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Match-up Discussion Batman Match-Up Discussion

Shawi

Noob
This is tough for batman but not unwinnable. (inb4 friction trolls, LOL). Also, don't let him condition you (easier said than done, but at 3/4 screen and more there is no reason not to block low. if he MB LC's at you that shit is punishable in duck block but NOT stand block. On stand flash is plus. if you're trying to press buttons after that he gets a free D1D2 check. This is (yet again) another one of those matches where you CONSTANTLY need your trait out, doesn't matter if its 1 bat or 3. Also, someon should correct me if I'm wrong, but Flash's wakeups are not superb (yes they are better than BM's but LBSH bats' wakeups are shit). his lightning uppercut can be punished and his lightning charge can be punished. I'd have to lab and see if his naked sonic pound wakeup is punishable, but you can at least have time to react to it if you're baiting wakeup. I'm still unsure of whether or not lightning kick is a wakeup, I'd have to find out later, or you can go into practice mode and test it.
Absolutely it's not unwinable, but it's 6-4/7-3 to flash. And those 3/10 come with flawless bat management (meant to say in my post that I thought it was 6-4 to flash)
 

MKR

Noob
what about Superman vs. batman matchup please share with me like mk matchup chart like superman 5-6 batman
 

YOMI Reno_Racks

I have a dream...
Absolutely it's not unwinable, but it's 6-4/7-3 to flash. And those 3/10 come with flawless bat management (meant to say in my post that I thought it was 6-4 to flash)
I think it's 5-5 honestly. My friend AK Harold (Best tournament Flash) and I have run the mu a bizillion times and although it felt awful at first, now it's one of my favorite mu's to play and I feel we both have our strengths that make the fight competitive and even overall.

To not waste too much time talking theory I'll just briefly sum up my thoughts. Although Flash can be trouble after he scores a knockdown, it's very hard for him to touch Batman in the first place because BM can keep him out so well while punishing his advances with big meterless damage. Batman can also limit Flash's pressure due to being one of the few characters who can punish any b22xxsoniccpound on reaction with his parry. You have all the tools to keep Flash out so that has to be your #1 priority. If he gets in, you are no more f$$ked than any other character is so it's not exactly an advantage he has over Bruce in particular. Just zone your ass off and try to punish him when he tries to get in. Easier said than done I know but that's my own game plan.

Here's some recent footage of us at the AKA weekly for you to check out:
 

Shawi

Noob
Hey man!! Yeah I saw your games on stream! What I don't get is why Harold didn't mb head-but into combo after you throw a naked batarang without trailing bats. All he needs to do is jump over it and you're at minus oblivion! Why does flash even need to do sonic pound? Why doesn't he just do kicks after every string. He doesn't need to use b22 vs batman, only d1d2 and f2. I should get some videos of the flash player I play against to show u what I mean.
 
Hey man!! Yeah I saw your games on stream! What I don't get is why Harold didn't mb head-but into combo after you throw a naked batarang without trailing bats. All he needs to do is jump over it and you're at minus oblivion! Why does flash even need to do sonic pound? Why doesn't he just do kicks after every string. He doesn't need to use b22 vs batman, only d1d2 and f2. I should get some videos of the flash player I play against to show u what I mean.
Thanks I'll try that.
 

YOMI Reno_Racks

I have a dream...
Hey man!! Yeah I saw your games on stream! What I don't get is why Harold didn't mb head-but into combo after you throw a naked batarang without trailing bats. All he needs to do is jump over it and you're at minus oblivion! Why does flash even need to do sonic pound? Why doesn't he just do kicks after every string. He doesn't need to use b22 vs batman, only d1d2 and f2. I should get some videos of the flash player I play against to show u what I mean.
A good idea when any character is trying to counter zone you is if you have meter, bait the counter zone attempt and full combo punish.

Next time you're chunking batarangs at your buddy, mb and duck instantly the moment you see him go into mbhb and punish him. When you mb the batarang you recover instantly, so fast that you can even bait out Superman's super from half screen or further.

It's awesome against characters like Batgirl who are very punishable on block when they try to counterzone. Spending a bar for a full combo is very worth it and once you do it a few times, they now have to respect that option when you have meter which opens your zoning back up.
 

Shawi

Noob
That is all good on paper, but I can't see it working in practice. Especially now that bats take 9 seconds to recharge.
 

GamerBlake90

Blue Blurs for Life!
I think it's only fair to give my fellow Dark Knights a heads-up about the Doomsday match-up (if this is already known, feel free to say so).

Go to training mode, pick Doomsday as the opponent, pick any level at all, and then start the practice match with both characters at a corner. Set Doomsday to crouch-block, then do b2 3. What you will see is the following:

Doomsday blocks the first hit and takes the second because he's crouch-blocking and the second hit is an overhead, but when the follow-up explosion occurs, Doomsday is not juggled at all and Batman gains no combo opportunity.

I just came across this bullshit after fighting a Doomsday player on PSN. At first I assumed it was a costume-specific glitch since the Doomsday player was using his Containment Suit skin, but when I tested this with Doomsday in his primary skin, the problem still occurred.

Luckily, the explosion will still connect against Doomsday if any of the following scenarios happen:

A) If he doesn't block any of the b2 3 string at midscreen or in the corner.
B) If he blocks the b2 but eats the 3 at midscreen.

Does anyone have any idea as to why this happens? :(

Rude Metzos SonicBoomBrad FOREVER KING AK Reno_Racks Noobe TheTruth4591 UsedForGlue NB Semi Evil Ryu

EDIT: So apparently, this happens if you stand literally right next to Doomsday when doing b2 3. If you create a little bit of space between yourself and Doomsday before doing b2 3, the explosion from the string WILL connect. Interesting...at least it eliminates the earlier problem.
 
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Rude

You will serve me in The Netherrealm
So, if he blocks the first hit of b23 in the corner, while crouching, the second hit can connect, but the explosion will not launch. This is true.

However, I've found this is only true at point-blank range. If you take a step back and do b23, he will be launched as normal, but the gravity will be slightly different, so keep that in mind.
 

GamerBlake90

Blue Blurs for Life!
So, if he blocks the first hit of b23 in the corner, while crouching, the second hit can connect, but the explosion will not launch. This is true.

However, I've found this is only true at point-blank range. If you take a step back and do b23, he will be launched as normal, but the gravity will be slightly different, so keep that in mind.
Yeah, I've just been informed of that by a fellow Atlanta player. Thanks for the heads-up all the same. I'll update my old post.
 

RM Truth

Unintentional Tier Whore Follow me @TruthRM
I was playing against PPJ's Hawkgirl in the GGA team tournament on, and I came up with some stuff looking back on the match. I think Up Batarangs are really good against Hawkgirl. It not only keeps her out of the sky, but most of her approach options, like mace charge and MB mace throw, put her in the path of it. It makes it a really good deterrant from her trying to charge in. I didn't get a chance to try it, but I also think that MB Up batarang on her wake up might be worth doing as well. If she tries to wake up, she gets ground bounced for full combo. If she blocks, ur at + 30ish and able to start pressure. Thoughts?
 

Rude

You will serve me in The Netherrealm
I was playing against PPJ's Hawkgirl in the GGA team tournament on, and I came up with some stuff looking back on the match. I think Up Batarangs are really good against Hawkgirl. It not only keeps her out of the sky, but most of her approach options, like mace charge and MB mace throw, put her in the path of it. It makes it a really good deterrant from her trying to charge in. I didn't get a chance to try it, but I also think that MB Up batarang on her wake up might be worth doing as well. If she tries to wake up, she gets ground bounced for full combo. If she blocks, ur at + 30ish and able to start pressure. Thoughts?
Absolutely. I've done a lot of leveling up in this match and I will say right now that Up Batarang is essential. I haven't had a chance to try your MB Up Batarang tech, but I'll give it a go.

You can interrupt two of her strings with Parry. I think one of them is F11 something. F1(parry)1. I'll need to look up the other one.

Also, unless they're done off of a string, jump back 2s and neutral jump 2s can beat Mace Charge and Wing Evade fairly consistently. Converting is a bit of an issue, but nothing that can't be worked out in the lab.
 

BlastX21

Noob
What do we do against Bane when he's at level 2 and 3?

Advice on the Bane matchup in general would be appreciated.
 

The Great One

"I Always d1 Lif-" SHUT UP
Ok so to be clear, Batman just can't beat Aquaman? It's unwinnable? (By unwinnable I mean if he's even close to decent)

What should you do then? Switch characters or is it not that extreme and you can still win as long as you don't incorporate meter burn grappling hook and B1, and 113, 223, 112, into your combos?
 

Rude

You will serve me in The Netherrealm
Ok so to be clear, Batman just can't beat Aquaman? It's unwinnable? (By unwinnable I mean if he's even close to decent)

What should you do then? Switch characters or is it not that extreme and you can still win as long as you don't incorporate meter burn grappling hook and B1, and 113, 223, 112, into your combos?
@HomeLee1121
 
Ok so to be clear, Batman just can't beat Aquaman? It's unwinnable? (By unwinnable I mean if he's even close to decent)

What should you do then? Switch characters or is it not that extreme and you can still win as long as you don't incorporate meter burn grappling hook and B1, and 113, 223, 112, into your combos?
I personally think its 5-5. I've told @Rude about some stuff that might help out in the MU. First off, your blocking must be on point, im talking like reacting to overheads and blocking his main low strings. Next, you wanna try your best to stay on the right side of the screen at all times. Trident rush is full combo punishable on the right side only b/c the bat is closer to Aquaman then on the left. You also wanna get a good feel of FTD b/c if you can jump it in time and release a bat, you can dash up and full combo punish if close enough. Your go to string will 1,1,3 only b/c if the aquaman player doesn't trait up by the first hit, the 3 will still land and will knock him off his feet so trait is null at that point. Also batman's resets still work, you just need to use j3 instead of j2 b/c it will nullify the trait. If you even have one bat out, just be patient and try to hit him with the bat and then connect with b3. This will only work if he traits after the bat connects, if he traits up before it won't work. Last thing that i use against aquaman. If you have him in the corner and you're about half a screen away, start zoning if you have meter. Don't let that guy out of the corner. If he jumps? up batarang then combo off a mb or release a bat into b3. He wants to just dash out? Bat's or MB batarangs. He literally can not do anything in that situation. Trait managment is also very important. It allows you to throw batarangs without having to worry about from the deep.

Hope this all helps!
 
I have huge problems with Bane. I don't play against enough of them to really pick much up.

For one I would assume you don't exactly want to be next to him or am I wrong?
When I do try to zone him he'll go for the charge. Assuming I dont hit him out and I block, there is no way to punish him.
I love cross-ups, but Bane says fuck that shit. In fact, he says fuck all your jumping with that AA that seems to knock me out of anything and everything.
Venom mode - can't knock him out of anything, especially if he charges me.
 
I have huge problems with Bane. I don't play against enough of them to really pick much up.

For one I would assume you don't exactly want to be next to him or am I wrong?
When I do try to zone him he'll go for the charge. Assuming I dont hit him out and I block, there is no way to punish him.
I love cross-ups, but Bane says fuck that shit. In fact, he says fuck all your jumping with that AA that seems to knock me out of anything and everything.
Venom mode - can't knock him out of anything, especially if he charges me.
The main objective of batman in this MU is just stay back and zone with batarangs and trait. B/c he can only be immune to charge when in level 3. If he does charge at that point, mb the bats and double jump and punish him. Even when in venom, chip damage does not get reduced. So sit back and chip away and punish him when he gets reckless enough to charge in with full screen charge or even mid screen. However if you get knocked down, at that point you just gotta make your next guess right. Otherwise you will lose an entire health bar. Remember if he tries to do any tick throws like d2 into command grab, or b2 xx command grab. You can jump before his grabs can get you. Don't try to do any trait cancels mid combo b/c he will armor through it if you try to continue pressure.
 
Forgive me but I dont understand what you mean by meter burn the bats?
when you throw the batarangs, if you have a bar of meter you press the right trigger (xbox) or R2 (ps3) and the batarangs will blow up and put batman instantly back to neutral so that you can jump or block instantly