax recover on his own, not hitting any buttons after the GP. I don't think it's so much an issue of his hitbox being lower than a crouch during the Ground Pound as it is the EX Harpoon having the property of hitting crouchers. Example: Just look at Ermac's Force Ball pass through a crouching Kenshi... it's certainly not the lowered hitbox of the crouch that avoids the projectile, but the properties of the attack that causes it to whiff on crouchers. In fact, I think Jax's hitbox is a bit higher than a crouch, at least near his back arm... that's why Teleport Punch still hits him but doesn't hit crouchers; Teleport Punch does not have the property of whiffing on crouchers, it's just the lowered hitbox of crouching that avoids it.
OHH!!! I thought he meant like after the move whiffs and Jax is on the recovery. So yeah my bad for putting wrong information out there as the spear and most projectiles will simply go over him. If Jax gets off the ground pound and misses... scorpion can use Ex takedown or hell fire. So depending on his range he should decide which one to use to punish. As Jax is coming up during recovery a spear can catch him he just needs to learn the timing as there is a brief second before he can block. During the ground pound, once Jax actually touches the ground he is safe from the majority of the cast. From the ex takedown I can only assume low attacks are the only thing that will take him out of it. Also wake ex teleport, ex takedown, and ex hell fire, will do the trick if he hits you with f4,1,4 and then goes for the ground pound.


Thank you very much my friend. I will go to the lab and will.. "Bring It!"
No problem! I really do suggest working on another character as well though to get that block in there. Just getting Jax down won't help if you decided to switch characters or learn another.
 
OHH!!! I thought he meant like after the move whiffs and Jax is on the recovery. So yeah my bad for putting wrong information out there as the spear and most projectiles will simply go over him. If Jax gets off the ground pound and misses... scorpion can use Ex takedown or hell fire. So depending on his range he should decide which one to use to punish. As Jax is coming up during recovery a spear can catch him he just needs to learn the timing as there is a brief second before he can block. During the ground pound, once Jax actually touches the ground he is safe from the majority of the cast. From the ex takedown I can only assume low attacks are the only thing that will take him out of it. Also wake ex teleport, ex takedown, and ex hell fire, will do the trick if he hits you with f4,1,4 and then goes for the ground pound.
Uhh... aren't we talking about the same thing, then? You sure a Spear can catch Jax during his recovery? Jax doesn't even have to stand up once the Ground Pound whiffs; he can just go straight from the low position to a crouch or crouch-block.
 
Uhh... aren't we talking about the same thing, then? You sure a Spear can catch Jax during his recovery? Jax doesn't even have to stand up once the Ground Pound whiffs; he can just go straight from the low position to a crouch or crouch-block.
Not at first I thought we was talking about after the pound goes off and he goes into standing. I believe you was talking about as the gp goes off? If not then im still at a lost lol. The spear will only catch if he stands, if he remains crouching then no it wont hit because, like you said he can just go straight in crouch or crouch-block. Which by the way was new a find for me! Lol, I usually stay away from random gp's but finding out that you can actually duck is awesome.
 
Not at first I thought we was talking about after the pound goes off and he goes into standing. I believe you was talking about as the gp goes off? If not then im still at a lost lol. The spear will only catch if he stands, if he remains crouching then no it wont hit because, like you said he can just go straight in crouch or crouch-block. Which by the way was new a find for me! Lol, I usually stay away from random gp's but finding out that you can actually duck is awesome.
If he can't actually instantly stand-block out of his low-hitbox state, then he might not be instantly crouch-blocking out of it either, but it looks to me that that's the case. I didn't actually know he couldn't stand-block immediately out of it, either... I might go mess around with this later...
 
If he can't actually instantly stand-block out of his low-hitbox state, then he might not be instantly crouch-blocking out of it either, but it looks to me that that's the case. I didn't actually know he couldn't stand-block immediately out of it, either... I might go mess around with this later...
It looks like he can instant block, we got a tournament this Saturday and i'm bringing my setup with the Pvr so i can actually test everything then and put up the results. Everything I did today was simple testing against my self (dropping my arcade stick to quickly pick up a controller and try to spear myself lol...a full pain in the ass.)
 

CY MasterHavik

Master of Chaos and Jax
testing this f413 bug. what do you guys think about it? To be honest this bug is a joke. Why would you sit on your butt and crouch block f413. I mean if you don't do anything, then it's free meter. It builds really fucking fast.
 
testing this f413 bug. what do you guys think about it? To be honest this bug is a joke. Why would you sit on your butt and crouch block f413. I mean if you don't do anything, then it's free meter. It builds really fucking fast.
I honestly think there's way to much hype on it. Even if we get the frame advantage its not hard for the majority of the cast to get Jax off them and keep him away...especially with the nerf on the distance of dash blocking. Just like the input bug i feel like people are going to start using this as an excuse of why their losing to so and so. Not saying the bug isn't real but I know everyone else is going to be screaming this is all their getting and the main reason why they can't win.

Honestly thinking about it though... there's times where F413 is a guaranteed ground pound...think this bug is the reason? If so this only helps his game and its not game breaking as its obvious that Jax cant keep doing it over and over. If I'm not mistaken he can only do three times in a row in a corner an get about 30%?
 
Honestly thinking about it though... there's times where F413 is a guaranteed ground pound...think this bug is the reason? If so this only helps his game and its not game breaking as its obvious that Jax cant keep doing it over and over. If I'm not mistaken he can only do three times in a row in a corner an get about 30%?
Wait... Jax can get a guaranteed non-EX Ground Pound? How? Can't the opponent just wake-up attack through it or even just lay on the ground and start getting up just before Jax punches the ground? And does the bug really affect his combos? I thought the bug was a longer blockstun, not a faster recovery.
 
Wait... Jax can get a guaranteed non-EX Ground Pound? How? Can't the opponent just wake-up attack through it or even just lay on the ground and start getting up just before Jax punches the ground? And does the bug really affect his combos? I thought the bug was a longer blockstun, not a faster recovery.
Yeah only a roll or wakeup stops it, but if their rolling everywhere you just need to guest right and you can still catch them. Jax recovers pretty quick from that string, like i said you can do it 3x in a corner and get either high in the 20's or exactly 30%. Try the f413 xx medium ground pound a couple of times in some matches or against the computer. You'll find times where you get it every time and then times where it doesn't seem to work at all.
 
Yeah only a roll or wakeup stops it, but if their rolling everywhere you just need to guest right and you can still catch them. Jax recovers pretty quick from that string, like i said you can do it 3x in a corner and get either high in the 20's or exactly 30%. Try the f413 xx medium ground pound a couple of times in some matches or against the computer. You'll find times where you get it every time and then times where it doesn't seem to work at all.
You don't even have to roll or wake-up attack, though, you can just start standing up while the Ground Pound goes off... it'll whiff right through you. :( And the only reason f+4,1,3 > Ground Pound works sometimes and not others is because either I time the Ground Pound slightly differently or the opponent's timing is slightly different as far as I can tell... I have the opponent set to always jump and as long as I always buffer the Ground Pound so it comes out as early as possible, it always whiffs because the opponent is in the correct portion of their standing up animation to avoid it, but if I delay the Ground Pound a couple frames, it always hits because the opponent is already past that point in their standing up animation. It seems to have no inconsistency. I also tried using the record feature in the same fashion as Riu, but the playback feature always causes the Ground Pound to whiff unless I do it very late... I think that's just the playback feature messing up, though. I don't think the bug affects anything but blockstun.
 

CY MasterHavik

Master of Chaos and Jax
Interesting back and forth you two. I tried that...and let's say things didn't go well for me at my last tourney. It does work though, you just gotta time it. If you think they will roll, just dash cancel it into a jump kick, dash punch, or energy wave.
 
You don't even have to roll or wake-up attack, though, you can just start standing up while the Ground Pound goes off... it'll whiff right through you. :( And the only reason f+4,1,3 > Ground Pound works sometimes and not others is because either I time the Ground Pound slightly differently or the opponent's timing is slightly different as far as I can tell... I have the opponent set to always jump and as long as I always buffer the Ground Pound so it comes out as early as possible, it always whiffs because the opponent is in the correct portion of their standing up animation to avoid it, but if I delay the Ground Pound a couple frames, it always hits because the opponent is already past that point in their standing up animation. It seems to have no inconsistency. I also tried using the record feature in the same fashion as Riu, but the playback feature always causes the Ground Pound to whiff unless I do it very late... I think that's just the playback feature messing up, though. I don't think the bug affects anything but blockstun.
I either test/record it tonight or tomorrow during casuals before the tournament. I won't lie though buffering does make sense but it'll be easier to continue the convo with some video for reference anyways.

Interesting back and forth you two. I tried that...and let's say things didn't go well for me at my last tourney. It does work though, you just gotta time it. If you think they will roll, just dash cancel it into a jump kick, dash punch, or energy wave.
I actually enjoy the back and forth lol. I tired posting on the board when the game first came out and it wasn't very active so I never had the feedback I'm getting right now for Jax. Hopefully breaking down his moves and stuff will help us develop some new tech for Jax. As far as the F4,1,3 im hoping to bait the roll and use the far ground pound to catch them then dash in. Our top players use Kitana, Raiden, and Kung Lao so I got my hands pretty tied right now. ANyone got some match up advice for the three? I think I understand the Lao and Raiden enough to help keep things going my way...but I need some kind of answer for Kitana's d1.
 
Timing it so it passes over him after the Ground Pound already whiffed, but before he starts recovering... I was just letting Jax recover on his own, not hitting any buttons after the GP. I don't think it's so much an issue of his hitbox being lower than a crouch during the Ground Pound as it is the EX Harpoon having the property of hitting crouchers. Example: Just look at Ermac's Force Ball pass through a crouching Kenshi... it's certainly not the lowered hitbox of the crouch that avoids the projectile, but the properties of the attack that causes it to whiff on crouchers. In fact, I think Jax's hitbox is a bit higher than a crouch, at least near his back arm... that's why Teleport Punch still hits him but doesn't hit crouchers; Teleport Punch does not have the property of whiffing on crouchers, it's just the lowered hitbox of crouching that avoids it.
You know, it's a bit late, but I have no clue what I was thinking when I said this. :/ Teleport Punch does have the property of whiffing on crouchers, yet it hits Jax, whereas EX Harpoon has the property of hitting crouchers but whiffs on Jax. I do think his hitbox is a bit higher than his crouch, though.
 

CY MasterHavik

Master of Chaos and Jax
I either test/record it tonight or tomorrow during casuals before the tournament. I won't lie though buffering does make sense but it'll be easier to continue the convo with some video for reference anyways.



I actually enjoy the back and forth lol. I tired posting on the board when the game first came out and it wasn't very active so I never had the feedback I'm getting right now for Jax. Hopefully breaking down his moves and stuff will help us develop some new tech for Jax. As far as the F4,1,3 im hoping to bait the roll and use the far ground pound to catch them then dash in. Our top players use Kitana, Raiden, and Kung Lao so I got my hands pretty tied right now. ANyone got some match up advice for the three? I think I understand the Lao and Raiden enough to help keep things going my way...but I need some kind of answer for Kitana's d1.
I'll break it down.

Kitana: Pretty kick is stuff by air gotcha grab. Just block the d1 and try to make some room for yourself. And instead of blocking all the instant air fans. Just duck and keep moving forward.
 
I'll break it down.

Kitana: Pretty kick is stuff by air gotcha grab. Just block the d1 and try to make some room for yourself. And instead of blocking all the instant air fans. Just duck and keep moving forward.
I do my best to duck on the fans and try to advance in between...not an easy task by any means :(. Pretty kick < Air Gotcha grab...awesome tip! So what do you do to punish the D1 attempts? I was thinking about trying f3 from a distance, so don't know if that fan plus her arm length is longer then his overhead kick but I need something. Maybe close ground pound? I don't know how fast she can recover after a whiffed d1 but there has to be something. He also mains Jax so I can't use my normal setups I have to catch him off guard with my kombos as well.
 

CY MasterHavik

Master of Chaos and Jax
I do my best to duck on the fans and try to advance in between...not an easy task by any means :(. Pretty kick < Air Gotcha grab...awesome tip! So what do you do to punish the D1 attempts? I was thinking about trying f3 from a distance, so don't know if that fan plus her arm length is longer then his overhead kick but I need something. Maybe close ground pound? I don't know how fast she can recover after a whiffed d1 but there has to be something. He also mains Jax so I can't use my normal setups I have to catch him off guard with my kombos as well.
Umm....if she whiffs a d1. You can throw an energy wave, d2, and maybe f4 works. Don't forget the armor on ex overhead smash too.
 
Umm....if she whiffs a d1. You can throw an energy wave, d2, and maybe f4 works. Don't forget the armor on ex overhead smash too.
I was actually just thinking about the ex overhead only problem was when we did an online session it pretty much kept me from doing anything. Not sure of how much of a change that situation will be offline since I haven't been able to play his Kitana offline yet. Hopefully I can test the theory out in some casuals before the tournament starts. Got anything else for me? Raiden or Kung Lao either?
 

CY MasterHavik

Master of Chaos and Jax
KL: spin sucks....rape his ass and low hat isn't godlike anymore.

Raiden: Block superman and try to make him stay still.
 
KL: spin sucks....rape his ass and low hat isn't godlike anymore.

Raiden: Block superman and try to make him stay still.
I don't know what the circumstances have to be but you can gotcha grab Raiden's superman (I have video evidence of this!). I heard you can poke him out of his teleport as well. Im actually getting ready to head over to that thread and ask questions as well lol.
 
You can actually anti-air grab through Kitana's instant air fans, even full-screen, though I'm not sure that's preferable to ducking under them. As for gotcha grabbing Raiden out of superman, you can anti air grab him consistently, but I don't see why you'd want to do either unless the block damage would kill you since you can punish a blocked superman with a 32% combo off mid GP or 30% off dash 1's.
 

CY MasterHavik

Master of Chaos and Jax
Uh...Cdjr did it against CD at Sj. I was like," why was he doing that?" Then I realize how much better his movement was compare to my movement when I play I against Kitana. It was so much smoother compare to me.
 
Hey can you guys give me some help with the Johnny Cage match up?
(JC Frame traps)
[video=youtube_share;Qer88JrJBNc]http://youtu.be/Qer88JrJBNc[/video]


(Tournament Match)
[video=youtube_share;kBQXCvG02Uc]http://youtu.be/kBQXCvG02Uc[/video]

This is some of the footage from the Tournament on Saturday. My opponent used Styrker and Johnny Cage. I kept getting hit by that stupid frame trap and couldn't figure out how to get past it. This is what I know so far....

-That standing kick frame trap can't be poked out of, he can simply poke you first because your negative x amount of frames.
-Depending on the amount of frames your attack is, that same standing frame trap can beat yours. Specifically the sweep, d3, d4. Haven't tried d1 yet.



Also we was talking about f4,1,3 in the corner. It can be done 3 times in a row for 34%. Video of it below.
[video=youtube_share;jgeyB5exe3g]http://youtu.be/jgeyB5exe3g[/video]