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Video/Tutorial - Raiden Aris MKX preconceptions Volume 2: Lord Raiden

WakeUp DP

WakeUp DP

GT MK OshTekk.
Our FGC friend, Aris from Avoiding the Puddle has put together yet another great video covering Raiden's recent Mortal Kombat X reveal. The primary focus of this video is in two parts: He loves the idea of the three variations, while he also has concerns of each character feeling like a 'complete' character.

Aris played Raiden in Mortal Kombat 9 and loves his new design. He expresses very legitimate concerns while also throwing out the very exciting possibility of this being the end of counter-picking?


edited/promoted by STORMS*
 

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chemist4hire

chemist4hire

I Got Guiled
Variation select does not seem that ground breaking to me. Its basically groove selecting from CVS games applied to move sets instead of just to system mechanics like movement blocking and meter building. I was a big fan of grooves, when capcom moved away from with capcom fighting evolution you saw how locking in the characters to a certain play style really ruined the game.
 
KIllaByte

KIllaByte

PSN: playakid700. Local name: BFGC MonkeyBizness
Iconic ones are probably staying in every variation, as new spcial moves are being created to add in variations? probably..
 
Circus

Circus

Part-Time Kano Hostage
Aris has solid concerns but I think it won't be a problem in the game's future. From what we've seen so far it seems like a good bet that all characters will have 1 style specifically to deal with zoning.

Raiden's antizone naturally will have his teleport despite it sadly being a staple to his character. For other characters I don't think it'll make it seem like they're segmenting off characters into 3 parts and instead it'll feel like 3 different styles.
 
NoobHunter420

NoobHunter420

Scrub God Lord
Circus said:
Aris has solid concerns but I think it won't be a problem in the game's future. From what we've seen so far it seems like a good bet that all characters will have 1 style specifically to deal with zoning.

Raiden's antizone naturally will have his teleport despite it sadly being a staple to his character. For other characters I don't think it'll make it seem like they're segmenting off characters into 3 parts and instead it'll feel like 3 different styles.
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I remember boon saying that the styles weren't strictly as one for rush down or one for zoning and so on.
they are simple a different way of playing the character
 
John Grizzly

John Grizzly

The axe that clears the forest
I watched this yesterday. Aris' concerns are very valid. Each character needs to feel complete in each variation.

In Raiden's case, however, I highly doubt he won't have some sort of teleport in every variation. His displacement variation will simply have a more powerful teleport which can be combo'd off it, I'd wager. Think how Raiden's teleport works in MK9 minus the meter burn version. I'd imagine he'll have that in all variations.

The variation concept is awesome and I'm really hoping it's integrated properly. I can't imagine the testing that will be needed for this game, though. There will essentially be 72 characters as part of the default roster.
 
WakeUp DP

WakeUp DP

GT MK OshTekk.
At first I was confident but after hearing to what Aris said, I gotta admit that I'm a little worried now.
 
WakeUp DP

WakeUp DP

GT MK OshTekk.
Peckapowa said:
you want kung lao, reptile AND mileena back???? please don't tell me sonya too i might die.

i just hope kung lao isn't in this game and if he is he can't tp.
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KL wasn't that bad. Give him the teleport just make it more punishable but still useful to whiff punish and stuff.
Reptile is an interesting concept char, just think about what they could do with him?
Mileena is a classic,ofc I want her back and oh F.... Sonnya. We dont need her with Cassie Cage being a mix of JC and her.
 
NRF CharlieMurphy

NRF CharlieMurphy

Kindergarten Meta
MK Trickylizard said:
KL wasn't that bad. Give him the teleport just make it more punishable but still useful to whiff punish and stuff.
Reptile is an interesting concept char, just think about what they could do with him?
Mileena is a classic,ofc I want her back and oh F.... Sonnya. We dont need her with Cassie Cage being a mix of JC and her.
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KL was exceedingly horrid to fight.
 
Lukeweizer

Lukeweizer

Noob
chemist4hire said:
Variation select does not seem that ground breaking to me. Its basically groove selecting from CVS games applied to move sets instead of just to system mechanics like movement blocking and meter building. I was a big fan of grooves, when capcom moved away from with capcom fighting evolution you saw how locking in the characters to a certain play style really ruined the game.
Click to expand...
I'm not a pro, but I feel like Variation Selection could still suffer from counter-picking.

I pick Teleport Raiden and you pick Variation 1 Sub Zero. I win.
You switch to Variation 2 Sub Zero and I have to stick with Teleport Raiden because I won. You beat me.
I switch to Trap Raiden to counter-pick your Variation 2 Sub Zero and I win.
Match over. I'm the greatest player that ever lived.

The only problem I see Variation Selection fixing is having a version of your favorite character that can do better at some match-ups then the base version could. That way you don't have to go out of your comfort zone of your favorite character if you don't want. I'm sure there will still be counter-picks for variations of characters.
 
T

trufenix

bye felicia
There is absolutely no way for them to implement variations without people instantaneously feeling that they are incomplete. Scorpion without hellfire, Sub without clone, Raiden without teleport. Its only going to take one match up where a varation (or worse, all three variations) turns out to be utter shit against another character before people will cry foul and claim if their character was "complete" or had this string or that string across all variations the game would be better. We've already had posts and threads about an all in one mode or bringing back stance switch, this is only going to grow as we get more and more details about what each variation has or hasn't.

End of the day, people who want to commit to MKX need to accept that this game has (at this point) 72 characters in it, and some of those characters are going to suck. They are going to look like a good character, and play kind of similar to a good character, but inevitably be missing something that might make them worth using (competitively). Others are going to exist solely for counter picking and believe me, counter picking will be alive and well. 72 different ways to play the game? Count on it. I'm sure paolo and co weigh these realities daily and I only hope they are continually takings steps to mitigate it and not just waiting until crunch time or post release to try and do it all at once. At the very least, I hope boon was serious about taking blind variation select to heart and it will turn up in a new build sometime soon. That would go a long way.
 
T

trufenix

bye felicia
Lukeweizer said:
I'm not a pro, but I feel like Variation Selection could still suffer from counter-picking.

I pick Teleport Raiden and you pick Variation 1 Sub Zero. I win.
You switch to Variation 2 Sub Zero and I have to stick with Teleport Raiden because I won. You beat me.
I switch to Trap Raiden to counter-pick your Variation 2 Sub Zero and I win.
Match over. I'm the greatest player that ever lived.
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This is no different from counter picking in any other game. The good news is, even PL can't play all of his characters at maximum efficiency which is why he (and many others) frequently plays the counter pick card and loses. That said, if you've really put in the work to learn three different characters, even if they're all named Sub Zero, you deserve the win. That's what fighting games are about.
 
Mst

Mst

Noob
KIllaByte said:
Iconic ones are probably staying in every variation, as new spcial moves are being created to add in variations? probably..
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Looks to my like they take out one of the more "classic" moves of each returning Character and move it to a new version build around that move (Hellfire, Ice Clone, Teleport) while keeping the other "classic" moves as universals (Spear, Slide, Ice Ball, Superman...).
 
Fractured_Shadow

Fractured_Shadow

Really likes to throw things at you.
kabelfritz said:
it doesnt get much more iconic that raidens teleport though, and he seems to only have it in one
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They seemed to have improved upon his teleport though to justify an entire style revolving around it. You can clearly see diffrent ranges to the teleport as well as a delay + invisibility on EX.

I could see people getting upset if it was just Raiden minus all his new shit (bomb traps, electric combos) but at least in Raiden's case they seem to have buffed his teleport pretty extensivley.

Calling it now, Raiden will be top 5 due to what appeared to be a fast mid, a low, a decent overhead, 3 different teleport ranges, and for a bar he essentially gets an ice clone with his EX projectile.
 
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