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General/Other Snake-Oil Smoke Bombs: What I Would Trade the Reset for and Why

G4S KT

Gaming4Satan Founder
PREFACE: At launch, I thought resets were bullshit. And then I met Maxter...

...

I've been trying to explain that reset combos (for ANY character) do not dramatically affect the meta-game since WELL before Smoke's true reset was even discovered. Few people have been able to wrap their heads around why.

So, I've decided to take a different approach. Here is a list of things that if Smoke had INSTEAD OF reset combos, his meta-game would be equally good OR BETTER than it is now.

The kicker is, that if Smoke had these things from launch, or were patched in, no one would have anything to say and some would likely go unnoticed by those not in the Smoke community.

NOTE: I do not mean he needs all of these instead of the reset. I mean if he had ANY ONE OF THESE INSTEAD OF THE RESET.

If I had the choice, I would trade the reset combos for ANY ONE of these in a heart beat. Enjoy.


Snake-Oil Smoke Bombs: What I Would Trade the Reset For

- a 7-8 frame uppercut

- a low hit box

- A standing reset combo ender (Such as Kabal f4 or Sonya 112)

- Armor on EX teleport punch (can still be unsafe)
OR
- EX teleport punch is safe or advantage on block

- ANY sort of attack (special or normal) that gives advantage on block

- ANY sort of attack that on hit grants a jump in/follow up pressure

- EX smoke drift loses it's vulnerable start up and is invincible immediately upon input

- A slight speed up of his standing normals across the board (2, 3 frames at most)

- a true projectile of any sort, regardless of how shitty (think raiden's energy ball)
OR
- any kind of offensive zoning tool (think freddy claw, kenshi sword drop)

- a dive kick of any sort (kano ball, KL, Sonya, or Subz)

- any sort of fast advancing special, doesn't have to be safe on block.

- a low hit anywhere in his strings



DISCLAIMER: THIS IS NOT A CALL FOR BUFFS OR THINGS I WANT WHEN/IF THE RESET IS PATCHED OUT. THESE ARE SIMPLY EXAMPLES OF THINGS THAT FROM A META-GAME STAND POINT ARE JUST AS GOOD, IF NOT BETTER, THAN HAVING A RESET COMBO AND NO ONE WOULD COMPLAIN ABOUT THEM.
 

1man3letters

Alpha Tarkatan - Moderator
Moderator
but the resets were glitches, why should smoke get something for a glitch being removed?

i know this is not a thread of "oh hes gonna lose his reset so give him this instead" but it should of never been there in the 1st place,same with jax and cyrax

also speed up his normals?!? b2,3? are you mad? its already the best overhead starter string in the game.
i dont think smoke "needs" anything on the list really,he already does very well in the tournies thanks to yourself and cd jr. hes fine how he is,(minus the resets)
 

G4S KT

Gaming4Satan Founder
but the resets were glitches, why should smoke get something for a glitch being removed?

i know this is not a thread of "oh hes gonna lose his reset so give him this instead" but it should of never been there in the 1st place,same with jax and cyrax

also speed up his normals?!? b2,3? are you mad? its already the best overhead starter string in the game.
i dont think smoke "needs" anything on the list really,he already does very well in the tournies thanks to yourself and cd jr. hes fine how he is,(minus the resets)
you have ENTIRELY missed the point of this thread.
 

1man3letters

Alpha Tarkatan - Moderator
Moderator
Exactly, hence why saying it's the "fastest overhead" in the game is pointless. It's just a standard 15 frame combo starter because no one blocks low against smoke.
its also one of the better footsie and whiff punishing tools in the game so its not the case of block high and b23 will never hit
 

Lt. Boxy Angelman

I WILL EAT THIS GAME
FUCKING EXACTLY. Nobody would have said shit if Smoke had been built with a low hit box from launch.
He would've been #2 behind pre-patch Lao. Jesus H. Christmas.

I still wish he had the harpoon. Can't give him the Tele-Uppercut since they revived Sektor, but let's say they limited the juggle properties off of a Smoke Bomb so it wasn't completely OP for him to have both, it coulda worked.

*still misses Cyber Smoke :( *

THEY HAD GREY CYBORGS IN STORY MODE FFS. GIVE US THE LAST ROBOT.
 

GNG Iniquity

#bufftaquito #punchwalk #whiffycage
The resets are unintended, they're only still in the game due to NRS' inability to fix them; having said that I feel that Cyrax and Smoke are extremely good characters regardless of the resets. Cyrax especially. 30% unblockable bomb trap setups that nobody uses anymore because of the net and a dream. Ultimately, I feel that resets make people lazy and people simply use them as a crutch as opposed to exploring their characters meta game. I realize that you don't do this with Smoke, but a lot of people do.
 
Why do people keep trying to rationalize massive damage exploits?

Sure if you traded them for something else he might be better...tell that to the bottom half of the cast who can't keep up with the top 4/5 characters.

I'm not blowing you up kt I think you are a cool dude but a reset is a reset is a reset. The shit sucks and it feels hollow and cheap when it is done to you.

I'm sure Cyrax would give up resets for a low starter but that doesn't make his resets anymore needed.
Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk
 

G4S KT

Gaming4Satan Founder
Saying "but they're glitches and they shouldn't be there in the first place" is missing the point. They ARE there and instead of looking at them as glitches you need to look at how they factor into the metagame.

The point of this thread:

People flip a shit about reset combos.

There are things that, when applied to a character instead of reset combos, are BETTER than reset combos. These things people WOULD NOT flip a shit about.


THAT IS THE POINT OF THIS THREAD, TO POINT THAT OUT. That's all.
 

G4S KT

Gaming4Satan Founder
Why do people keep trying to rationalize massive damage exploits?

Sure if you traded them for something else he might be better...tell that to the bottom half of the cast who can't keep up with the top 4/5 characters.

I'm not blowing you up kt I think you are a cool dude but a reset is a reset is a reset. The shit sucks and it feels hollow and cheap when it is done to you.

I'm sure Cyrax would give up resets for a low starter but that doesn't make his resets anymore needed.
Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk
would you trade force balls for a 75% reset combo? If so, you can have mine lol
 

GNG Iniquity

#bufftaquito #punchwalk #whiffycage
What's the point of trying to bargain for something else other than the resets though? If they were removed, I still feel that Cyrax and Smoke would be great characters. You guys act like these characters are absolute garbage without their resets. Quan is absolute garbage without his rune trap, which does 16% per bar. Not 60-100%.

You want a reasonable amount of damage per reset? Fine, I'm okay with that. 60-100% is bullshit though. Cyrax already gets 50% off 1 bar which is totally reasonable imo.
 
would you trade force balls for a 75% reset combo? If so, you can have mine lol
No, because I don't use resets...so it would be useless to me. Whether or not he'd be better with something else is irrelevant. He does have the resets. We do have to deal with them in the meta game. They are ridiculous. Just because he isn't the top character doesn't mean he needs 100% resets no matter how hard they are to do.

Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk
 

G4S KT

Gaming4Satan Founder
What's the point of trying to bargain for something else other than the resets though? If they were removed, I still feel that Cyrax and Smoke would be great characters. You guys act like these characters are absolute garbage without their resets. Quan is absolute garbage without his rune trap, which does 16% per bar. Not 60-100%.

You want a reasonable amount of damage per reset? Fine, I'm okay with that. 60-100% is bullshit though.
Again, I'M NOT TRYING TO BARGAIN ANYTHING

The point of this thread:

People flip a shit about reset combos.

There are things that, when applied to a character instead of reset combos, are BETTER than reset combos. These things people WOULD NOT flip a shit about.