General/Other - Sub-Zero 3 Variations of Sub-Zero discussion

[Braindead]

Grandmaster is going to be so dumb. 1. He can throw the clone 2. It stops projectiles 3. He can remote detonate it. Three good buffs to an already really good move.

Stops projectiles? Like Clone trades with projectiles?

 

[ryublaze]

Stops projectiles? Like Clone trades with projectiles?

yea it trades with projectiles. go to 1:05 here you'll see the clone break when D'vorah's bug projectile touches it

 

[Rathalos]

This also confirms my theory that Sub has 3 special moves until now.

Freeze, Slide and Polar Blast (new move) i was thinking it could be part of grand master, but doesn't seems like it.

Polar Blast is a detonating ice bomb that releases a fairly blast radius around sub, in grandmaster variatiom the Polar Blast becomes a ice detonator. Since two ices can't exist at same time, it explodes the clone at any given time.

Not sure if saw right, if you explode the clone on the correct timing and distance, the opponent will become frozen, if you do too early he is only caught by the ice radius of the clone but doesn't gets frozen.

I need to look in which video is this btw.

Ya it doesn't seem to be part of GM, since it shows Cryomancer do it in the B roll.

I think Paulo or someone who played it mentioned that an exploded clone doesn't freeze, it just gives significant advantage.

If it does anything outside of explode clones, it sure doesn't have much range.

 

[SaltShaker]

"SUB-ZERO:
- The special move 'Frozen Aura' in his Unbreakable variation allows Sub-Zero to absorb one or two hits without stun, etc. Enhanced version increases the amount of hits he can endure before it wears off. Visually the move encases him entirely in a thin layer of jagged ice."

^^ This sounds like it's gonna be a serious problem.

 

[Fractured_Shadow]

"SUB-ZERO:
- The special move 'Frozen Aura' in his Unbreakable variation allows Sub-Zero to absorb one or two hits without stun, etc. Enhanced version increases the amount of hits he can endure before it wears off. Visually the move encases him entirely in a thin layer of jagged ice."

^^ This sounds like it's gonna be a serious problem.

Depends on start up frames and active frames. It also depends on Sub Zero's mobility and pressure strings.

If he doesnt have any good chip strings or the start up is too long it could be a meh move... or if it disables the ability to block.

 

[LinKueiLegend]

Is there any good gameplay for Sub's Unbreakable variation?

 

[NoobHunter420]

what would you guys say is the most aggressive variation?
I always wanted to play an aggressive ice wielding dude

 

[Pterodactyl]

I'd assume the variation that gives you ice weapons and not the one that gives you ice shields, or the one that gives you more ice projectiles.

 

[PizzaMasta]

Cryomancer for me, can't get enough sick ass ice weapons with Subby.

 

[Imperium]

Cryomancer, if it does the damage I think it will, is going to be very difficult to deal with. Until we see what the BnB combos are for each form, it's hard to tell how good non-clone variations will be though. Hoping that each variation has good starter strings.

 

[ShaolinGunFu]

Cryomancer, if it does the damage I think it will, is going to be very difficult to deal with. Until we see what the BnB combos are for each form, it's hard to tell how good non-clone variations will be though. Hoping that each variation has good starter strings.

doesnt every variation have the same normals though? i thought the differences were only the extra special moves?

 

[PizzaMasta]

doesnt every variation have the same normals though? i thought the differences were only the extra special moves?

Nope, some variations such as Cryomancer, Ninjutsu for Scorpion or Shaolin for Kung Jin, add new strings too.

 

[Imperium]

doesnt every variation have the same normals though? i thought the differences were only the extra special moves?

Like PizzaMasta said, some characters have shown different strings. For Sub, I have noticed that in Cryomancer he gets a string that ends in an upwards sword slash. In other variations, he has a very similar looking string, but instead of a sword slash, it's an uppercut. Cryo may grant more damage or more range than other variations in that particular string, but they are similar at least functionally. As for starting strings though, I don't know if they are universal, but I know I've seen some decent ones.

 

[Andromeda]

So... does Sub-Zero have a good chance to be a very "pain in the ass" kind of character? Because I've always gained as Sub-Zero and do a good job knowing everything about him but I've always came across him being just someone that isn't going to be too much of a hassle for my opponent. After seeing that Sub-Zero's ice clone can literally stop projectiles, (as well as just throwing the whole thing at them) I'm starting to notice that he could be one annoying character to fight against...

Which I'll like because last time it was Scorpion.

 

[LinKueiLegend]

So... does Sub-Zero have a good chance to be a very "pain in the ass" kind of character? Because I've always gained as Sub-Zero and do a good job knowing everything about him but I've always came across him being just someone that isn't going to be too much of a hassle for my opponent. After seeing that Sub-Zero's ice clone can literally stop projectiles, (as well as just throwing the whole thing at them) I'm starting to notice that he could be one annoying character to fight against...

Which I'll like because last time it was Scorpion.

I believe he will be. His 3 variations do a great job targeting a certain type of playstyle. With Cryomancer being a rushdown, Grandmaster being a mix of in your face and defense when needed, and last but not least Unbreakable which looks like a great defensive turtle like playstyle I feel if the player knows how to play the variation he will be scary.

 

[NRF CharlieMurphy]

So... does Sub-Zero have a good chance to be a very "pain in the ass" kind of character? Because I've always gained as Sub-Zero and do a good job knowing everything about him but I've always came across him being just someone that isn't going to be too much of a hassle for my opponent. After seeing that Sub-Zero's ice clone can literally stop projectiles, (as well as just throwing the whole thing at them) I'm starting to notice that he could be one annoying character to fight against...

Which I'll like because last time it was Scorpion.

It'll boil down to his frames

We can assume alot based upon what we've seen.
We KNOW his ex ice ball absorbs a single projectile and continues. We know the ice clone absorbs projectiles now but can't be done in the air.

We know the parry work universally (for now).

To me... he sounds like a projectile based variations nightmare. He may only have 2 universal skills ..... but they are very powerful.

 

[Barrogh]

It'll boil down to his frames.

Pretty much this. It will make a difference between clone being big "fuck you" towards projectile users and projectiles being major "fuck you" towards GM Sub.
...I think we already have character(s) with double hitting projectiles. Prepare to slide under those when your clone's up

 

[kabelfritz]

so ice clone can be punished now

 

[Barrogh]

so ice clone can be punished now

I'm pretty sure it was always the case depending on what it was cancelled from. Nobody used crap options during pressure though ofc.

 

[Desperdicio]

Special moves present in every variation (or at least two of them):

Ice Burst: db1
Ice Ball: df2 (different from MK9)
Slide: bf4 (remains the same)

Grandmaster specific:

Ice Klone: db2 (different from MK9)
Klone Toss: df1 (brand new)

I'm wondering how NRS are going to balance all these characters and their different versions, considering the ton of matchups that need to be investigated for balance. The patching phase after the game is released is going to be rather interesting.

I think their idea was not having to patch anything. Should they make patches, if there's a sequel in a few years, we will have the same boring one variation characters as always.

Okay, whew--only one I haven't been able to catch so far.

So where's the "opponent can throw the clone" rumor is coming from?

For SZ's clone, I'm guessing it works like an interactable object that just favors SZ: he can walk through it, attack through it, or throw it. The opponent can throw it with the interactable button, but if the opponent touches it in moving or using any other button, he gets frozen. Also, I think that if the opponent tries to throw it, SZ can use his ground pound to detonate it for free damage and knockdown.

Klone Toss has a command of its own, so there's no throwing it with the interactable button.

 

[Knoterror]

so ice clone can be punished now

I don't know what you're talking about. Ice clone could always be punished by many, many things.

 

[STB Sgt Reed]

I don't like how you can't air clone... =/

 

[Ninja_of_death]

I don't like how you can't air clone... =/

They might change that u never no

 

[STB Sgt Reed]

They might change that u never no

It was so good at allowing sub zero to avoid shit while in the air and also... jump kick clone <3

And for catching all those kitanas that like to try to ass out of the corner. Hilarious to watch them fly helplessly right into it. haha

 

[Ninja_of_death]

It was so good at allowing sub zero to avoid shit while in the air and also... jump kick clone <3

And for catching all those kitanas that like to try to ass out of the corner. Hilarious to watch them fly helplessly right into it. haha

ikr