Harley's Trait - In-depth look and match-up guide.

Discussion in 'Harley Quinn' started by cpmd4, Jun 5, 2013.

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  1. cpmd4

    cpmd4 Slaughter is the Best Medicine

    Hey there guys. I've been in the lab looking for ways to allow use of Harley's trait without getting punished. I've made a match-up guide to show you when / against whom you can use her trait.

    UPDATED FOR PATCH 1.06. Harley's trait now has an 8 second cooldown, but retains the 6 second buff time

    Harley's trait is unique in this game in that one of three things will occur, completely randomly, based on what she pulls out of her Bag O' Tricks. The buffs she receives last for 6 seconds and trait has an 8 second cooldown period.

    Joker Picture: Harley deals increased damage. In addition, she also takes 50% reduced damage from all sources for 6 seconds.

    Ivy's Flower: Harley recovers 7.5% health over 6 seconds.

    Bomb: Harley throws an unblockable bomb that deals 15% damage and knocks the opponent into the air.


    A few things first:

    1. Harley's safest way to activate trait is with f23 xx 4. The f2 can whiff as long as the 3 portion of the string hits. Naked f23 is not suggested as you can cancel f2 into Tantrum Stance for full combo. It is best used on an airborne opponent or with the b22 xx Tantrum~1, b3, JI2, f23 xx 4 combo.

    112 xx 4 can also be used against a portion of the cast without being punished and can only be punished by successful wake-ups. Harley's naked 112 knocks an opponent the perfect distance for her bomb trait and is a hard knockdown so they can't roll away.

    However, after full combo her opponent is knocked too far away and the bomb can only hit them if they use an advancing wake-up like Flash's Lightning Charge. In addition, Harley's stance compared to her opponent's stance affects whether the bomb will hit some characters, and it isn't near the almost-entirely safe f23. 112 xx trait is not optimal and should be used cautiously.

    2. Each of the three options from Harley's trait have different start-up and recovery, making some safer than others. In order, Joker picture is the safest (unpunishable by virtually anything after even 112), then flower, then the bomb.

    3. Even if you take damage from a wake-up attack after 112 xx 4, they cannot prevent the effects of the trait taking place. This includes the bomb coming out for a reset oppurtunity. It may be worthwhile to take ~5-10% damage to get a bomb reset, or to gain damage reduction from the Joker picture.

    4. DLC character write-ups coming soon.
    ________________________________________________
    HARLEY'S TRAIT ACTIVATION AFTER F23 and tech roll:

    SUPERMAN:

    [​IMG]

    Kryptonian Crush (Super)
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable
    Bomb: Punishable. Superman armors through bomb taking 15% before dealing 34% damage to Harley if full combo'd. After naked f23 the bomb will whiff.

    Superman with Super is the only thing that can punish Harley's trait after f23. Just watch his meter and you're good. You shouldn't be traiting against Superman with Super up period, he can punish bomb from any distance with it.


    ________________________________________________
    HARLEY'S TRAIT ACTIVATION AFTER UNTECHABLE 112:
    (Special move damage taken from TYM Injustice wiki. I apologize for any incorrect damage amounts as they may have changed with patches)

    BATMAN:
    [​IMG]

    Straight Grapple
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Batman goes through invulnerability frames to avoid the bomb. He can get in a large combo after MB Straight Grapple.

    Slide Kick
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Batman goes through invulnerability frames to avoid the bomb. Harley is knocked down.

    The Dark Knight (Super)
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Batman armors through bomb, but takes 15%. Harley takes about 33%.

    VERDICT: It's not safe to use 112 to activate trait against Batman. Although his slide is negligible, he can get a large combo from wake-up grapple.

    NIGHTWING:
    [​IMG]

    Flying Grayson
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Nightwing goes through invulnerability frames and avoids any damage. Harley takes 13% to the face.

    VERDICT: You have a 66% chance to get away for free, however you can take a knock-down and some damage if Nightwing uses Flying Grayson as his wake-up. You are completely safe if he's in Escrima stance.

    THE FLASH:
    [​IMG]

    Lightning Charge
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Punishable. 7.5% recovery effect still takes place. Harley takes 9%; 1.5% loss.
    Bomb: Unpunishable

    Speed Zone (Super)
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Punishable. Harley takes 38.5% Super damage.
    Bomb: Punishable. Flash gets hit by bomb for 15% then Harley takes 38.5% Super damage.

    VERDICT: 112 xx 4 is good to use against the Flash unless he has full meter.

    SUPERMAN:
    [​IMG]

    Kryptonian Crush (Super)
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Punishable. Harley takes 34% damage.
    Bomb: Punishable. Superman armors through bomb taking 15% before dealing 34% damage to Harley.

    VERDICT: Don't trait after 112 when Superman has full meter.

    GREEN ARROW:
    [​IMG]

    Stinger
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable
    Bomb: Punishable. Harley takes about 7%.

    Aresenal Assualt (Super)
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable
    Bomb: Punishable. Arrow takes the 15% from bomb but Harley takes he full 32% Super and whatever Arrow's wants as a follow-up (including unclashable damage).

    VERDICT: As long as Arrow doesn't have Super the risk of getting hit is a low one.

    CYBORG:
    [​IMG]

    Nova Blaster
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Trades. Harley will take 8%, but Cyborg will be knocked upward and take 15%.

    Techno Tackle
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Cyborg goes through invulnerability frames, Harley takes a knock-down and 9%.

    Target Lock (Super)
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Punishable. Cyborg supers Harley for 35%.
    Bomb: Punishable. Cyborg armors through the bomb to take 15%, then hits Harley for 35%.

    VERDICT: Techno Tackle as a wake-up is pretty negligible, avoid using 112 to trait if he is at full meter.

    WONDER WOMAN:
    [​IMG]

    Justice Javelin (Super)
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Wonder Woman takes the 15% but armors through it and deals 38% to Harley.

    VERDICT: Don't use 112 to trait if Wonder Woman has full meter.

    AQUAMAN:
    [​IMG]

    From the Deep
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Stance Dependant. When in different stances, bomb will connect for 15% damage. Harley will not be able to take advantage of the knock-up as she will still be hit by From the Deep for about 8%. Bomb whiffs while in the same stance.

    VERDICT: 17% chance to punish assuming your stance is 50/50. You can lower this to 0 by watching your stance.

    RAVEN:
    [​IMG]

    Soul Crush
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable.
    Ivy's Flower: Punishable. Harley takes 8.65% damage, but Raven can MB for a small combo.
    Bomb: Stance Dependant. If in different stances, the bomb will connect for 15% damage to Raven and 2% damage to Harley. If in the same stance the bomb will whiff.

    VERDICT: If you are watching your stance you are safe 66% of the time. Too risky, as it can allow Raven to get distance between you and/or activate trait.


    GREEN LANTERN:
    [​IMG]

    Oa's Rocket
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable.
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Stance Dependant. If in different stances the bomb will hit for full affect, making Oa's Rocket not come out. If in the same stance the bomb whiffs and Harley takes 8% (combo if it's MB'd).

    Lantern's Might
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Punishable. Harley can be combo'd for large damage off of Lantern's Might MB.
    Bomb: Unpunishable. Full bomb affect for Harley to take advantage of.

    Minigun
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Stance Dependant. If in different stances, GL gets punished. However, in the same stance Harley takes about 7%.

    VERDICT: Due to the risk of full combo with wake-up Lantern's Might and a large combo with Oa's Rocket, don't risk using 112 to set-up bomb trait.

    HAWKGIRL:
    [​IMG]

    The Power of Nth (Super)
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Hawkgirl takes 15% damage, then Harley takes 36% Super damage.

    Mace Charge
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Harley takes 15%, Hawkgirl avoids the bomb completely.

    VERDICT: It may not be wise to trait against Hawkgirl, you will be safe 66% of the time when she's below full meter.

    BATGIRL:
    [​IMG]

    Batwheel
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Harley takes a decent punish from ~7-13%.
    *NOTE* The second hit of Batwheel can make Harley guess which way to block. This can be avoided by jumping or backdashing after a flower or picture trait.

    Smoke Bomb
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Much like Zod's wake-ups, Harley's bomb whiffs when in different stances. She will eat full punish into vortex.

    VERDICT: Unless you're watching your stance it is much too risky to trait using this method against Batgirl. You don't want to be caught in her vortex if you can help it.
    Spinky, KIllaByte, 4x4lo8o and 7 others like this.
  2. cpmd4

    cpmd4 Slaughter is the Best Medicine

    HARLEY QUINN:
    [​IMG]

    Tantrum Stance
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Harley goes through invulnerability frames on wake-up Tantrum to avoid your bomb, gets full combo punish.

    VERDICT: Don't use 112 to set-up trait against a mirror. Risk of full-combo punish on Harley's best wake-up.

    SOLOMON GRUNDY:
    [​IMG]

    Cleaver Spin
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Grundy goes through invulnerability frames and avoids the bomb. Harley takes a knock-down and 10%.

    VERDICT: You're pretty safe against any punishment from Grundy, and he's probably going to wake-up Walking Corpse instead unless he knows to do otherwise, which can be jumped.

    *NOTE* Always jump to avoid Grundy's wake-up if you get bomb after 112. Jumping avoids everything but the cleaver after bomb.

    LEX LUTHOR:
    [​IMG]

    Corps Charge
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Lex goes through invulnerability frames to hit Harley for 9% and a knock-down. He has time to set-up now.

    Lance Blast
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Stance Dependant. If in different stances, he gets hit by bomb for a combo. If in the same, bomb whiffs and Harley takes a mere 3%.

    VERDICT: Lex will probably wake-up Corps Charge. You are safe 66% of the time, however, it's probably best to just trait off of f23 since the knockdown allows him to set-up.

    DEATHSTROKE:
    [​IMG]

    Quick Fire
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Punishable. Harley takes 5.85% damage, still recovers 7.5% for a 1.65% gain.
    Bomb: Punishable. Harley takes about 5.85% damage, but Deathstroke eats a bomb for 15%. Harley cannot capitalize on his knocked-up state due to hit stun.

    Low Shots
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Harley takes 5.85% damage, Deathstroke gets hit for 15% by the bomb. Harley cannot capitalize on his knocked-up state due to hit stun.

    VERDICT: Deathstroke can hit Harley for traiting, however she gets much more out of it than he does.

    ARES:
    [​IMG]

    Annihilator:
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Ares armors through the bomb taking 15% and deals 33% to Harley.

    VERDICT: Don't 112 trait when Ares has Super meter.

    *NOTE* Ares can MB teleport to be in your face, but cannot follow-up fast enough to get anything but chip on you as long as you block correctly.

    DOOMSDAY:
    [​IMG]

    Venom
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Doomsday goes through invulnerability frames, hits Harley for 8%. And now he's in your face and you're on the ground.

    Mass Destruction (Super)
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Punishable. Harley takes 34%.
    Bomb: Punishable. Doomsday armors through the bomb taking 15%, then hits Harley for 34%.

    VERDICT: It's probably not worth the risk of traiting if your opponent uses Venom to wake-up or if he's at full meter.

    KILLER FROST:
    [​IMG]

    Iceburg
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Harley takes 3% damage, Killer Frost gets hit for 15% by the bomb. Harley cannot capitalize on her knocked-up state due to hit stun.

    Black Ice (Slide)
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Frost goes through invulnerability frames and avoids the bomb's effects. She gets Harley in a full combo vortex.

    VERDICT: Killer Frost gets full combo into a 50/50 situation if you get bomb. Don't risk it, we all know she's going to wake-up Slide.

    BLACK ADAM:
    [​IMG]

    Lightning Strike
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Stance Dependant. When in the same stance, bomb whiffs and Harley takes the damage. In opposite stances, the bomb hits for a launch.

    Teth Adam (Super)
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Black Adam takes the 15% from the bomb, then hits Harley for 35.65%.

    VERDICT: Much like many of the characters before him, he is only a real threat to Harley's trait with full meter. Watch your stance and you'll be guaranteed safe.

    LOBO:
    [​IMG]

    Pump Shots (Traited Only)
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Harley takes 15% from the traited shots.

    Hook Charge
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Punishable. Harley takes 15.4% and recovered 7.5% for a loss of 7.9% health.
    Bomb: Punishable. Lobo goes through invulnerability frames negating the bomb to deal 15.4%.

    The Main Man (Super)
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishable. Lobo takes the 15% from the bomb but armors through for 33% damage to Harley.

    VERDICT: It's quite risky to use this method of traiting against Lobo, it's not advised.

    ZOD:
    [​IMG]

    Sidearm
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Stance Dependant. Trades. In the same stance Zod takes the full bomb and Harley takes only 6%. She cannot take advantage of the knock-up. In the different stances the bomb whiffs and Harley takes the full 6% with the chance of an additional 1% if meter burned. This is an unusual circumstance since bomb is safer in different stances against all other characters except Batgirl.

    Phantom Strike
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Punishable. Harley takes 7% or about 10.5% if it's meter burned.
    Bomb: Stance Dependant. As with the Sidearm special, the bomb whiffs in different stances.

    VERDICT: Because of the odd stance dependency, it can be risky to trait this way against Zod. However, if he is not using Phamtom Strike to wake-up you should be fine.

    SCORPION:
    [​IMG]

    Telepunch
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishible. Scorpion is at advantage after a hit, and can combo after MB telepunch.

    Leg Takedown
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishible. Deals 8%, but cannot be capitalized on like telepunch can.

    Welcome to the Netherrealm (Super)
    Joker Picture: Unpunishable
    Ivy's Flower: Unpunishable.
    Bomb: Punishible. Scorpion avoids the bomb completely and does a smooth 37%.

    VERDICT: Telepunch is a good wake-up in general and leads into Scorpions (albeit unsafe) vortex. It could lead to some real hurt. It's probably best not to use 112 to trait against him, especially if he has Super.

    ________________________________________________
    Spinky, KIllaByte, Katt and 3 others like this.
  3. serge

    serge Active Member

    Great work, thanks!
    I think I'd still prefer to end my combos with 112 xx SS or 112 PD mb but I'll give it a try tonight with the trait.
    If only it wasn't random.
    KIllaByte likes this.
  4. Crashtag

    Crashtag New Member

    Took some time with this tech and I'm very happy to see some more progression on this character. One thing to mention is that F2+D3 actually changes stances for you so you should keep in mind where she was looking before hand. I don't know of any other series that changes her stance mid-combo but if you never press the stance button and use this tech, you'll be at stance advantage naturally. (Facing away while opponent is facing the screen most of the time) Props to you sir.
  5. cpmd4

    cpmd4 Slaughter is the Best Medicine

    Yeah, I am unable to test this against players since I don't have Xbox Live at the moment so I don't know how viable any of this is. Just thought I'd share what I found in case someone can use this info!
    AFAIK as long as you are in opposing stance when you begin a string, it doesn't matter if you switch stances mid-string. Will have to test this to make sure.
    Katt likes this.
  6. Alien Substance

    Alien Substance Evanesce Staff Member

    A very useful benefaction.

    Stickied.
    KIllaByte likes this.
  7. Crashtag

    Crashtag New Member

    Well first thing I did was test it with about a dozen or so matches. It seems to be the answer to using her trait as safe as it can be. Also note the when you are inputting J2 you should press it early as Harley's positioning will be below the opponent leaving them even higher when connecting the F2+3. Ill be streaming tomorrow to expose this valuable tech. Also tested some of the wake up options for certain cyaracters and it seems that Aquaman actually cant punish any of the traits. Not sure if its something to do with patch 1.04 but it seemed pretty consistent.
    cpmd4 likes this.
  8. Ronald_A_Knox

    Ronald_A_Knox Clipeum Aurea

    I would love to see some experiments on her stance change outside of trait. This seems to be a thing Harley does fairly often(i mean, stance changing with other moves), so maybe explore some possibilities?
  9. Saint Connor

    Saint Connor Team F.Y.F.

    Let me start by saying this is a great compilation of how the trait works and its efficiency against each opponenet, and I am in no way trying to bash this effort. I do, however, look at her trait very negatively (and rightly so), and I have a saying that the optimistic man invented the automobile and the pestimistic man invented the seatbelt. Basically, that things sometimes need to be in a negative light in order to make it better and truely understand how it works (or doesn't work).

    That said...

    There are better enders (3,3 or 1,1,2) that result in both more damage and/or better opportunity for setups rather than setting up a trait that you *might* get. Additionally, f2,3 makes bomb completely null and void, and because it pushes the opponent 3/4 to fullscreen away, portrait now becomes a "I now have to put up naked fullscreen pressure just to make use of this trait", which can lead to some bad decision making.



    This is actually very interesting and a good find. Unfortunately, the randomness of the trait on top of the fact that there is a good chance that you are going to take damage leaves me wanting more out of it.

    Also an interesting find, but I feel Harley has a lot more she needs to worry about and pay attention to in order to read her opponent than a small quirk like what stance they are in. Overtime, I'm sure people will be more prone to recognizing stance changes, but for now it is pretty much irrelevant. Also, some characters are more likely to change stances through their move set than others. For instance, Batgirl changes stances often throughout her BnBs. Harley, on the other hand, really only changes stances after gunshots and her BnBs always end in the same stance.

    This is probably one of the big upsides as you can really get into mind games here. This is why I absolutely love how Pop Pop works. f2,3 is one of the best ways to set up Pop Pop outside of combos. The threat of the unblockable charge and the fact that she can MB to instant recover forces the opponent to play passive and attempt to make a read, playing into Harley's need to create offense and mixups. The threat and ability for Pop Pop to effectively control the entirety of the screen and situation can allow you to sneek it a trait here and there. Veteran players will most likely be able to notice the difference in a Pop Pop setup and a trait setup and be able to react accordingly, but even the Vets can be conditioned.

    This is more of me bitching....but why the fuck is the trait that returns health the one that is more likely to make you lose it. Fucking ridiculous.

    This goes to #1 with portrait and #5 with rose. f2,3 is going to make portrait hard to utilize and the good chance that Harley is going to take damage for getting a rose negates the positive effects of using it. On top of that, the only way to set up bomb properly is from close hard knockdowns which makes the other 2 traits extremely risky. I get what you are saying though that after a f2,3 they could get hit by bomb attempting to punish her trait, but trait's randomness really kills it.

    All-in-all, like I said, this is a great list and effort. Let's just hope NRS gives Harley a little bit of love soon. Until then, keep up the good work!
  10. KamkaziChicila

    KamkaziChicila Harley & Zatana is all I need.

    Thanks for the full list of safe/unsfae for each character so far (minus DLC). Hopefully, people would start using her trait and have some set-ups for different MUs
  11. cpmd4

    cpmd4 Slaughter is the Best Medicine

    I totally understand. I am by no means a very skilled player and I lack online play at the moment so my main reason for sharing is to get the info out to other Harley players that can use it better than I suggested or use it to make bigger finds, if it is indeed usable at all.
    KIllaByte, Saint Connor and Katt like this.
  12. k1nG_Qu1nN

    k1nG_Qu1nN The King

    Very Very nice thread.
  13. Crashtag

    Crashtag New Member

    So I've been streaming and playing matches with his tech of yours and has been an overall positive level up in game because of it. Though it is a gamble still even at it's worst I don't get punished severely (Yet). Just giving you a heads up CPMD4 I've given you credit on my stream. The tech is godlike. Much appreciated.
  14. Saboteur-6

    Saboteur-6 Really wants to be able to change his sig banner.

    PSN:
    Saboteur-6
    I think "godlike" is a bit of an overstatement. All your experiencing is what most of the cast experiences already ; the feeling of being able to use your character trait successfully. It'll pass sadly as you realize that :

    1. The f2,3 string can be finished with better options.

    2. Landing 4 after f2,3 nullifies the bomb so you're sacrificing combo potential, spacing, etc for a weak heal or a damage buff out pressure range.

    3. You're playing a meta game with yourself just trying to find a way to make her trait work at all.


    Bottom line is that Harley's trait is ass. Luckily her gameplay isn't dependent on trait. When you see how pivotal trait is for the vast majority of the roster though it'll make you a bit sick to your stomach. At this point, I'd rather have trait just troll people with Harley tossing out random insults and taunts (like throwing a rubber dick at the opponent for no damage) as long as trait had SAFER GODDAM RECOVERY.
    k1nG_Qu1nN and xWEBSx like this.
  15. xWEBSx

    xWEBSx Well-Known Member

    I absolutely LOVE the work that OP put into this.. That type of care is what makes characters progress.. However, I must agree 100% with this... Especially point 3. And his closing paragraph.. And it is fucking UNFORTUNATE. Now that our biggest trait secret is becoming more common knowledge about Joker Pic and damage.. We can expect to see her already useless trait... Get "fixed" by getting nerfed... BOHICA boys and gals.. BOHICA :(

    *BOHICA- Bed Over Here It Comes Again..
  16. serge

    serge Active Member

    I'm not sure if this was posted yet but yesterday I saw some Harley player on a stream do b22, ts1, b3, j2, j2, 11 xx trait.
    If you get the bomb, it will hit 100% and you can b3 into more comboage.
    Looked pretty sick !
    Not sure what happens if you get the flower or the picture, didn't have time to test yet.
  17. KamkaziChicila

    KamkaziChicila Harley & Zatana is all I need.

    If they don't roll it hits, if they roll you get hit with full combo :/

    EDIT: Rolls = No Bomb No Rolls = Hits
  18. serge

    serge Active Member

    So it works if you get the bomb and if they don't roll.
    That's a lot of ifs.
    :(
  19. testyourpatience

    testyourpatience ryx's best friend

    it's so stupid that wakeup attacks beat her bomb. so it's a risk to not only go for the bomb but also have it hit. the bomb should beat invincibility. it should have invincibility to invincibility.
  20. Mood4food77

    Mood4food77 Member

    make her bomb invincible to physical attacks
    make the other two invincible to non-physical attacks

    there, harley's trait buffed and usable
  21. testyourpatience

    testyourpatience ryx's best friend

    nah that sounds like a last minute, ghetto bandaid. i'd like them to go beyond changing startup/recovery and actually give us a reason to go for it instead of finishing our combo. then again, that's exactly what sinestro got. there are some character who would be complete garbage without their trait: green arrow, batman, bane, etc.
  22. Mood4food77

    Mood4food77 Member

    the benefits of the trait are useful, there's just no way to use it right now

    giving it those buffs makes it usable while allowing us to keep all the benefits
  23. testyourpatience

    testyourpatience ryx's best friend

    not really. it's still too risky to knock your opponent down and go for trait because, if she doesn't get the bomb, she'll just get hit, and it would be stupid to get hit by a wakeup attack in that situation because she could have just ended her combo with play doctor instead. her trait needs more tuning than that. not only that but also her trait recharges pretty fast, and the boosts only last until the trait recharges.
    xWEBSx likes this.
  24. k1nG_Qu1nN

    k1nG_Qu1nN The King

    Whats a good follow up after landing TNT?
  25. xWEBSx

    xWEBSx Well-Known Member

    From the range at which it lands.. Any of your typical B'n'B combos will work.. Can either look at it as a jump in A2A or a ground bounce from a F3.. That's how I view it..

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