General/Other - Ermac [EO Beta] Ermac Beta Thread

[Creature Feature]

I've been playing Ermac(ma boi) since the release of MKX and have developed a few ideas as to how this character could be improved while maintaining his flavour of being "typically defensive with punishing combos" as Paulo put it in the Kombat Kast reveal.

Most of Ermac's normals are too slow on startup to counter poke characters like Jax, Cassie or D'Vorah etc he has a hard time with pressure and kung fu masters in his face. The only decent poke he has is d4 which everyone loathes but hey that's why it's done. His mix up starters are ok and don't seem to be that punishable.

Variationless - Back 2 fully charged should be unblockable. Teleport speed should be "slightly" increased. Would be cool if you could ex telestomp that leads to a pop-up and full combo (this would create a reward for flying directly above opponent in Spectral)

MoS - Disappear should be faster on startup and opponents should not be able able to throw you out of a disappeared state.

Mystic - This should be the default Ermac variation as it contains a similar moveset to that of previous incantations of the character and yet it really sucks. I believe his force push move's hit box should be slightly increased both horizontally and vertically but keep the start up speed the same so that he becomes the space control character he should be. Startup for force lift speed should be slightly increased.

Spectral - As I've mentioned before would be cool to have a pop-up from telestomp and and air-grab like Sonyas, Jax's and D'vorahs wouldn't go a miss.

 

[StealthyMuffin]

Even on Christmas...

The Nazis could be invading the west coast and I could load up TYM and find a new proposed buff thread.

 

[-Blinky-]

Make Mystics Ermac gain more health and meter from EX Tele Push, also make Tele Push -6 on block.

 

[gam224]

Why is ermac even bad? I don't really get it personally.

 

[SoapBar]

700% from a meterless projectile.:/

 

[Ragnarök Tyr]

General mixups

F4 (overhead) -20 on block
B3 (low) -3 not very punishable.

Soul Ball -23 on block - committing off of b3/f4 mixup.

D1 - 6 frame startup -10 on block
D3 - 8 frame startup -7 on block

B2 full charge being unblockable would be a pointless buff in my opinion since it would be unlikely to hit anyone with the move. As of now it's only practical use is a feint once or twice against an opponent.

Anything Ermac uses to mixup for big damage is combo punishable. The offset for this is the high damage. He may need some adjusting, but overall he isn't that bad of a character.

 

[EntropicByDesign]

Even on Christmas...

The Nazis could be invading the west coast and I could load up TYM and find a new proposed buff thread.

If the west coast got the suggested buffs the Nazis wouldn't be able to invade it in the first place. Jesus dude, git gud.

 

[StealthyMuffin]

If the west coast got the suggested buffs the Nazis wouldn't be able to invade it in the first place. Jesus dude, git gud.

Nazi Germany vs California is currently a 7-3 MU

 

[Lt. Boxy Angelman]

Ermac is almost perfectly balanced.

If you were to give a tiny tweak to Mystic and Spectral, he would have literally zero need to ever be touched again.

One of my absolute favorite characters to fight at ultra high levels because he's fearsome without being full of shit.

 

[EntropicByDesign]

Cali needs a 6f d1 and more + frames on launcher.

 

[haketh]

Most of Ermac's normals are too slow on startup to counter poke characters like Jax, Cassie or D'Vorah etc he has a hard time with pressure and kung fu masters in his face. The only decent poke he has is d4 which everyone loathes but hey that's why it's done. His mix up starters are ok and don't seem to be that punishable.

We have a decent ranged 5 frame D1 & D3 is solid........

For spacing we really just need B1 to hit mid correctly with no whiffs

 

[AU_JUST_LOST]

So I really enjoy this variation but it's VERY tough to get f4 into flight. I don't know if it's just me but this is really holding me back from exploring the character any further. I'm hoping they eventually change the input from ddu to just du. This would make it significantly easier to combo out of his strings and do the combos and safe pressure he was meant to do. What do yall think? Do I just need to practice it more or is it really this difficult to do consistently?

 

[Scott The Scot]

You just need to practice more. I know @Nausea can get it consistently. If you make it just du then people will get float when they don't want to more often, which is a lot worse than something you can practice to get 10/10.

 

[Doctor Rektangle]

I can't do it consistently on PS4 pad at best 3 out of 10. Practiced for a total of 7 hours across 5 days. So, I just don't go for it. Although doing it off a blocked jump in, makes it much easier to do. Jip f4xxlevitate I can do 100%.

Might stop me from ever doing the best potential spectral things but, on the other hand I don't rely on the fifty/fifty for damage. Also jipxxfloat before you hit the ground is also easier.

 

[AU_JUST_LOST]

ut it's important to have those 50/50's to open up the opponent and b34 and b3 (flight)3 can really mess with your opponent. Throw some ground slam in there and you can really start messing with their heads. This isn't my first time practicing it and I really do want to master but the input period off of f4 is just too strict. If not du then at least make it something else that people can input faster

 

[Goat-City]

Raiden's teleport is du, so I don't see how it could be that big of a problem to make it the same for Spectral.

 

[Scott The Scot]

Raiden's teleport is du, so I don't see how it could be that big of a problem to make it the same for Spectral.

Maybe you're right about that. Anyway, I don't think it's what the input is that's the problem because as a hitbox user I can input it suuuuuper fast and it won't come out or I can stick to the 'rhythm' that you should do and it comes out every time. I don't know what the problem is but if they make it du then I won't be sad or anything.

 

[Nausea]

It takes alotta practice but I agree the input is whack. D,U is not practical enough I think. It would probably lead to a few rage inducing input errors. If it was D,U,3 or something or D,B,U that be cool, but in the meantime, its just practice. I can't really see them changing the input but I guess time will tell!

It is much much easier off a JIP like @Doctor Rektangle mentioned. Practice that a little more and you start to get a feel for the timing of it.

Here's a thread I made a while ago with his optimal bnb's mid-screen with no meter if it helps at all
http://testyourmight.com/threads/spectral-ermac-soul-ascension-conversions-mid-screen-no-meter.56911/

 

[BoromiRofGeo]

http://testyourmight.com/threads/changes-ermac-needs-with-kp2.57538/

 

[MKF30]

I wish they would have given him universal fireball. I hate how it's only in one variation.

 

[ValeDJ]

The hardest part of the DDU is the fact that....its killed my dpad

It does take a lot of practice, especially if you "vortex" in the corner, I struggle more with the b3 into levitate, but it is all about timing and practice.

 

[God Confirm]

Maybe you're right about that. Anyway, I don't think it's what the input is that's the problem because as a hitbox user I can input it suuuuuper fast and it won't come out or I can stick to the 'rhythm' that you should do and it comes out every time. I don't know what the problem is but if they make it du then I won't be sad or anything.

The problem is I don't have $450 for a Hitbox so that kinda blocks me off from using the character realistically, and all because of a DDU input that is completely unnecessary

It takes alotta practice but I agree the input is whack. D,U is not practical enough I think. It would probably lead to a few rage inducing input errors. If it was D,U,3 or something or D,B,U that be cool, but in the meantime, its just practice. I can't really see them changing the input but I guess time will tell!

It is much much easier off a JIP like @Doctor Rektangle mentioned. Practice that a little more and you start to get a feel for the timing of it.

Here's a thread I made a while ago with his optimal bnb's mid-screen with no meter if it helps at all
http://testyourmight.com/threads/spectral-ermac-soul-ascension-conversions-mid-screen-no-meter.56911/

They changed Unbreakable's unintuitive input so its not out of the realm of possibility

 

[Scott The Scot]

The problem is I don't have $450 for a Hitbox so that kinda blocks me off from using the character realistically, and all because of a DDU input that is completely unnecessary

You completely missed my point. I was making the point that speed isn't the problem, you need to learn the corredct rhythm. I can do it on pad as well. You literally just need to practice and you will get it, very possible.

 

[God Confirm]

You completely missed my point. I was making the point that speed isn't the problem, you need to learn the corredct rhythm. I can do it on pad as well. You literally just need to practice and you will get it, very possible.

That's all great, its a stupid unnecessary barrier however, it's a ridiculously tough input for just a 1 hit cancel, it could be literally anything else. I could do it on pad as well, now it's possibly I could spend a shitload of time getting it consistent, its possible I'll never get there, best case scenario with something of this difficulty is that no matter how consistent I get it, it will still fuck up on me occasionally in game because of the difficult input thats inevitable, and the question is "why". So much else that it could be. No sense in keeping this input so hard, plus if I was to ever play him I still wouldn't want to do it on anything bar Hitbox no matter how consistent I got it on pad, just for quality of life and the longevity of my fingers lol. And thats a stupid cost of entry for a character, it's not like it's dirt like insta air guns, or fireball run cancels, or something like that, it's just a standard ass opener that leads to like ~35% iirc, really doesn't deserve this difficulty barrier

 

[Scott The Scot]

That's all great, its a stupid unnecessary barrier however, it's a ridiculously tough input for just a 1 hit cancel, it could be literally anything else. I could do it on pad as well, now it's possibly I could spend a shitload of time getting it consistent, its possible I'll never get there, best case scenario with something of this difficulty is that no matter how consistent I get it, it will still fuck up on me occasionally in game because of the difficult input thats inevitable, and the question is "why". So much else that it could be. No sense in keeping this input so hard, plus if I was to ever play him I still wouldn't want to do it on anything bar Hitbox no matter how consistent I got it on pad, just for quality of life and the longevity of my fingers lol. And thats a stupid cost of entry for a character, it's not like it's dirt like insta air guns, or fireball run cancels, or something like that, it's just a standard ass opener that leads to like ~35% iirc, really doesn't deserve this difficulty barrier

Hitbox doesn't make it any easier, though imo. It's an easy input, it's the timing that's odd. Nausea does it consistently (every time) at our local on an Xbox One pad. I will say it is a little more difficult than it should be, but I feel like it's a software thing that could be adjusted by NRS.