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Why I feel NW should be able to make top 8

Can NW really make top 8?

  • Yes

    Votes: 55 74.3%
  • No

    Votes: 19 25.7%

  • Total voters
    74

Relaxedstate

PTH|RM Relaxedstate
I had to scratch the NW forum itch...it's just been too long.

Cyborg 3-7
Isn't it obvious how bad this is? Iafb and gfb zoning own him. Cyborg can use his pressure to gain space as well up close making everything a guess and a risk for NW? Interactables are stupid. Escrima

Zod 4-6
My most common MU. Interactables destroy NW here and make the damage game weight heavy in zods favor. Zoning isn't really the issue...in fact if zod only zones without Interactables or trait mixups, NW can win the zoning war. Rare though. I also find myself back in staff for much of the match stuffing his wakeups.
Actually, Murk and I have discovered a little while ago that from the medium range, IaZbs completely paralyze NW. I think your only option is a risky MB-spark to trade favorably or walk/duck. You will be hit out of any dash, jump, or move. This lets me build trait time and get free trait. NW can counter zone from full screen quite effectively though. IT is probably a 3-7 all the time, but especially so on stages with free interactables.

We should play soon!
 

AK L0rdoftheFLY

I hatelove this game
Actually, Murk and I have discovered a little while ago that from the medium range, IaZbs completely paralyze NW. I think your only option is a risky MB-spark to trade favorably or walk/duck. You will be hit out of any dash, jump, or move. This lets me build trait time and get free trait. NW can counter zone from full screen quite effectively though. IT is probably a 3-7 all the time, but especially so on stages with free interactables.

We should play soon!
yes we should...i recently had a great set against pig (if 3-4 weeks ago is recent) and I was able to get momentum by keeping him from starting his iazb...If I am preemptive in my ground pounds and ground sparks, I can make starting this difficult. Your probably right though.

yes we do need to play very soon. I'm thinking of braving online in the coming weeks for KIT so I'll let you know.
 

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
yes we should...i recently had a great set against pig (if 3-4 weeks ago is recent) and I was able to get momentum by keeping him from starting his iazb...If I am preemptive in my ground pounds and ground sparks, I can make starting this difficult. Your probably right though.

yes we do need to play very soon. I'm thinking of braving online in the coming weeks for KIT so I'll let you know.
whens the new ktf uploaded

*I recently

You're*
 

Awkward Sloth

Lamest Harley, still better sloth than Jer
The fuck are you talking about? The op says "her 50-50 are hard to react to" and I have it at 4-6.

I said its my opinion and I stated a few reasons that for me make it that way.

You came in here talking about how you should never be hit by any of her mixups. If there is any false information here, it came from you.

And by the way, you don't have to like anythjng I say...but you literally are up in arms about two sentences? Come on man. God damn this is the worst example of not letting anyone talk about your character but you. Get over yourself. Plus even Saltface agrees with me.
The mix up you are talking about is a jumping attack into air gun shot for a double over head or jump attack into b2. How you deal with that mix up.
-when your character is standing in a neutral state. Air to air her, use your best anti air, block the jump attack and push block. There's no mix up after the push block.
And say you have no meter and can't push block you block the jump attack then block low. In that way the worst thing that can happen if they do air gunshots after is take 4 or 9% damage if they meter burned it. If the Harley player decides to be ballsy and does her f2 cause you're still blocking low then you d1 outta it for a full combo. If the Harley goes jump attack into b2 because you're blocking low you get pushed back a little and are at neutral.

When did I ever say you will never get hit by her mix up? Of course you're gonna a get hit by if you don't know what to do against her. And there is always human error. You admitted yourself in this thread that you've only played Saltface 3-4 times since the game has been out. So wouldn't having limited experience in the match up make your opinion on the MU not up to standards? I'd take your opinion on the MU more seriously after you get in tons of casuals with Saltface. Which you can do now and I look forward to.

And I'll "get over myself" when you get over the fact that Nightwing is a good character with subpar players to represent him who have had very little success with Nightwing in tournies. There's like 5 big name Nightwings going to KIT prove me wrong that it's not the players holding Nightwing back. Hell I even sponsored Murk for Clark's online tourney cause I wanted to be proven wrong. Please prove me wrong. And I'll hold that shit forever.
 

BigMilk

Former Divine Power Abuser
At this point in fighting games match up charts don't really matter its the skill and experience...nightwing vs batgirl or MMH may be 5-5 on paper but if u are fighting against sonic fox or jupiter its 7-3 or 6-4 in their favour IMO
What people fail to realize is that they never mattered
 

AK L0rdoftheFLY

I hatelove this game
The mix up you are talking about is a jumping attack into air gun shot for a double over head or jump attack into b2. How you deal with that mix up.
-when your character is standing in a neutral state. Air to air her, use your best anti air, block the jump attack and push block. There's no mix up after the push block.
And say you have no meter and can't push block you block the jump attack then block low. In that way the worst thing that can happen if they do air gunshots after is take 4 or 9% damage if they meter burned it. If the Harley player decides to be ballsy and does her f2 cause you're still blocking low then you d1 outta it for a full combo. If the Harley goes jump attack into b2 because you're blocking low you get pushed back a little and are at neutral.

When did I ever say you will never get hit by her mix up? Of course you're gonna a get hit by if you don't know what to do against her. And there is always human error. You admitted yourself in this thread that you've only played Saltface 3-4 times since the game has been out. So wouldn't having limited experience in the match up make your opinion on the MU not up to standards? I'd take your opinion on the MU more seriously after you get in tons of casuals with Saltface. Which you can do now and I look forward to.

And I'll "get over myself" when you get over the fact that Nightwing is a good character with subpar players to represent him who have had very little success with Nightwing in tournies. There's like 5 big name Nightwings going to KIT prove me wrong that it's not the players holding Nightwing back. Hell I even sponsored Murk for Clark's online tourney cause I wanted to be proven wrong. Please prove me wrong. And I'll hold that shit forever.
See...i'm not talking about any mixup in particular. You and salt face are talking about that one instance. I'm speaking purely in generalities.

I read your counters to her jump in and I know all of that already. Everything has a counter. That doesn't mean it can't open you up. We agree on that part. Again all I ever said was that conditioning makes her 50/50s better and that they can catch you. Thats it...do you disagree with that?

I agree that NW is a good character dipshit...read the title of the thread. I have always said he was good and I also agree that subpar players are using him. Where have you been since I started playing?

Stop pretending like Harley is some big mystery that nobody can figure out. I can't watch satlface' play and see how other counter her? I can't play other harleys to get MU exp? I can't play her in practice mode and test out her mixups? God damnit I feel like I'm talking to a wall.

We obviously agree more than you think we do.

highlights:
-She can open you up with conditioning
-NW is good
-We have subpar representation (NW players suck donkey balls)
-We have a chance at KIT to make top 8 (see title)
 

Awkward Sloth

Lamest Harley, still better sloth than Jer
See...i'm not talking about any mixup in particular. You and salt face are talking about that one instance. I'm speaking purely in generalities.

I read your counters to her jump in and I know all of that already. Everything has a counter. That doesn't mean it can't open you up. We agree on that part. Again all I ever said was that conditioning makes her 50/50s better and that they can catch you. Thats it...do you disagree with that?

I agree that NW is a good character dipshit...read the title of the thread. I have always said he was good and I also agree that subpar players are using him. Where have you been since I started playing?

Stop pretending like Harley is some big mystery that nobody can figure out. I can't watch satlface' play and see how other counter her? I can't play other harleys to get MU exp? I can't play her in practice mode and test out her mixups? God damnit I feel like I'm talking to a wall.

We obviously agree more than you think we do.

highlights:
-She can open you up with conditioning
-NW is good
-We have subpar representation (NW players suck donkey balls)
-We have a chance at KIT to make top 8 (see title)
First off don't throw your petty insults at me when I'm agreeing with you about the character. What does that accomplish? That I'm wrong for agreeing with you?

I disagree that her mix ups are hard to react to even with conditioning. And they aren't that great.

Yes all Nightwing players are subpar including yourself agreed.

I've never said that Harley is a great mystery. She's super basic and honest. A lotta people figured out counters to her because she peaked early on in the game. When you lose to Harley you lost because you were out played not because she is good. If you had really gotten legit experience you wouldn't be saying her conditioning

Can Nightwing make top ? Maybe it's a big maybe though. We agree on some things but not everything. See how easy it is to not act like a grade schooler and throw insults cause I have a different opinion on something's. :/
 

AK L0rdoftheFLY

I hatelove this game
First off don't throw your petty insults at me when I'm agreeing with you about the character. What does that accomplish? That I'm wrong for agreeing with you?

I disagree that her mix ups are hard to react to even with conditioning. And they aren't that great.

Yes all Nightwing players are subpar including yourself agreed.

I've never said that Harley is a great mystery. She's super basic and honest. A lotta people figured out counters to her because she peaked early on in the game. When you lose to Harley you lost because you were out played not because she is good. If you had really gotten legit experience you wouldn't be saying her conditioning

Can Nightwing make top ? Maybe it's a big maybe though. We agree on some things but not everything. See how easy it is to not act like a grade schooler and throw insults cause I have a different opinion on something's. :/
Your upset at dipshit? I can't...I'm done. If you were insulted by that, that's on you.

Every time you post, you change my words in order to disagree with them. we are saying same thing but thank you for repeating it and calling me a shitty player.

You're a much better person than I am on the inside. I am an eighth grade asshole and you are much more sophisticated than me.

God this is the dumbest argument of all time.
 

Bugman

Noob
Yea I want a o know what scorpian mains think about this. Scorpian is so random it might be possible?
It not 7-3 NW favor it at least 6-4 NW favor. Scorpion don't got that much in answer against NW but he can reaction pretty good when NW is on stuff stance in disticts. (I'm not on the computer typing this I'm on the game.)
 

BillStickers

Do not touch me again.
Just personally I think that Harley struggles vs. jumpback (or jumpback~kick)~(mb)wingdings and that the up-close game is pretty irrelevant. NW's game plan in the Harley MU is to run away, and he has plenty of options to do so.

I've had this MU waver between 4-6 to 5-5 to 6-4 in my head, so I guess 5-5 would be more accurate. Tool-wise, I don't see how Harley could beat NW on the same level as, say, Zod, who is superior to Harley in every respect.
 

AK L0rdoftheFLY

I hatelove this game
Just personally I think that Harley struggles vs. jumpback (or jumpback~kick)~(mb)wingdings and that the up-close game is pretty irrelevant. NW's game plan in the Harley MU is to run away, and he has plenty of options to do so.

I've had this MU waver between 4-6 to 5-5 to 6-4 in my head, so I guess 5-5 would be more accurate. Tool-wise, I don't see how Harley could beat NW on the same level as, say, Zod, who is superior to Harley in every respect.
So this is what an intelligent post looks like? I agree with the second paragraph more than anything.
 

coolwhip

Noob
Like only nightwolf though? He didn't have a couterpick like kabal or something? Not discrediting that he did it just curious
Nah. Big D had two mains: NightWolf and Ermac, and I'm pretty sure he went all Nigthwolf at Final Round 2012. I only ever recall him picking a top tier character once, at MLG Dallas 2012 against Pig when he went Kung Lao.